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Author Topic:   Creation Science In Schools: Give Us A Lesson Plan
Quetzal
Member (Idle past 5872 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 16 of 48 (67418)
11-18-2003 2:16 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by keith63
11-18-2003 2:03 PM


keith: Do me two favors, please.
1. Give the "argument from quote mine" a rest. Nobody's interested in playing that game here. Even on the thread Moose closed, it is highly unlikely I would have responded to your massive cut-and-paste of spurious quotations which were either out-of-context, out-of-date, unverifiable, secondary or tertiary sources, or simply wrong in light of current science. How it works here is: YOU develop an argument. Provide verifiable citations in support of your argument. Then respond directly to refutations or discussion of your argument by addressing the points/counterpoints/questions raised by your respondants.
2. Take your fossil argument to an appropriate thread, or open a new topic. My suggestion would be open a new topic in the Evolution forum. However, you're still going to need to develop a specific argument that doesn't rely exclusively on quotations or someone elses' essay.
Thanks.

This message is a reply to:
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Rei
Member (Idle past 7013 days)
Posts: 1546
From: Iowa City, IA
Joined: 09-03-2003


Message 17 of 48 (67419)
11-18-2003 2:17 PM


Heh, thanks everyone. It was pretty easy, I just did a quick google search of EVC for random keywords, and looked at what YECs were arguing with
------------------
"Illuminant light,
illuminate me."

  
Brian
Member (Idle past 4959 days)
Posts: 4659
From: Scotland
Joined: 10-22-2002


Message 18 of 48 (67424)
11-18-2003 2:32 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by keith63
11-18-2003 2:03 PM


Hi,
I think what Dan was asking for was a lesson plan on what and how teachers would teach Creationism in science classes.
Now, as any teacher knows, every lesson plan needs its aims and objectives, perhaps you could present a small unit of six lessons complete with aims and objectives of each lesson?
I really do not think that concentrating on trying to discredit evolution automatically makes creation true, all this does is show your bias against evolution.
What you would need to do is produce some lessons, including some practical work of course, that gives support to creation, how you are going to recreate creatio ex nihili in a science lab I have no idea.
But this is exaclty what you are expecting kids to swallow, what would you say if one asks' Excuse me sir, how do you get something from nothing?' Would you say 'God can do anything?', this is not science, it is philosophy/theology and is taught in every school in the UK.
If you think it would be difficult to teach creatio ex nihili without a class of students wetting themselves laughing, you should try teaching the Judeo/Xian creation myth to 30 x 14 year olds in a compulsory Religious Education lesson in Scotland.
Brian.

This message is a reply to:
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keith63
Inactive Member


Message 19 of 48 (67432)
11-18-2003 2:45 PM
Reply to: Message 15 by Rei
11-18-2003 2:15 PM


Sounds like a fancy way of avoiding the issue. I would like to know how this is considered a bogus list. I have read many of these books and I think these scientists are working at major universities. Dr. David Menton works in St. Louis at Washington University in their Anatomy department. One of my colleagues had him as an instructor. I still don't know why evolutionists seem to be so scared of intelligent design? They always attempt to prevent it from being mentioned in the classroom.

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Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by Loudmouth, posted 11-18-2003 3:05 PM keith63 has replied
 Message 24 by PaulK, posted 11-18-2003 3:33 PM keith63 has replied

  
Loudmouth
Inactive Member


Message 20 of 48 (67441)
11-18-2003 3:05 PM
Reply to: Message 19 by keith63
11-18-2003 2:45 PM


Sounds like a fancy way of avoiding the issue. I would like to know how this is considered a bogus list. I have read many of these books and I think these scientists are working at major universities. Dr. David Menton works in St. Louis at Washington University in their Anatomy department. One of my colleagues had him as an instructor. I still don't know why evolutionists seem to be so scared of intelligent design? They always attempt to prevent it from being mentioned in the classroom.
We (ie us evos) would gladly talk about your topic of discussion, but it would be more appropriate in a separate thread. Read the original post (post#1) and judge for yourself how well your post adds to the discussion. In fact, I will gladly be the first respondent, if I happen to beat everyone else to it. Threads do tend to wander a bit on this site (I am as guilty as any) but your post was a totaly divergence. Again, feel free to start a new thread and add a little of your own commentary in addition to the large amount of cut and paste.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by keith63, posted 11-18-2003 2:45 PM keith63 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by Rei, posted 11-18-2003 3:19 PM Loudmouth has not replied
 Message 23 by keith63, posted 11-18-2003 3:30 PM Loudmouth has not replied

  
Rei
Member (Idle past 7013 days)
Posts: 1546
From: Iowa City, IA
Joined: 09-03-2003


Message 21 of 48 (67450)
11-18-2003 3:19 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by Loudmouth
11-18-2003 3:05 PM


New Thread
New thread started over in Is It Science: Are Scientists Abandoning Evolution?
------------------
"Illuminant light,
illuminate me."
[This message has been edited by Rei, 11-18-2003]

This message is a reply to:
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Loudmouth
Inactive Member


Message 22 of 48 (67452)
11-18-2003 3:25 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by Brad McFall
11-18-2003 1:51 PM


Re: subtext
******if you want to move LOUDMOUTH's questions to a new thread, I'll be happy to dicontinue posting in this one haveing said two dimes worth and respond to the substance in that error exception throw forward if you want.
I have done just that. I felt a little guilty for getting things somewhat off topic. It is in the Evolution forum under Dinstinguishing Baramins.

This message is a reply to:
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keith63
Inactive Member


Message 23 of 48 (67455)
11-18-2003 3:30 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by Loudmouth
11-18-2003 3:05 PM


Point taken. I was simply replying to another point and got off the subject.

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PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 24 of 48 (67459)
11-18-2003 3:33 PM
Reply to: Message 19 by keith63
11-18-2003 2:45 PM


ID doesn't have anything worthy of being taught in the classroom That's why they've retreated to trying to censor the evidence for evolution.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by keith63, posted 11-18-2003 2:45 PM keith63 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 25 by keith63, posted 11-18-2003 3:56 PM PaulK has replied

  
keith63
Inactive Member


Message 25 of 48 (67467)
11-18-2003 3:56 PM
Reply to: Message 24 by PaulK
11-18-2003 3:33 PM


That's your opinion. More than 80% of the public sampled seem to think otherwise. Scientist are the only population which seems to think that evolution is the only true alternative and they seem to have a religious agenda.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 24 by PaulK, posted 11-18-2003 3:33 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by crashfrog, posted 11-18-2003 4:05 PM keith63 has replied
 Message 27 by Loudmouth, posted 11-18-2003 4:09 PM keith63 has replied
 Message 29 by PaulK, posted 11-18-2003 4:29 PM keith63 has not replied
 Message 31 by Rei, posted 11-18-2003 4:34 PM keith63 has not replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1467 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 26 of 48 (67472)
11-18-2003 4:05 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by keith63
11-18-2003 3:56 PM


Scientist are the only population which seems to think that evolution is the only true alternative
Given that they're the only ones in a position to actually collect and analyze the data, don't you think that says something?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by keith63, posted 11-18-2003 3:56 PM keith63 has replied

Replies to this message:
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Loudmouth
Inactive Member


Message 27 of 48 (67476)
11-18-2003 4:09 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by keith63
11-18-2003 3:56 PM


That's your opinion. More than 80% of the public sampled seem to think otherwise. Scientist are the only population which seems to think that evolution is the only true alternative and they seem to have a religious agenda.
If 80% of the population thought African Americans were less human than whites, should we have kept segragation? In science, there isn't a vote on what the truth is, truth is dependent upon the evidence. If 80% of the population said there wasn't a god, would you stop going to church? I would hope not. Majority of the Masses is a dangerous example to follow.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by keith63, posted 11-18-2003 3:56 PM keith63 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 28 by keith63, posted 11-18-2003 4:21 PM Loudmouth has replied

  
keith63
Inactive Member


Message 28 of 48 (67482)
11-18-2003 4:21 PM
Reply to: Message 27 by Loudmouth
11-18-2003 4:09 PM


Funny you should mention that because that is the problem we get with evolution. Darwin thought that Blacks were inferior to whites, he also thought women were inferior to men. Hitler was an evolutionist and look what he did to the Jews and homosexuals. And there is a movement among scientists against the theory of evolution. If there was not then we would have issues comming up like Kansas, Ohio and Texas. In 100 years we will probably be laughed at for thinking that all this complexity happened by chance. The theory of evolution will be placed in its rightful place with spontaneous generation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 27 by Loudmouth, posted 11-18-2003 4:09 PM Loudmouth has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 30 by Dan Carroll, posted 11-18-2003 4:32 PM keith63 has not replied
 Message 33 by Loudmouth, posted 11-18-2003 4:36 PM keith63 has not replied
 Message 34 by Rei, posted 11-18-2003 4:40 PM keith63 has not replied
 Message 37 by :æ:, posted 11-18-2003 4:48 PM keith63 has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 29 of 48 (67483)
11-18-2003 4:29 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by keith63
11-18-2003 3:56 PM


So what does ID have tha you believe IS worth being taught ? You should be putting forward a lesson plan based on that.
And please remember to explain why, if scientists have a "religious agenda" Christian scientists like Kenneth Miller (yes, the co-author of the Miller and Levine text book) are strong opponetns of ID.

This message is a reply to:
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Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 30 of 48 (67484)
11-18-2003 4:32 PM
Reply to: Message 28 by keith63
11-18-2003 4:21 PM


quote:
Hitler was an evolutionist and look what he did to the Jews and homosexuals.
And look at how the church cheered him on.
quote:
And there is a movement among scientists against the theory of evolution.
For the love a' crimney... don't make Rei whip out the link for a third time today.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 28 by keith63, posted 11-18-2003 4:21 PM keith63 has not replied

  
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