Creator of God, Big Bang

Hi Vacate,Breath taking Avatar Everything coming from one energy makes more sense to me that everything coming from a point in space-time. When space-time did not exist as it was created in the big bang.Just a thought. Vacate I thought lightning helped provide our daily need of the element nitrogen. Nitrogen is the third most abundant element in the human body, and it must be renewed continually.It has been so long since I thought about lightning I may be mistaken.Have fun,

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"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

What "makes sense" to you is irrelevant. General relativity doesn't "make sense" unless you study it for years, and not always even then. Nature is not required to work in a way intuitive to the human mind. This is just another version of the Argument from Incredulity. First: that doesn't really have anything at all to do with the fact that lightning is undirected.Second: you are mistaken. Take a look at the Nitrogen Cycle.Lightning does produce Nitrogen Oxide (not Nitrogen - lightning doesn't cause nuclear transmutation!), but it's a rather insignificant portion of the cycle.

quote:

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Nitrogen in the air becomes a part of biological matter mostly through the actions of bacteria and algae in a process known as nitrogen fixation. Legume plants such as clover, alfalfa, and soybeans form nodules on the roots where nitrogen fixing bacteria take nitrogen from the air and convert it into ammonia, NH3. The ammonia is further converted by other bacteria first into nitrite ions, NO2-, and then into nitrate ions, NO3-. Plants utilize the nitrate ions as a nutrient or fertilizer for growth. Nitrogen is incorporate in many amino acids which are further reacted to make proteins.

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When you know you're going to wake up in three days, dying is not a sacrifice. It's a painful inconvenience.

Hi Rahvin,I am disappointed you did not continue our discussion. That is what I tell people about God but they don't believe me either. The first paragraph from your source. I was pretty close having not read anything about it in ove 40 years.
Lightning does have a purpose.Have fun,

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"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

Cavediver began to reply to your Singularity/Big Bang statements. I think I have a decent grasp of the concepts for a layperson, but Cavediver is not a layperson. When he/she speaks on this topic, I'll listen. I suggest you do the same. Didn't you just say that God (or "one energy," whatever that means) makes "more sense" to you than Big Bang cosmology?Besides that, we're talking about apples and oranges. General relativity has actual evidence and mathematics to support itself. God has nothing. First: Lightning still does not create Nitrogen. It forms Nitrogen Oxide, which is very, VERY different from saying Lightning produces Nitrogen.Second: "Purpose" is not a good term. It has no more "purpose" than a rock tumbling downhill, or rain, or an earthquake. I'm sure you attribute all of this to your god's "plan," but this is both off topic and not borne out by the evidence unless your god is compeltely insane.Third: The original quetion on this subject was whether lightning is "directed." It is most certainly not, and is an example of chaotic behavior. (tesla's inability to define the words "chaos" or "order" in any useful way notwithstanding)

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When you know you're going to wake up in three days, dying is not a sacrifice. It's a painful inconvenience.

There is nothing more I will write given that you cannot be bothered to read my whole post. Good day.

Thank you. That is Mt. Rainier just this last summer, that was a great moment in a holiday full of great moments. I am following you and Cavediver discussing this in the other thread. Hes correct... I just have thoughts! I do not see why one energy is any different than "something coming from nothing", as I said to Tesla - in 15 billion years will there be twice as much energy as there is currently? Where did all that energy come from? Nothing?I find it confusing that people would object to everything coming from a singularity, but accept everything coming from a singular. I see Rhavin has explained about lightning, I would like to reply however about the purpose. You could argue that lightning was only made to benefit humans. How would you go about proving that though? I certainly cannot disprove it, but I could just as easily reply that Thor made lightning to keep forests from becoming too crowded. (I could list off other foolish alternatives but I am sure you get the point)Attempting to infer purpose in nature is just a game. It doesn't really have any answers to any real questions. There is no real reason as far as I can tell to object to your claim, it just doesn't really tell me anything.Why do you choose to believe that God made lightning for us? Why not believe God made us for lightning to merrily zap from time to time? What makes you think that there is not lightning on other planets and have nothing at all to do with us.

i did read your post. the laws of physics? this sustains all things? its an observation. an observation that needs expansion.the "things" that the laws of physics pertain to, exist in what?you think something can come from nothing? what outside of energy is real? its a lie. and if you believe that, your standing there telling me that its potential i do not exist, while at the same time under the definite conclusion you "are".lightning and its apparent disorder, and non direction:lightning is positive forces and negative forces reacting to friction. lightning will go wherever the path i the easiest. thats how it is directed, and behaves natural for its condition. furthermore, electricity is lightning. and lightning electricity. and your computers and probably most things in your house operate on this power that we direct knowing how it is directed.i cant make the truth known to anyone, not even you, as intelligent as you are, what hope do i have when so many will not open there eyes to the truth? when so many live by misconceptions, and the truth being so hard to bear?Gods will be done.

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keep your mind from this way of enquiry, for never will you show that not-being is
~parmenides

Hi Vacate, Having spent 59 years of my life serving the Lord why would I not think God created the heavens and earth in the beginning.
When you add all the wonderful things I have been able to see and do, all of the answerd prayers. All the many prophecies that have come to pass in my lifetime, you see these are evidence to me.Now you believe the same thing I do you just call it singularity or nature, or mother nature.Solomon said: "There is a reason and purpose for everything". I don't doubt him.Have fun,

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"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

I take it you mean "explanation"? The fundemental laws of physics have no explanation, they just are. Why? Science does not know. You will claim to have the answer, but you can be sure my next question will be - where is your evidence. (be sure to have it ready, it save us both some time) The Universe, obviously. No The nothingness outside of the universe is real, so is the nothingness between energies. It depends on what you define as real. It also do not see any relevance to this. Whats a lie? Your questions? The answers you expected me to give? Believe what? You are not making sense. I do in fact believe you exist, there is a slight chance that you are a mere chat bot designed to confuse the shit out of me, but if that is the case I still believe that you exist (as a chat bot). Prove direction. As a matter of fact - prove behaivour. All you have done, that I can see, is attempt to show that everything in nature is directed. I claim it is directed by natural processes and natural laws, you appear to be saying this is not the case. I cannot go beyond the evidence that science has put forth so far, there is no reason for the laws of physics that has been discovered. What truth? People are selling truth by the bucket load, I don't buy into claims of truth. There is evidence or philosophy, truth fits soundly in the second choice.

Though this is true (I have no reason to doubt you), that is not really my point. My point, though massively off topic, is that your position and Teslas does not tell me anything. It doesn't tell me what makes lightning, uranium, the expansion of space and time, or even the grand why am I here. Science answers those questions, saying "God made lightning for peoples benefit" does not. It may be true, but it lacks substance the same as if I said I created everything last tuesday. We do appear to be in agreement. I have never had a problem with inserting God into the before. Call it what you will, it harms nothing and if it gives your days meaning - I am all for it. My complaint comes when it trivializes or contradicts science.Sherlock Holmes - "It is a capital mistake to theorise before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."

that nothingness is only apparent. in truth, there is no such thing as an empty space. there is always some form of energy present. if you don't believe that something can come form nothing, tell me, what did it (universe) come from? because this is the path I've been searching to discuss with you from the beginning.Edited by tesla, : defined "it"

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keep your mind from this way of enquiry, for never will you show that not-being is
~parmenides

ah. i see. so how do you see God? the christian God? all science came from the same start, so they cannot be in contradition with one another, not God or science.define your God, that does not sustain all that is from itself, with itself?

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keep your mind from this way of enquiry, for never will you show that not-being is
~parmenides

Do you mean the bow or burn Christian godlet? Hardly. Scientifically athiest. Philisophically agnostic, see science for my reasons.

ok, thats honest . i like that, so if something cannot come from nothing, what did the universe come from? what did it look like before?or can you ask this question yourself at all? and leave it to be discovered by another scientist before you will believe it?Edited by tesla, : spelling

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keep your mind from this way of enquiry, for never will you show that not-being is
~parmenides

The universe functions under a set of definite laws. One of these laws states that something cannot come from nothing. Creationists (like myself) believe, like you said before, that God has infinite power. With this power, he created the many laws that govern you and I. If you traveled in space for eternity looking for God, you would not find him because he is seperate from space, time, and the universe that these laws exist in. This is why creationists can use this reasoning. This reasoning is called logic, and it is something that the followers of the big bang theory have lost sight of.