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Author Topic:   The philosophy behind The Twelve Steps
Legend
Member (Idle past 5028 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


(1)
Message 76 of 108 (474189)
07-06-2008 1:27 PM
Reply to: Message 75 by Phat
07-06-2008 10:33 AM


Re: Empowerment and definition of Higher Power
Phat writes:
Obviously, if one were truly powerless, they wouldn't even be able to choose God!
But they don't choose God, they're just accepting the first glimmer of hope that comes their way, much like a drowning man will grasp at anything in order to stay afloat.
Most 'born-agains' in my old church were there just because people from my church happened to be the first ones to talk to them. They were the first ones to knock on their door. They could have easily been from any other religious denomination or social group that offered some kind of salvation.
The converts didn't choose, they were chosen.
Having said that, I admire you much like I admire anyone who's recovered from serious addiction and massive respect to you for doing so, God or no God.

"We must respect the law, not let it blind us away from the basic principles of fairness, justice and freedom"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 75 by Phat, posted 07-06-2008 10:33 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 77 by Phat, posted 07-06-2008 4:24 PM Legend has replied
 Message 82 by Phat, posted 07-29-2008 8:48 PM Legend has not replied

  
Legend
Member (Idle past 5028 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 78 of 108 (474209)
07-06-2008 6:01 PM
Reply to: Message 77 by Phat
07-06-2008 4:24 PM


Re: Group Support
quote:
4. Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
5. Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being, the exact nature of our wrongs.
These are tough steps indeed, but soul-searching and honest self-assessment yield results regardless of of one's faith in God.
Put another way, you can replace the word 'God' with 'self' in the twelve steps (obviously re-phrase step 1) and the results will remain the same.
Edited by Legend, : grammar

"We must respect the law, not let it blind us away from the basic principles of fairness, justice and freedom"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 77 by Phat, posted 07-06-2008 4:24 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 79 by Phat, posted 07-07-2008 3:33 AM Legend has replied

  
Legend
Member (Idle past 5028 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 80 of 108 (474478)
07-08-2008 5:42 PM
Reply to: Message 79 by Phat
07-07-2008 3:33 AM


Re: Recovery Without God
I think that becoming the best that we can be is a noble goal. What happens, however, when one does not care about recovery? I went through such a phase. I figured that all I was doing was hurting myself...if anybody. I actually liked being addicted. I saw no harm in it.
In light of this, my question is this: Is addiction always a bad thing?
well, as long as it doesn't become the only driving force in your life I wouldn't think so. However, this is rarely the case. Most addicts neglect or mistreat their family, friends and dependants in pursuit of their addiction, so it's fair to say that addiction has other victims and not only the addicts.
Speaking of addiction, I find that some people are addicted to religion. They need to believe in a greater power and they need to feel part of a community that believes the same thing. It gives them an enormous high, it's an addiction that's very difficult to kick. Thoughts?

"We must respect the law, not let it blind us away from the basic principles of fairness, justice and freedom"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 79 by Phat, posted 07-07-2008 3:33 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 81 by Phat, posted 07-09-2008 10:48 AM Legend has not replied
 Message 83 by Phat, posted 08-25-2008 3:49 PM Legend has not replied

  
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