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Author Topic:   Omniscience, Omnipotence, the Fall & Logical Contradictions.
Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 9 of 354 (354235)
10-04-2006 4:45 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by Phat
10-04-2006 11:09 AM


Re: In The Beginning?
quote:
I've never gotten an answer from Him,
...? don't you pray ?
Edited by AdminPhat, : fixed broken link

"Political correctness does not legislate tolerance; it only organizes hatred."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by Phat, posted 10-04-2006 11:09 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 10 of 354 (354236)
10-04-2006 4:48 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by jar
10-04-2006 3:10 PM


quote:
Hell, he could just show that there is such a thing as 'timeless eternity'.
why, it's the opposite of the 'fixed timespan eternity' ofcourse!

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by jar, posted 10-04-2006 3:10 PM jar has not replied

  
Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 57 of 354 (355058)
10-07-2006 8:07 PM
Reply to: Message 56 by iano
10-07-2006 1:19 PM


Re: The cosmic gambler
quote:
By infecting us all with the disease of death and suffering
iano writes:
God didn't infect us. Adam did. Your blaming the Ford Motor Co. for a person choosing to drink and drive and kill pedestrians
The Ford Motor Co. doesn't build cars designed to kill pedestrians.
And if one does, the Ford Motor Co, doesn't go and jail all Ford drivers for it.
quote:
Because he wants to judge us
iano writes:
Not want: must. Sin must be punished. Not even God has a choice in that.
God must judge us? since when is God forced to do anything ? Who's pressing him ?
God creates everything and anything, he alone stretches the heavens, he creates good and evil.
The Bible's not there only to take to Sunday school you know. Make the effort to read it sometime.
God doesn't have to do anything.

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 56 by iano, posted 10-07-2006 1:19 PM iano has not replied

Replies to this message:
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 65 of 354 (355258)
10-08-2006 5:34 PM
Reply to: Message 59 by Christian7
10-08-2006 8:12 AM


omniscience and free will
quote:
A grand master chess player is able to anticipate his opponents move, almost to the point of absolute forknowledge depending on the level of his opponent, especially if he is a beginer or novice. Does this change the fact that the opponent has free will? Absolutley not. The opponent has the absolute free will to chose. But his choices will simply not add up because the grand master chess player has made far superior ones.
so...when the grandmaster who anticipates so brilliantly his novice opponent's moves sets up a trap for him and the opponent steps right in it and gets checkmated, would you say that the novice chose to lose the game or that the grandmaster made him lose it ?
eagerly awaiting your answer.

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 59 by Christian7, posted 10-08-2006 8:12 AM Christian7 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 81 by Christian7, posted 10-16-2006 3:12 PM Legend has not replied

  
Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 85 of 354 (357241)
10-18-2006 11:08 AM
Reply to: Message 80 by Trump won
10-15-2006 7:25 PM


Re: Advice
Iano I suggest replying to Legend's post if you want to retain any credibility.
I think it's a bit late for that....

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."

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 Message 80 by Trump won, posted 10-15-2006 7:25 PM Trump won has not replied

  
Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 149 of 354 (361901)
11-05-2006 3:18 PM
Reply to: Message 148 by Christian7
11-05-2006 1:02 PM


the illusion of free will
Reguardless of whether or not some entity knows our future our choices will still be ours.
so, if God knows that I'm going to choose X, is there any chance that I'm going to choose something other than X ?

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the bug and some days you'll be the windscreen."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 148 by Christian7, posted 11-05-2006 1:02 PM Christian7 has replied

Replies to this message:
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 156 of 354 (362134)
11-06-2006 11:30 AM
Reply to: Message 153 by Christian7
11-06-2006 6:14 AM


Re: the illusion of free will
Point is: God wants us to have the experience of chosing him or chosing against him, and afterwords he wants us to have the experience of our consequences. It's as simple as that.
So, although God knows that I will die an atheist and burn in hell -or whatever- he still went ahead and created me and allows me to live my wretched life until it's time to pay the consequences of my choices.
May I ask what is the motive behind this approach ? Why God still creates those of us who will suffer the consequences ?

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the bug and some days you'll be the windscreen."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 153 by Christian7, posted 11-06-2006 6:14 AM Christian7 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 160 by Christian7, posted 11-06-2006 4:24 PM Legend has replied

  
Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 167 of 354 (362200)
11-06-2006 5:22 PM
Reply to: Message 160 by Christian7
11-06-2006 4:24 PM


Re: the illusion of free will
iBibleNano writes:
It's not God's fault you are going to hell. It's your own damn fault. Think about it, you can drop on your knees right now and pleed for forgiveness of your sins while accepting Jesus Christ into your heart as your personal lord and savior. You could have done that at anytime in your life, and you can do it now. But I doubt you will do it in the future. So you better make up your mind. Oh that's right. Your mind is already made up. I don't think the holy spirit is working on your heart anymore.
that doesn't answer what I asked you. I asked you :
quote:
May I ask what is the motive behind this approach ? Why God still creates those of us who will suffer the consequences?
well...?

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the bug and some days you'll be the windscreen."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 160 by Christian7, posted 11-06-2006 4:24 PM Christian7 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 170 by Christian7, posted 11-06-2006 6:18 PM Legend has not replied

  
Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 208 of 354 (362437)
11-07-2006 1:09 PM
Reply to: Message 195 by Christian7
11-06-2006 8:07 PM


Re: Let's examine that further.
It demonstrates that God has given them a fair chance. It doesn't matter that God created them knowing they would reject him, because it is still their choice.
can't you see the absurdity of what you're saying here ? God created them knowing they would reject him and still he sends the Holy Spirit to show he's given them a fair chance ??!??
what fair chance ?? He knows they will reject him. There is no other chance for them other than rejection, as God cannot be wrong in his knowledge.

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the bug and some days you'll be the windscreen."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 195 by Christian7, posted 11-06-2006 8:07 PM Christian7 has not replied

  
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