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Author Topic:   The bible and homosexuality
PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6872 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 46 of 323 (104157)
04-30-2004 11:38 AM
Reply to: Message 36 by AdminAsgara
04-29-2004 5:16 PM


Re: Inversion
Apologies. Much goes on during the day in day out ......etc.
As a teacher, I give my knowledge, rarely my sources, but point in the general direction. I encourage students to do their own findings, the thrill of the search and discoveries, and the sense of accomplishment achieved, are non-pareil.
The people here know the general direction, and even the source, which is the Bible. The Bible being a highly controversial source, it is better the student find his way in it by himself with, hopefully, the Spirit as a guide, and then achieve knowledge. Come, let us reason together, says the Lord. After all this is done, the greatest challenge is to arrive at the same conclusions, which is highly doubtful, since so many of us are speaking through indoctrination, rather than our very own personal research, search, understanding, taking it for what it says rather than what we have been told it says/means. Homosexuality as the subject, the Bible clearly states 'thou shalt not'. And here we are in 2004, and we say 'well, it no longer applies to us because we live in a different time, and it really makes no difference what we do, etc., etc." If it feels good, do it.
Homosexuality does not achieve God's purpose of Adam and Eve/Man and Woman. If it were acceptable to him, he would have said so, done so by making an additional pair, Adam and Steve. He did not. One poster wants to know what inversion means. He wants me to tell him, rather than go to the dictionary, and get a thrill from finding the meaning of the word all by himself. The thing is this, after he finds out the meaning of the word, he will not be happy but return and ask how it applies to the subject. Such is the nature of things. As for going away, well, you know I do not have to be here and only am to share what I know, perhaps make a friend or two, encourage, inspire, and love a little. Thank you for your time, sorry I got a bit preachy.
George
Oh, I also love Norse mythology and often travel the rainbow bridge to Asgar even tho I'm acrophobic (smile)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by AdminAsgara, posted 04-29-2004 5:16 PM AdminAsgara has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 47 by Dan Carroll, posted 04-30-2004 12:08 PM PecosGeorge has replied
 Message 55 by coffee_addict, posted 04-30-2004 2:17 PM PecosGeorge has not replied
 Message 56 by crashfrog, posted 04-30-2004 2:29 PM PecosGeorge has not replied

Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 47 of 323 (104167)
04-30-2004 12:08 PM
Reply to: Message 46 by PecosGeorge
04-30-2004 11:38 AM


Re: Inversion
quote:
Come, let us reason together, says the Lord.
Indeed he does.
So perhaps you could answer our questions, so that together we can reason through our concerns.

"As the days go by, we face the increasing inevitability that we are alone in a godless, uninhabited, hostile and meaningless universe. Still, you've got to laugh, haven't you?"
-Holly

This message is a reply to:
 Message 46 by PecosGeorge, posted 04-30-2004 11:38 AM PecosGeorge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 52 by PecosGeorge, posted 04-30-2004 2:01 PM Dan Carroll has replied

PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6872 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 48 of 323 (104168)
04-30-2004 12:09 PM
Reply to: Message 45 by Unseul
04-30-2004 7:35 AM


Re: Inversion
Nicely said. Enter a gerbil, and the theme takes on the bizarre, perversion at its ultimate. When, where, how, by whom, etc., disease is transmitted.....by now the best we could do is reverse the trent by practicing what is normal, according to Adam and Eve. This will not happen. Therefore, the discussion is mostly about did God mean what he said, does he mean what he says....."perverted sex is unhealthy, take a look at yourself, I wasn't kidding when I said 'don't do it'." And the rest is simply history.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 45 by Unseul, posted 04-30-2004 7:35 AM Unseul has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 50 by jar, posted 04-30-2004 12:36 PM PecosGeorge has replied
 Message 57 by crashfrog, posted 04-30-2004 2:36 PM PecosGeorge has not replied
 Message 65 by Rrhain, posted 05-01-2004 5:56 AM PecosGeorge has not replied

PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6872 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 49 of 323 (104180)
04-30-2004 12:21 PM
Reply to: Message 40 by coffee_addict
04-29-2004 6:42 PM


Re: Inversion
Modern people and people of all time can will and do justify anything and everything. What you quote from the OT is an account of how people did things then. Because it appears in the Bible, is by no means approval of the practice, but an account and an example of how there is nothing new under the sun. God disapproves of homosexuality. If his warning/advice/command had been heeded........well, do you think there would be HIV today or other STD's promoted through practice of practicing multiple partners....and so on? Moot point? As for being smarter than you? I would never be so presumptious, knowing full well there are people with an IQ higher than 90.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 40 by coffee_addict, posted 04-29-2004 6:42 PM coffee_addict has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 54 by coffee_addict, posted 04-30-2004 2:04 PM PecosGeorge has replied
 Message 66 by Rrhain, posted 05-01-2004 5:59 AM PecosGeorge has replied

jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 50 of 323 (104189)
04-30-2004 12:36 PM
Reply to: Message 48 by PecosGeorge
04-30-2004 12:09 PM


Re: Inversion
by now the best we could do is reverse the trent by practicing what is normal, according to Adam and Eve.
PG
Help me here.
After studying the Bible it certainly appears that what GOD considered normal was cloning, not heterosexual union.
Gen 2:21-22
Unless I'm missing something it was not until after eating the apple and getting thrown out of the Garden that Adam knew Eve. Up until then reproduction seems to have been either creation or as in the case of Eve, cloning.
Gen 4:1
So as good Christians, shouldn't we be moving away from such practices as heterosexual union and back to just cloning individuals?

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 48 by PecosGeorge, posted 04-30-2004 12:09 PM PecosGeorge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 51 by PecosGeorge, posted 04-30-2004 1:54 PM jar has replied

PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6872 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 51 of 323 (104207)
04-30-2004 1:54 PM
Reply to: Message 50 by jar
04-30-2004 12:36 PM


Re: Inversion
Absolutely.
Watching the animals around him, Adam understood that something was missing from his life. The birds and the bees were having the kind of fun he thought he might want to have. So, God made some fun for him, and in return, fun for her.
That God made sex, and lust, and desire, is clear. What is not clear is how the connotation of such has changed over time. Today we feel a certain ... uh....embarrassment for feeling lusty, and sexy, and desireful. Desiring sex and engaging in it is not sin. Well, you know when it becomes so.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 50 by jar, posted 04-30-2004 12:36 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 58 by jar, posted 04-30-2004 3:55 PM PecosGeorge has replied

PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6872 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 52 of 323 (104210)
04-30-2004 2:01 PM
Reply to: Message 47 by Dan Carroll
04-30-2004 12:08 PM


Re: Inversion
Alas, I have long forgotten what those questions are. One by one, please reiterate, time is not a friend to me, meaning - mine is limited. Yours? Too, eh?
I like your avatar. Nice to hear from you.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 47 by Dan Carroll, posted 04-30-2004 12:08 PM Dan Carroll has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 53 by Dan Carroll, posted 04-30-2004 2:03 PM PecosGeorge has not replied

Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 53 of 323 (104211)
04-30-2004 2:03 PM
Reply to: Message 52 by PecosGeorge
04-30-2004 2:01 PM


Re: Inversion
In my case, posts 29 and 39 will do.

"As the days go by, we face the increasing inevitability that we are alone in a godless, uninhabited, hostile and meaningless universe. Still, you've got to laugh, haven't you?"
-Holly

This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by PecosGeorge, posted 04-30-2004 2:01 PM PecosGeorge has not replied

coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 477 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 54 of 323 (104212)
04-30-2004 2:04 PM
Reply to: Message 49 by PecosGeorge
04-30-2004 12:21 PM


Re: Inversion
PecosGeorge writes:
God disapproves of homosexuality. If his warning/advice/command had been heeded........well, do you think there would be HIV today or other STD's promoted through practice of practicing multiple partners....and so on?
I'm trying to be as patient as I can with this. Please please please please please please please please site some references from the freaking bible. Also, do some readings before you start talking about STD's and such.
I think I am justified in losing my patience if you continue to completely avoid addressing the issue and give some evidence to back it up. As a teacher (IFF you are a teacher) you should know better than giving vague answers like that. Look at my original post. I gave you a whole freaking bunch of direct quotes from the bible. Please do the same for me!
All I ask is you give us your reasons to why you think God condemns homosexuality besides your "it's not natural" argument. Trust me, I can tear that argument to pieces if I wanted to.
[This message has been edited by Lam, 04-30-2004]

The Laminator

This message is a reply to:
 Message 49 by PecosGeorge, posted 04-30-2004 12:21 PM PecosGeorge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 59 by PecosGeorge, posted 04-30-2004 4:43 PM coffee_addict has replied

coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 477 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 55 of 323 (104217)
04-30-2004 2:17 PM
Reply to: Message 46 by PecosGeorge
04-30-2004 11:38 AM


Re: Inversion
PecosGeorge writes:
As a teacher, I give my knowledge, rarely my sources, but point in the general direction.
No wonder the Texas school system is one of the worst in the states. I have always been taught to give my sources to support my claims and beliefs. My teachers have also demonstrated this by always being prepared to tell us their sources if we asked.
The few times that my teachers have asked us to take their words for it were times when they had to present extremely hard concepts to understand, like things that had to do with the theory of relativity. However, I just don't see the same difficulty in your claim there. So, please give us some references from the bible.
Also, look at the title of the thread. This thread was intended for people to directly relate to the bible about homosexuality. Making unsupported claims will not get your far.

The Laminator

This message is a reply to:
 Message 46 by PecosGeorge, posted 04-30-2004 11:38 AM PecosGeorge has not replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1467 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 56 of 323 (104219)
04-30-2004 2:29 PM
Reply to: Message 46 by PecosGeorge
04-30-2004 11:38 AM


If it were acceptable to him, he would have said so, done so by making an additional pair, Adam and Steve. He did not.
No, he did.
quote:
1 Samuel 18:3 - Then Jonathan made a covenant with David, because he loved him as his own soul.
And moreover, the fact that there's one famous hetero couple in the Bible can hardly mean that everybody is supposed to play that way, especially when you factor in the well-supported hereditary basis for homosexuality. That's like saying "one guy in the Bible really liked vanilla ice cream, so now nobody can ever eat pistachio."
The only prohibitions against homosexuality are all references to the practice of religious prostitution. Well, I don't see too much of that going on these days.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 46 by PecosGeorge, posted 04-30-2004 11:38 AM PecosGeorge has not replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1467 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 57 of 323 (104222)
04-30-2004 2:36 PM
Reply to: Message 48 by PecosGeorge
04-30-2004 12:09 PM


Enter a gerbil
Oh, for God's sake. There's no such thing as gerbiling.
How on Earth do you expect to carry on a rational argument about homosexuality when the only thing you know about homosexuals comes from horsing around in the locker room?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 48 by PecosGeorge, posted 04-30-2004 12:09 PM PecosGeorge has not replied

jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 58 of 323 (104273)
04-30-2004 3:55 PM
Reply to: Message 51 by PecosGeorge
04-30-2004 1:54 PM


Re: Inversion
So you agree that as Christians we should move away from Heterosexual activity and just stick to cloning for reproduction?

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 51 by PecosGeorge, posted 04-30-2004 1:54 PM PecosGeorge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 60 by PecosGeorge, posted 04-30-2004 4:47 PM jar has not replied

PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6872 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 59 of 323 (104298)
04-30-2004 4:43 PM
Reply to: Message 54 by coffee_addict
04-30-2004 2:04 PM


Re: Inversion
Use your own references, the one's you listed from Leviticus. And don't tell me the God of the OT differs in application from the one in the NT. Then do a google for homosexuality and the New Testament, write down the references you find, open your Bible and look them up. As for my teaching style, and who said I teach in Texas?, I cherish my success and my approach is carefully worked out to meet the needs of my teaching environment and students. I do appreciate your patience, try to learn from mine and what I am trying to do, and that is.........get your butt in gear, stop your blathering about my shortcomings, and rather than tell me of mine, work on yours, the beam in my eye is no bigger than the one in yours.
God disapproves of homosexuality. Find the scripture that says otherwise. Find the scripture that says yes it is ok for men to lie with one another, or women getting it on with women, for that matter, or animals, or whatever perversion is now acceptable. So far as tearing an argument to pieces, please, whatever floats your boat. I promise I will let you do as you wish.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 54 by coffee_addict, posted 04-30-2004 2:04 PM coffee_addict has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 61 by crashfrog, posted 04-30-2004 4:51 PM PecosGeorge has not replied
 Message 62 by coffee_addict, posted 04-30-2004 6:14 PM PecosGeorge has replied

PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6872 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 60 of 323 (104299)
04-30-2004 4:47 PM
Reply to: Message 58 by jar
04-30-2004 3:55 PM


Re: Inversion
I agree that you should do whatever makes you happy.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 58 by jar, posted 04-30-2004 3:55 PM jar has not replied

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