What does the word Atheist mean? Is an Agnostic Atheist?

I don't know if anyone else has noticed, but the word atheist is very commonly mistaken to have this definition:Atheist: A person who does not believe in GodAlthough the definition would have to be true, it does not cover the meaning. The "A" prefix means "not" or "without". Other examples of the "a" prefix are:asexual, anarchy, anonymous, apathy, aphasia, and anemiaThe word theist meansTheist: One who has a Religous Belief systemNow the real question here is this.Are Agnostics also Atheist? Wouldn't they have to be? After all, Agnostics do not have a religion.[This message has been edited by AdminSylas, 05-02-2004]

Thread moved here from the Proposed New Topics forum.

No, they're not the same. You have the definition of 'atheist' right. An agnostic is simply one who neither denies nor affirms the existence of God(s).You're also correct about the prefix 'a'. In the case of 'agnostic', the literal meaning would therefore be 'one who denies that spiritual knowledge can be gleaned intuitively', since that is the opposite of the basic belief of the historical gnostics. Please note that this is a rather over-simplified definition, but it will do for basic understanding.

By the way, where is message 2 of this thread?

There's two kinds of atheists: agnostic atheists and positive atheists.The agonstic atheists are the ones who have no belief in God for the same reason they have no belief in Santa Claus - there's no evidence.The positive atheists are sure that there's no God, which basically makes them as unreasonable as theists.If one cleaves to the scientific principle of tentativity, there's no difference between atheism and agnosticism. Moreover, without taking the position that all Gods don't exist, it is possible to pretty much be sure that some Gods don't exist - that some ideas about God must be flat-out wrong.For instance we can know that God can be benevolent or all-powerful, but not both. If you insist that God is both, then you're talking about a God that doesn't exist.Honestly I don't understand why someone would identify as agnostic, because unless they committed to walking that narrow line for all possible imaginary entities, they're being inconsistent. It seems to me that self-described agonstics are usually giving God the benefit of a double standard - they're generally pretty sure that the world isn't crowded full of invisible, intangible ninjas (for instance), but when it comes to God it's all "oh, we can't be sure" this and "it's not possible to know" that.

Message 2 was feedback from me, before the thread was approved. Such feedback usually has nothing to do with the topic subject and may be deleted when moving to the new forum.AdminSylas

Agnostics are simply non-commital bastards (probably sweedish in lineage). This why I never shop for shoes with an agnostic.The reason I'm an Atheist, is I've never seen any evidence of a God/Gods, nor do I expect to see any...to the contrary, I've seen more evidence against A God/Gods than for one.The explainations/reasons for God/Gods are humanistic and not scientific.

Bold mine.While I agree with your post, I would advice using a different term for the strong atheist position. There is a sporadically published magazine (with accompanying website) called "Positive Atheism". This is their view, taken from this page.

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Freedom, morality, and the human dignity of the individual consists precisely in
this; that he does good not because he is forced to do so, but because he freely
conceives it, wants it, and loves it.
- Mikhail Bakunin, God and the State, from The Columbian Dictionary of Quotations

I would not call this the "mistaken" definition.One either believes that god exists (a theist), or one doesn't believe that god exists (an atheist). Agnostics could be either, depending on what they mean by 'agnostic'. If they use David Humes definition (if I remember it correctly), being "without knowledge", as in they (and everyone else) cannot know if a god exists or not, they are more than likely atheists. However, as with theists and atheists, I'm sure you get some people with very strange believes that call themselves agnostic.

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Freedom, morality, and the human dignity of the individual consists precisely in
this; that he does good not because he is forced to do so, but because he freely
conceives it, wants it, and loves it.
- Mikhail Bakunin, God and the State, from The Columbian Dictionary of Quotations

Yeah, I just sort of made it up because I couldn't think of a better word to describe it. I.e. they're "positive" that there's no God. I'm open to suggestions of a better term, particularly from those who actually hold that position. Noncognitivists, eh? Interesting.

Atheist/ism means "against theism".Theism: belief that God created the universe/world and is knowable.Deism: belief that God created the universe/world and is not knowable.In the greek language, to place an "a" in front of a word reverses the meaning, so in essence, atheism is the reverse of theism.[This message has been edited WILLOWTREE, 05-02-2004]

"agnosticism" is a word coined by Darwin supporter Huxley. He was tired of the harrassment by the Church for being an atheist, so he turned to the N.T. for relief.Acts 17:13 has the philosophers on Mars Hill erecting a monument to the "unknown" god. The word in the original greek is "agnos", hence Huxley turned it into "agnostic".Huxley only wanted relief from the stigma of being atheist, and he thought it better to just say he didn't know.

No, it means "without theism." The "a" prefix doesn't reverse the meaning of anything. It just means "without" or "lacking".

Well I would call that anti-theism, but it could, perhaps also equate to "strong" or "positive" athiesm described in previous posts. Atheism is basically a lack of belief - NON theism, and disbelief in specific ideas of god(s) is an addition to that world view. Atheism is a very broad categorisation, as is theism when applied to someone believing in a particular brand of a particular religion. No, that would be monotheism, for theism it should be "a god or gods...". As far as I know, deism always refers to one god, so you would be correct with that one...

crashfrog errs:

quote:

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The "a" prefix doesn't reverse the meaning of anything.

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Yes it does. It can mean 'without', as you say, or it can mean 'not', as in 'atypical'.