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Author Topic:   Faith and belief
pelican
Member (Idle past 1486 days)
Posts: 781
From: australia
Joined: 05-27-2007


Message 1 of 124 (416660)
08-17-2007 9:17 AM


There is scientific investigation on the human power of intention and manifestation. Experiments are being undertaken to prove we create from an unseen energy that we as humans have within the consciousness. It is possible that we create all experiences in life including relationships, jobs, good luck, bad luck, everything. Many now believe (myself included) that this is true.
There is a strong belief also in The Law of Attraction which is basically the same, as there is cause and effect from within. As a whole this clearly points to faith and belief in ourselves and god(universe).There are numerous referrals to this evidence in 'what the bleep' and follow up aticles in 'the Global Intellinger' magazine.
If this is true, and appears to be so, is that there has been a huge amount of 'faith and belief' in a god\creator and therefore must manifest in the human experience. How would this faith and belief manifest and how would it appear in the human experience?
Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by pbee, posted 08-17-2007 11:47 AM pelican has responded
 Message 6 by Rob, posted 08-18-2007 3:25 AM pelican has responded
 Message 8 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-18-2007 5:55 AM pelican has responded
 Message 31 by jar, posted 08-18-2007 9:39 PM pelican has not yet responded
 Message 124 by pelican, posted 01-27-2008 9:23 PM pelican has not yet responded

  
Adminastasia
Inactive Member


Message 2 of 124 (416672)
08-17-2007 10:06 AM


Thread moved here from the Proposed New Topics forum.
Replies to this message:
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pbee
Member (Idle past 2529 days)
Posts: 339
Joined: 06-20-2007


Message 3 of 124 (416701)
08-17-2007 11:47 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by pelican
08-17-2007 9:17 AM


quote:
If this is true, and appears to be so, is that there has been a huge amount of 'faith and belief' in a god\creator and therefore must manifest in the human experience. How would this faith and belief manifest and how would it appear in the human experience?

I know I say this often but...
Is there any way you could dumb your question down so that it's easier to follow?(for us older folks) :)


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by pelican, posted 08-17-2007 9:17 AM pelican has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by pelican, posted 08-17-2007 10:09 PM pbee has not yet responded

  
pelican
Member (Idle past 1486 days)
Posts: 781
From: australia
Joined: 05-27-2007


Message 4 of 124 (416798)
08-17-2007 10:09 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by pbee
08-17-2007 11:47 AM


Is faith and belief manifesting god?
The discovery of 'law of attraction' and 'intention and manifestation' have opened doors to a previously unknown enrgy force. In physical terms it is similar to electricty. It has always been there but humanity have to reach a certain point of consciousness before these unseeable energies come into being.
These new 'human' energy forces are coming into being. There are many testimonies of manifestations through focus and intention. The manifestations are usually in a physical form, e.g. new car, house, job, partner, health etc. but these are just the ones we are aware of. These are things we are mindful of but there are a lot of experiences inbetween that we are not mindful of. We don't look for a manifestation in other areas during these inbetween times.
If our thoughts and beliefs and intentions and imaginings manifest some things in our lives then we must manifest 'everything' in our lives that we think, believe, intend and imagine no matter how small or seemingly insignificant. It either must work all the time or it cannot work at all.
As with electricity 'human' energy has always been there but now we are reaching a level of consciousness that we have never before reached. Never before have we been able to connect with everyone around the globe as we do now. Never before have we had the technology, communication and information that we have now. This 'Human'energy is being shared and connected in a way we have never known before. This human energy that manifests is sponsored by beliefs and behind those beliefs is a certain amount of faith that those beliefs are true.
Baring this in mind, the human race around the globe has had, and still have beliefs and faith in a god of such magnitude that god must manifest in a form we can recognise.
My question is not if god will manifest but how?


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Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by sidelined, posted 08-17-2007 10:19 PM pelican has responded
 Message 12 by Jaderis, posted 08-18-2007 6:31 AM pelican has responded

  
sidelined 
Inactive Suspended Member


Message 5 of 124 (416799)
08-17-2007 10:19 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by pelican
08-17-2007 10:09 PM


Re: Is faith and belief manifesting god?
dameeva

The discovery of 'law of attraction' and 'intention and manifestation' have opened doors to a previously unknown enrgy force. In physical terms it is similar to electricty. It has always been there but humanity have to reach a certain point of consciousness before these unseeable energies come into being.

Since it is physical then it can be measured and demonstrated. Care to do an experiment?

Now who is the one that was first to learn of this unseeable energy and how do we tell that he actually has seen it rather than simply bullshitting for personal gain or notoriety?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by pelican, posted 08-17-2007 10:09 PM pelican has responded

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Rob 
Suspended Member (Idle past 2350 days)
Posts: 2297
Joined: 06-01-2006


Message 6 of 124 (416842)
08-18-2007 3:25 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by pelican
08-17-2007 9:17 AM


How would this faith and belief manifest and how would it appear in the human experience?

Do you have faith that you can actually create your own reality? Or are you creating the reality that you create your own reality?

Are you seeking power to accomplish something? Or are you searching for the truth?

And if the truth turns out to be that we create our own reality, then who created that?

To find something, it must have already existed.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by pelican, posted 08-17-2007 9:17 AM pelican has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by pelican, posted 08-18-2007 6:24 AM Rob has responded

    
Archer Opteryx
Member (Idle past 99 days)
Posts: 1811
From: East Asia
Joined: 08-16-2006


Message 7 of 124 (416848)
08-18-2007 5:37 AM
Reply to: Message 2 by Adminastasia
08-17-2007 10:06 AM


It's off topic, but I just got the news.

Congratulations, ana, on being an admin. You'll rock.


Archer

All species are transitional.


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Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 12973
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 2.0


Message 8 of 124 (416850)
08-18-2007 5:55 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by pelican
08-17-2007 9:17 AM


There is scientific investigation on the human power of intention and manifestation. Experiments are being undertaken to prove we create from an unseen energy that we as humans have within the consciousness.

Please describe these experiments. Which experimental results would falsify the hypothesis that "we create from an unseen energy that we as humans have within the consciousness"?

There is a strong belief also in The Law of Attraction which is basically the same, as there is cause and effect from within.

Please state the "Law of Attraction".


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by pelican, posted 08-17-2007 9:17 AM pelican has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 14 by pelican, posted 08-18-2007 6:52 AM Dr Adequate has responded

  
pelican
Member (Idle past 1486 days)
Posts: 781
From: australia
Joined: 05-27-2007


Message 9 of 124 (416851)
08-18-2007 6:12 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by sidelined
08-17-2007 10:19 PM


Re: Is faith and belief manifesting god?
Hi Sidelined, What experiement do you have in mind? I don't believe human energy can be measured in the same way as electricity and it's a good job as they'd find a way to make money out of us. It would make more money than bottled water. Gee I wish I had thought of that ha ha. However, we can measure results from harnessing and focussing the energy for a desired result.
In 'what the bleep' it explains an experiment of human energy on water. Under strict controls, pure tap water was focussed upon and blessed by humans who were well practised in meditation. Their human energy was mindfully intent on the water which was then frozen.
The comparison of unadulterated water crystals against those adulterated crystals was astonishing. There was clear evidence of cause and effect from the human consciousness. There are ongoing experiements in this field and many many more incidents that connect us with creation.
It is a very personal energy that only the individual would recognize and believe as true. Being mindful of self, thoughts and beliefs whilst being aware of life experiences will present your own creation to you. We could call it synchronicity in awareness of cause, effect and consequence. This is the most fundamental basic law that never changes. In every incident there is cause, effect and consequence. We are now recognizing and taking rsponsibility for being the cause.
I believe what we are seeing is the tip of the iceberg and the most intense, focussed upon, thought about, and talked about is a god. The collective human energy on the subject of god at any one time is so immense, that a form of god or god form must manifest if it has not already. The question uppermost in my mind, in view of the mounting evidence for a human creative force, is how will god manifest?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by sidelined, posted 08-17-2007 10:19 PM sidelined has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-18-2007 6:15 AM pelican has responded
 Message 13 by Jaderis, posted 08-18-2007 6:52 AM pelican has responded
 Message 32 by anastasia, posted 08-18-2007 10:44 PM pelican has responded
 Message 57 by Archer Opteryx, posted 08-23-2007 10:36 AM pelican has responded

  
Dr Adequate
Member
Posts: 12973
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 2.0


Message 10 of 124 (416852)
08-18-2007 6:15 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by pelican
08-18-2007 6:12 AM


Re: Is faith and belief manifesting god?
Under strict controls, pure tap water was focussed upon and blessed by humans who were well practised in meditation. Their human energy was mindfully intent on the water which was then frozen.
The comparison of unadulterated water crystals against those adulterated crystals was astonishing. There was clear evidence of cause and effect from the human consciousness.

More details, please.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by pelican, posted 08-18-2007 6:12 AM pelican has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by pelican, posted 08-18-2007 6:57 AM Dr Adequate has responded

  
pelican
Member (Idle past 1486 days)
Posts: 781
From: australia
Joined: 05-27-2007


Message 11 of 124 (416853)
08-18-2007 6:24 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by Rob
08-18-2007 3:25 AM


Good questions Rob. Can you answer them. There is one I will answer and it is the truth and only the truth I am searching for. I know it is the truth because some of the truths I have discovered have been so harsh and so difficult to accept. I don't settle for truths that make me feel good or right or smug. I internalize the question into my personal experiences and come pretty close to fully grasping the concept, whatever that may be.
Your final statement of finding something it must have already existed is quite true. Electricity was not created by us but discovered. However, it is also possible to create anew from already existing energy.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by Rob, posted 08-18-2007 3:25 AM Rob has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 22 by Rob, posted 08-18-2007 12:13 PM pelican has responded

  
Jaderis
Member
Posts: 622
From: NY,NY
Joined: 06-16-2006


Message 12 of 124 (416854)
08-18-2007 6:31 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by pelican
08-17-2007 10:09 PM


Re: Is faith and belief manifesting god?
All this talk of "manifestation," especially associated with "new car, house, job..." sounds suspiciously like the Word-Faith movement in the charismatic churches (see also Laws of Prosperity) otherwise known as "Postiive Confession" or "Name It and Claim It."

While, to me, it doesn't sound any more absurd than faith in general, it seems that beneath the "positive" veneer lies something insidious (probably not intentional, but there, nonetheless).

If a group of people can claim that prosperity comes to those who "claim it" with enough faith, then it logically follows that those who do not prosper (ie the poor, the sick or the otherwise unfortunate) are only in that state because of lack of (proper) faith. IOW, being poor or sick becomes a sign of degenerate faith, wrong faith, lazy faith or no faith at all and they deserve everything they get (or don't get).

Christapitalism at its finest :rolleyes:

Edited by Jaderis, : No reason given.


"You are metaphysicians. You can prove anything by metaphysics; and having done so, every metaphysician can prove every other metaphysician wrong--to his own satisfaction. You are anarchists in the realm of thought. And you are mad cosmos-makers. Each of you dwells in a cosmos of his own making, created out of his own fancies and desires. You do not know the real world in which you live, and your thinking has no place in the real world except in so far as it is phenomena of mental aberration." -The Iron Heel by Jack London
This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by pelican, posted 08-17-2007 10:09 PM pelican has responded

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Jaderis
Member
Posts: 622
From: NY,NY
Joined: 06-16-2006


Message 13 of 124 (416857)
08-18-2007 6:52 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by pelican
08-18-2007 6:12 AM


Re: Is faith and belief manifesting god?
You might want to read this analysis of the concepts used in What the Bleep.

From the article:

The third example was the work of Masura Emoto, who tapes words to bottles of water. The water is chilled and forms into crystals descriptive of the words used. For example, if the word “love” is taped to a bottle, beautiful crystals form; if the words “you make me sick” are used, ugly images appear.

What the film makers didn’t say is that Emoto knows the word used, and looks for a crystal that matches that word (biased data selection). To demonstrate a real effect, Emoto would need to be blind to the word used. James Randi has said that if Emoto could perform this experiment double-blinded, it would qualify for the million dollar prize. (He has never applied.) Such a protocol would show there is no correlation between the words taped to a bottle and the crystals formed within. These experiments have not been performed to a scientific protocol and have never been independently replicated.

Check this out, too(it is linked to at the end of the above article, but you might miss it).

Edited by Jaderis, : No reason given.


"You are metaphysicians. You can prove anything by metaphysics; and having done so, every metaphysician can prove every other metaphysician wrong--to his own satisfaction. You are anarchists in the realm of thought. And you are mad cosmos-makers. Each of you dwells in a cosmos of his own making, created out of his own fancies and desires. You do not know the real world in which you live, and your thinking has no place in the real world except in so far as it is phenomena of mental aberration." -The Iron Heel by Jack London
This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by pelican, posted 08-18-2007 6:12 AM pelican has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 16 by pelican, posted 08-18-2007 7:25 AM Jaderis has responded

    
pelican
Member (Idle past 1486 days)
Posts: 781
From: australia
Joined: 05-27-2007


Message 14 of 124 (416858)
08-18-2007 6:52 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by Dr Adequate
08-18-2007 5:55 AM


law of attraction
hi dr. adequate, the experiments are in quantum physics and illustrated much better in 'what the bleep' (amongst others) than I can. However, basically the law of attraction states that whatever you focus upon will manifest in a life experience in some form. It is said that what you fear attracts that which you are afraid of. For example if the fear is of developing cancer, then cancer is what you will get. I do believe it is not as simple as that but it is the general idea.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-18-2007 5:55 AM Dr Adequate has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-18-2007 8:05 AM pelican has responded

  
pelican
Member (Idle past 1486 days)
Posts: 781
From: australia
Joined: 05-27-2007


Message 15 of 124 (416859)
08-18-2007 6:57 AM
Reply to: Message 10 by Dr Adequate
08-18-2007 6:15 AM


Re: Is faith and belief manifesting god?
You will have to do your own homework I'm afraid. I have done mine and it is a step by step process. It would take too much of my energy and I might want to charge for it. ha ha
This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-18-2007 6:15 AM Dr Adequate has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by Dr Adequate, posted 08-18-2007 7:54 AM pelican has responded

  
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