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Author Topic:   Evolution is NOT science: A challenge
Loudmouth
Inactive Member


Message 511 of 591 (136336)
08-23-2004 1:38 PM
Reply to: Message 494 by riVeRraT
08-23-2004 9:53 AM


Re: Faith in the unseen
quote:
There is evidence that disease is caused by demons and evil spirits, and I have seen peopl cured by praying.
So why couldn't they teach that in schools.
They don't have to say its true, just a theory.
Where is the double blind study that shows this? How did they control for the placebo effect? Did they also pray to Zeus to see if a false god would also cure the sick? Can I repeat the experiments myself? Is the study published anywhere so that I can replicate their methodology? If the study does not fit these criteria then it is not scientific. What you have is anecdotal evidence which is inherently unreliable as has beens shown by numerous scientific investigations.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 494 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 9:53 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 522 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 9:51 PM Loudmouth has replied

Loudmouth
Inactive Member


Message 512 of 591 (136338)
08-23-2004 1:43 PM
Reply to: Message 497 by riVeRraT
08-23-2004 10:05 AM


Re: Faith in the unseen
quote:
If I showed you a documneted miralce, would you say that is a theory with the intervention of God?
Depends on how the miracle was documented. You must also show that such miraculous recoveries are never associated with non-believers or with those who pray to other gods (if you are stating that only one god exists). Also, the intervention must be repeatable by the same methodology. As is seen in many drug studies, people are miraculously cured by sugar pills all of the time.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 497 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 10:05 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 523 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 9:53 PM Loudmouth has not replied

ramoss
Member (Idle past 632 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 08-11-2004


Message 513 of 591 (136348)
08-23-2004 4:08 PM
Reply to: Message 500 by riVeRraT
08-23-2004 10:15 AM


Re: Faith in the unseen
Oh..
And which one has been docuemetned in a non-biased manner.
I have seen many frauds that were docuemetned as "miracles".
I have not seen any objective evidecne that any of the 'miracles' in the
bible actually happened.
I have seen objective evidence that shows species change over time.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 500 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 10:15 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 524 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 9:55 PM ramoss has not replied

ramoss
Member (Idle past 632 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 08-11-2004


Message 514 of 591 (136349)
08-23-2004 4:10 PM
Reply to: Message 505 by riVeRraT
08-23-2004 10:36 AM


Re: Faith in the unseen
Well then..
What evidence do you have that the miracles that were written about in the bible actually happened?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 505 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 10:36 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 525 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 9:56 PM ramoss has not replied

jar
Member (Idle past 414 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 515 of 591 (136386)
08-23-2004 8:33 PM
Reply to: Message 508 by riVeRraT
08-23-2004 10:45 AM


Re: Faith in the unseen
Ever since darwin who made some observations, and guessed that we evolved, we have been trying to find data to make the conclusion true.
Actually, Evolution was pretty much a conclusion long before Darwin came along. There was simply way too much evidence for anyone to take the Biblical account seriously for several centuries at least. What Darwin did was show a method, a mechanisim that helped explain how Evolution worked.
People such as myself have made our own observations about life, and decided that it is so wonderful, that God must have created it. Whats wrong with trying to prove it?
Nothing. But what does that have to do with the TOE?
But I also see evidence that we were created.
Fine. Start a thread and post some of the evidence. We'd love to discuss it.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 508 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 10:45 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 526 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 10:04 PM jar has replied

jar
Member (Idle past 414 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 516 of 591 (136387)
08-23-2004 8:36 PM
Reply to: Message 494 by riVeRraT
08-23-2004 9:53 AM


Re: Faith in the unseen
There is evidence that disease is caused by demons and evil spirits...
Can you point us to the evidence for that?

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 494 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 9:53 AM riVeRraT has not replied

nator
Member (Idle past 2190 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 517 of 591 (136388)
08-23-2004 8:37 PM
Reply to: Message 490 by One_Charred_Wing
08-21-2004 2:14 AM


quote:
Contracycle said that, not me! I never said you were lesbian.
Just a joke, hon.
quote:
And most lesbians I've seen are extremely hot.
LOL!
There are hot ones and less hot ones.
I happen to work with a lot of gay men and women in a very gay-friendly town, and I saw one woman's friend, and she looked just like a young Ralph Macchio.
IOW, she looked an awful lot like a 14 year old boy wearing reflective shades, a bandana around her head and a white T-shirt with the sleeves rolled up.
quote:
And I never said you were ugly. I just think you look goofy riding that horse in your avatar(assuming that's you).
Goofy?
How am I goofy?
(I'm not being defensive, I'm just curious what you find goofy about the picture. FYI, my position is almost textbook-perfect, if I do say so myself.)
quote:
Just because I like taunting feminists doesn't mean I'm a shovenistic barbarian.
That's "chauvinistic".

This message is a reply to:
 Message 490 by One_Charred_Wing, posted 08-21-2004 2:14 AM One_Charred_Wing has not replied

nator
Member (Idle past 2190 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 518 of 591 (136389)
08-23-2004 8:44 PM
Reply to: Message 499 by riVeRraT
08-23-2004 10:14 AM


quote:
What kind of lesbian are you, well lets see, as far as I know, you are the kind of lesbian that hates men like me and B2P.
So you are a hating lesbian.
OK, I'll clue you in.
I'm not a lesbian, riverrat.
I've been happily married for almost 12 years now to a wonderful man who is also a member of this forum (Zhimbo), though he doen't post much these days because he is getting ready to defend his PhD in Cognitive Science this spring.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 499 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 10:14 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 530 by riVeRraT, posted 08-24-2004 8:32 AM nator has not replied

nator
Member (Idle past 2190 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 519 of 591 (136392)
08-23-2004 8:48 PM
Reply to: Message 501 by riVeRraT
08-23-2004 10:17 AM


Re: In comes the cavalry
quote:
If it is not proven, you cannot say that it happened.
Nothing is science is proven.
Do you disbelieve all of science now?
quote:
That is truth.
People who belive in it, are believing in something that isn't proven, I call it faith, so does the dictionary.
I asked you a specific question that required a simple, yes or no answer.
Please stop avoiding the question.
I will repeat it below:
Is it your point that if there are any gaps in the evolutionary history of a species, we cannot say that it has evolved at all, is that correct?
Yes or no.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 501 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 10:17 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 531 by riVeRraT, posted 08-24-2004 8:35 AM nator has replied

nator
Member (Idle past 2190 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 520 of 591 (136393)
08-23-2004 8:52 PM
Reply to: Message 502 by riVeRraT
08-23-2004 10:20 AM


Re: Faith in the unseen
quote:
Why is it you don't answer my question?
Are you are looking to justify what you believe in because its a good chance that germs cause desease?
If I told you soap cleans dishes, and there is a theory behind it, but its not proven, does that make all science valid as truth?
Unresponsive.
I asked you very specific questions that require only a yes or no answer.
Please stop avoiding answering these very simple questions:
Is it true that germs cause disease? Yes or no?
Is it true that matter is made up of atoms? Yes or no?
Are they true "enough" for us to teach them as true in science class? Yes or no?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 502 by riVeRraT, posted 08-23-2004 10:20 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 532 by riVeRraT, posted 08-24-2004 8:38 AM nator has replied

lfen
Member (Idle past 4697 days)
Posts: 2189
From: Oregon
Joined: 06-24-2004


Message 521 of 591 (136394)
08-23-2004 9:05 PM
Reply to: Message 496 by CK
08-23-2004 10:00 AM


Re: Still OT
Charles,
Just out of curiosity what are the other meanings of giggle in the UK besides a kind of laugh, or laughing at? One usage in the US would be in the form of "it's a giggle" meaning lightweight fun.
That's about all I can think of.
Thanks,
lfen

This message is a reply to:
 Message 496 by CK, posted 08-23-2004 10:00 AM CK has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 436 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 522 of 591 (136403)
08-23-2004 9:51 PM
Reply to: Message 511 by Loudmouth
08-23-2004 1:38 PM


Re: Faith in the unseen
They also don't have to teach it as science, or teach it as Christian science.
The point is, that it happens all the time, yet it is ignored, and not taught in schools.
Mostly because man cannot explain it, and the people who are trying to explain it, don't believe in nit, so they give it a bad rep.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 511 by Loudmouth, posted 08-23-2004 1:38 PM Loudmouth has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 529 by Loudmouth, posted 08-24-2004 12:32 AM riVeRraT has replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 436 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 523 of 591 (136404)
08-23-2004 9:53 PM
Reply to: Message 512 by Loudmouth
08-23-2004 1:43 PM


Re: Faith in the unseen
What does other Gods have to do with it?
Who am I to judge who those other Gods are. They might just be all the same God.
Maybe God set up life that way so that everyone would have a chance to come to Christ.
I don't know.
But I see your point.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 512 by Loudmouth, posted 08-23-2004 1:43 PM Loudmouth has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 436 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 524 of 591 (136405)
08-23-2004 9:55 PM
Reply to: Message 513 by ramoss
08-23-2004 4:08 PM


Re: Faith in the unseen
When you leave your house tonight and bad luck sets in and you get run over by a car, and your standing at the pearly gates in front of God's judgement, what are you going to tell him?
Just curious.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 513 by ramoss, posted 08-23-2004 4:08 PM ramoss has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 436 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 525 of 591 (136406)
08-23-2004 9:56 PM
Reply to: Message 514 by ramoss
08-23-2004 4:10 PM


Re: Faith in the unseen
The same evidence I have that proves you wrote in this forum.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 514 by ramoss, posted 08-23-2004 4:10 PM ramoss has not replied

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