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Author Topic:   Lebanon In End Time Bible Prophecy
Nimrod
Member (Idle past 4937 days)
Posts: 277
Joined: 06-22-2006


Message 42 of 178 (343174)
08-25-2006 12:26 AM


Racial obsession...in ignorance.
The Canaanites (called Phoenicians)spread throught North Africa , Europe, and the America's would eventually convert to Judaism (H.G. Wells even mentions this in his history book, well he doesnt mention the cross world travels but does mention Carthage and such springing up into large Jewish communities).So you have "Jews" that are ethnic Canaanite, and even the Palestinian Jews would be made up of many Canaanite converts.
Many Christians were Jewish converts including (gasp)the New Testament characters including the Lords relatives.
You have Palestinians that are Christians (and later converts to Islam) who are ethnic Jews.
Yemen (South Arabia) was mostly (or very large) Jewish till they converted to Islam, so you have Arab Muslims who are biological Jews.
These Arabs,desendent of Judah (in part), later spread to Palestine and the rest of Syria including Lebanon.Mixed in with "Palestinians", who again were "gentiles" but of Jewish descent.
Lebanese are descendent of ethnic Jews, Sidonians ,etc.
"Jews" are mostly descendent of a few tribes (Simeon, Benjamin , Levi, Judah) and gentile Samaritans.Plus Romans, Greeks, and much modern Diasopora European blood like German,Polish, Russian,etc.
There isnt a single New Testament prophecy related to any human beings (at least not before the final chapters of Revelation regarding the eternity),much less Jews, returning to Palestine.Because they were already there.in the first century AD, Jews were expected to convert to Christianity and all future prophecies (which are vague,general, and highly symbolic not to mention the fact that most,if not all, already happened back in the 1st or 2nd century) related to the Bible believers (the WHOLE Bible which means Christians).This racial obsession with "Jews" returning to Palestine may SEEM like some huge sacred issue that trumps all other "Christian issues".However.it is a modern western Christian invention.
Honestly, the descendents of Judah were already in Palestine by 1900 AD.They were Palestinians: Muslims, Jews, and Christian.Prhaps even the "Israelite" Samaritans even had a little Jewish blood in them.
I dont really care.
Race became an obsolete issue after Christ died on the cross.I think it already was before.I mean honestly,it is obvious the "12 tribes" were heavily gentile.By Christs time only the tribes Levi, Benjamin, and Judah were mentioned frequently because they were honestly (about)all that was left.The 8 Northern tribes were clearly viewed as gentile and they frankly were.The Old Testament described them as gentile implants. The New Testament broadly described them as "Samaritans" almost 100% of the time.Only once was an Israelite specifically labeled as a member of one of the obsolete Northern tribe (Asher), and that maye have simply ment a resident of the land of Asher, not a biological descendent of Asher.Asher was a large land in the north-west, so maybe gentile residents (Samaritan or Canaanite)would be called children of Asher or such.Ben-Asher.
Most prophecies in the Old Testament were fulfilled when Cyrus returned the large body of Jews (southern kingdom Jews though Im sure thy mixed in with the displaced Northern tribes in Mesopotamia,not to mention many babylonian gentiles)back in around 539 BCE.
Most Christians listen to many modern day leaders who use those types of verses as somehow relating to TODAYS times.
It is true,however, that some (very very little, much less than most Christians would imagine, when compared to what is commonly taught by Hal Lindsey types) prophecies may relate to a time in the future.But if Jews returing to Palestine AFTER Christs time was such a burning "Orthadox" issue, then why is the New testament silent on the issue? HMM?
Christian exegesis clearly shows that any future prophecies yet to happen (much less than most Christians think, most prophecies already happened) were directed at Bible followers which happened to be Christians.Not to "replace" Jew's (refering to the old cannard that anybody who believes such is "replacing Jews with the church")infact many Jews became Christians.
When Moses came around and wrote the law, he didnt "replace" Noah or take anything from him.He simply offered revelation that progressively was presented.David and Solomon didnt replace Moses. The books of Kings didnt displace anybody who followed the Law (I think the law was presented around 1500BCE not around the Exile or Josiah).The Jews (or Israelites) kept on recieving the revelation.
Christ and his revelation didnt replace anything or anybody.Everybody was free to continue the religion and worship of YHWH which extended itself from Genesis1:1 to Revelation 22 after the progressive revelation.
There is no replacment theology.Just progressive revealing of Gods program.If you add another room to your, house then nothing is replaced.The same people keep on livng in the house.The SAME Jews kept on following God only it included Matthew-Revelation (or a few books less in Syriac churches)plus the gentiles Christian converts they mixed in with.
Prophecies (I hate even mentioning them sice so much that is described as "prophecy yet to happen" already happened, I feel like a scam artist even saying "prophecy" these days)that havnt happened relate to Christians.The 12 tribes became Christians.Some didnt. Many Israelites rejected the faith in 1500 BCE, 1000BCE, 500 BCE but those that accepted the revelation (past,present, and progressive) kept on going.Same in c.33 AD.
ALL Biblical prophecies related the the believing community (the tribes in O.T.&N.T. times,or the "church" in post christ times)relate to Christians.
That is the long held conclusion of standard exegesis.Infact there was no debate.
Questions.
Those who hold these new modern views about one race having rights over another in Palestine should accept the burden of proof. Present DNA evidence that proves who is a member of what race.It must be doen on every individual Jew and Palestinian (or in the case of deciding which race to side with in Israeli-Lebanese wars,on each Jew and each Lebanese).
Also, Deuteronomy 23 (and the rest of the Bible) says that ethnicity is passed on through the father line and an Israelite that has a gentile father isnt an Israelite.We all know that many Jews are only Jews on their mothers side, and even if they have a father that is a Jew by modern standards, the fathers wouldnt dont fit the Deuteronomy 23 standard.
Modern American Christians who promost this racial theology MUST respond to that.
They must explain what (racial test)constitutes an Israelite worthy of specific racial rights over certain other peoples.
They must explain why the New Testament said NOTHING about Jews returning to the land and having rights over those Christians and Muslims already living there.Romans 10:11 and Galatians 2:28 infact seemed to imply that there is no difference in rights between Jews and gentiles.And the gentiles used as an example included an ethnicity(Greek) that would include many Palestinians then and in 1948.
Why did Christ seem to indicate that violence, corruption, and especially starvation was the biggest issue for a Christian(and Christians) to tackle yet modern Christians seem to feel that picking a favorite race in Palestine (an issue absent in the New Testament) is the burning issue of our day?
These need to be anwsered.

  
Nimrod
Member (Idle past 4937 days)
Posts: 277
Joined: 06-22-2006


Message 43 of 178 (343459)
08-25-2006 11:17 PM


Reading some more.
Man.
All this anti-Arab and anti-Palestinian propaganda Im reading here sounds just like ABC, NBC, CBS, NY Times, Washington Post , Fox, etc.
Yea,yea. Those "hateful" Palestinians.640,000 of the 800,000 were expelled (at gunpoint)and the ones who fled their homes outside of Israel werent allowed to return.60 years later,we have a languishing refugee crisis that should have ended about 59-60 years ago.Millions of Palestinians are rotting in camps (some who have visited them say that it smells like the children born in them havnt had a bath their entire life),since the nations they fled into were so small that palestinians make up nearly half the total population (Jordan,Lebanon, etc.).The United States has the biggest and most powerful military in the world by multitudes, and the most interventionist and agressive foreign policy that dictates the policies of the entire world.It also happens to have the most "Christians" who are VERY politically active(to understate it).Amazing that we have allowed and infact instigated the most disgusting refugee crisis the world has ever seen.Palestine was 30% Christian, now its less than 5% Christian.
Wow, those "hateful" Palestinians.They just want to return to their homes (or the right of return at least) but that makes them "hateful".REALITY check.Rabins daughter admitted(a few weeks ago)that the 2 state solution was cooked up to "ensure the integrety of the Jewish state".Anotherwords, keep Israel majority Jewish and keep the other peoples out and away from us.
First of all, some "democracy" (cleanse the land of votes that may not fit the views of your own).
2nd of all,Im sure we will hear the elite media repeat for the 2 trillionth time some war comment by an Arab saying "drive the Jews into the sea" which is the most out of context quote the world has been forced to hear endlessly in any of our lifetimes.How about driving Palestinians back into their stolen houses and land? And 93% of it was owned and used (contrary to the "empty wasteland before 1948" propaganda often repeated).How about the immigrants (mostly Jews)living in peace with their Christian and Muslim cousins and finding land in Jordan,Sinai, or Syria, that isnt occupied instead of stealing others land?
3rd of all.What good is it to have such a powerful "Christian" nation that isnt intereted at all in promoting peace and justice,even when the victims are Christians? Cleansing the Holy Land of Christians (most descendent of Jews, I have Palestinian friends who too DNA tests at univesities who have DNA identicle to Middle Eastern Jews)is somehow a positive fulfilling of prophecy? Better read your Bible again.or read it for the first time and turn the bigots like Lindsey off.
4th of all.I can think of about 1 trillion canards that we all have heard endlessly.1 that comes to mind is the excuse that it is the Arab nations fault for the refugee camps.Yea right.A refugee crisis that could have been solved in a single year,yet goes on for 60 years, yet somebody should have seen the lifelong situation it coming.Besides,what could nations, that have a per capita income of about $1500(Jordan) to $3000(Lebanon) a year, have done with a population nearly equal to their total numbers.Here in the USA, we get a million (or so) immigrants per year in a nation 300 times the size of its newcomers,with an average income of nearly $100,000 per year, yet we have spasims that could shake the universe at such "an immigration load" every other minute.
That aside.
Anywy,I forgot to mention that the MAJOR thrust of the prophecy "experts" of modern western Christianity is that Arabs are the major enemy of Israel and that it "fulfills prophecy".
Please show me in the Bible where Ishmael is described as some MAJOR enemy of Israel in ANY prophecy.
We all know that wherever Arabs have spread, Islam has followed.The most devout Muslims in non-Arabian lands (like Syria,Lebanon,etc.) were always Arabs in the early days.We know Arabs planted Islam.We all agree there.
Back to the "racial" test issue.
Is Biblical prophecy that is related to modern day based on geography or bloodlines? Its true that the modern western Christian prophecy "experts" will tell us that it is ethnic descent but that creates a problem.Lebanon, I would say, is now less than 50% Canaanite blood (and really could be much less)when the prophecies were made.There are about 4 million modern lebanese (inclusing about 1 million Palestinian refugees which arent Lebanese)in Lebanon but OUTSIDE of Lebanon there are about 20 million Lebanese living in foreign lands.
What is the significane of the vast majority of Lebanese out side of Lebanon.How does prophecy "fulfill" itself with the genuine bulk of the peoples that the Bible is accused of making post 1900AD predictions about?
Assyrians were all killed by Turkey (2/3rds, and no outrage by the USA religious right infact I never heard a peep from Hal Lindsey types), left for foreign lands (Mexico,Usa,Europe, etc.), or are a tiny minority spread out in several Muslim countries near ancient Assyria.They are also the least likley to suppor their Muslim governments but they ar eso small that is really doesnt matter.
What says the "prophecy experts" about the prophecies related to Assyria in 2000 AD? Or any century near it?
As for Syrians, or Arameans.
They have mixed in with Jews quite heavily.Even the U.S. Supreme Court (about 100 years ago) decided that Syrians, unlike Turks and Arabs, could immigrate to the U.S. (only "whites" were allowed to immigrate to the U.S.A. till fairly recently).Because the Supreme Court decided that they had as much native Syrian and Jewish blood each than Arab blood.
I have a Syrian (ethnicity) friend who is Christian who took a DNA test and the results showed she was essentially the same as somebody Jewish in ethnicity.
O well.
So much for the new "Orthadoxy" od odern Western "Christianity".
At least we know which Christians of TODAY would be persecuting and expelling Jews of yestercentury.Jews were the great Satan in European Christian lands according to powerful Christian leaders then.The EXACT SAME type of Christians today now yet again believe their bigoted leaders demonization of certain "evil peoples" who dont belong among the others.
Some Christians may ask themselves "would I have went along with the ethnic cleansing of Jews that Christian Europeans inflicted"? "Could I have seen through the hatred despite its genuine popularity and braod support"?
Well.
See how you handle the identicle and parallel situations today?
The issues arent oo different really.
Sames religions involved.(mostly Christians and Jews plus Muslims as well)
Same ethnicities involved (Semites and the "Christian" Indo-European power base)
Tables are turned in many ways though.
Similar inflictions.

Replies to this message:
 Message 44 by xXGEARXx, posted 08-26-2006 4:35 AM Nimrod has not replied

  
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