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Author Topic:   Belief Statements - Robinrohan
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 61 of 99 (338160)
08-05-2006 9:02 PM
Reply to: Message 60 by nator
08-05-2006 7:17 PM


Re: Thank you
"Logical" and "objective" are not the same thing.

Same thing.

How does one come to the logical conclusion that, "all purposes are equal"?

Since they are all subjective, they are all equal. One might as well prefer one color to another.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 60 by nator, posted 08-05-2006 7:17 PM nator has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 64 by nator, posted 08-05-2006 9:09 PM robinrohan has responded

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 62 of 99 (338162)
08-05-2006 9:04 PM
Reply to: Message 52 by Phat
08-05-2006 2:06 PM


Re: All are welcome: good and bad experiences.
Many times, many churches are coldly exclusivist,(usually unconsciously) judgemental . . .

Those are the ones I like. I would love to be exclusive.

Edited by robinrohan, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by Phat, posted 08-05-2006 2:06 PM Phat has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 93 by Phat, posted 08-09-2006 9:31 AM robinrohan has responded

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 63 of 99 (338163)
08-05-2006 9:07 PM
Reply to: Message 59 by Faith
08-05-2006 7:00 PM


No, I did not mean it as a joke. Looking in a mirror carefully is spooky.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 59 by Faith, posted 08-05-2006 7:00 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 66 by Faith, posted 08-05-2006 9:14 PM robinrohan has not yet responded
 Message 67 by iano, posted 08-05-2006 9:21 PM robinrohan has responded

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2257 days)
Posts: 12961
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 64 of 99 (338165)
08-05-2006 9:09 PM
Reply to: Message 61 by robinrohan
08-05-2006 9:02 PM


Re: Thank you
"Logical" and "objective" are not the same thing.

quote:
Same thing.

Nope.

Any logic begins with a premise which is an assumption which may or may not be subjective.

How does one come to the logical conclusion that, "all purposes are equal"?

quote:
Since they are all subjective, they are all equal. One might as well prefer one color to another.

"Subjective" is not, by definition, "equal".

Show me the logical steps by which you came to your conclusion.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 61 by robinrohan, posted 08-05-2006 9:02 PM robinrohan has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 65 by robinrohan, posted 08-05-2006 9:12 PM nator has responded

    
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 65 of 99 (338166)
08-05-2006 9:12 PM
Reply to: Message 64 by nator
08-05-2006 9:09 PM


Re: Thank you
Any logic begins with a premise which is an assumption which may or may not be subjective.

I'm talking about the logic, not the premises.

"Subjective" is not, by definition, "equal".

It is in terms of being evidence of anything. If one's idea is subjective, it's no good as evidence.

Edited by robinrohan, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 64 by nator, posted 08-05-2006 9:09 PM nator has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 69 by nator, posted 08-05-2006 9:23 PM robinrohan has responded

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 26721
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 66 of 99 (338168)
08-05-2006 9:14 PM
Reply to: Message 63 by robinrohan
08-05-2006 9:07 PM


No, I did not mean it as a joke. Looking in a mirror carefully is spooky.

I no longer look very carefully. It's discouraging, depressing, but not spooky. Though I guess it could be if one looked that carefully.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 63 by robinrohan, posted 08-05-2006 9:07 PM robinrohan has not yet responded

    
iano
Member (Idle past 797 days)
Posts: 6164
From: Co. Wicklow, Ireland.
Joined: 07-27-2005


Message 67 of 99 (338169)
08-05-2006 9:21 PM
Reply to: Message 63 by robinrohan
08-05-2006 9:07 PM


Windows to the soul indeed
Your taking as close a glimpse into eternity as one can. You are looking at you looking at you looking at you. Perpetual you.

We spend a lot of our time escaping ourselves and to look into ones own eyes allows no escape from yourself. You are locked into looking at yourself for once - with the only form of escape being to look away again

Which any person will do if they permit the self-examination that tends from the act. There is even more reason to look away from ones own eyes as there is those troubled eyes you catch on the street from time to time - and look away from. You can see the trouble in your own even better

No place to run or hide. One must look away. Looking at a dead spirit is looking at death. It is spooky. Or looking at an alive spirit which is still a sinner. For sin is ugly

One of the benefits of heaven - you can finally look into your own eyes. What pretty eyes they must be

Edited by iano, : No reason given.

Edited by iano, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 63 by robinrohan, posted 08-05-2006 9:07 PM robinrohan has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 68 by robinrohan, posted 08-05-2006 9:23 PM iano has responded
 Message 70 by nator, posted 08-05-2006 9:25 PM iano has responded
 Message 80 by sidelined, posted 08-05-2006 11:23 PM iano has not yet responded

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 68 of 99 (338170)
08-05-2006 9:23 PM
Reply to: Message 67 by iano
08-05-2006 9:21 PM


Re: Windows to the soul indeed
Looking at a dead spirit is looking at death. It is spooky

This thing I'm looking at in the mirror is not dead. It's just not me.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 67 by iano, posted 08-05-2006 9:21 PM iano has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 71 by iano, posted 08-05-2006 9:26 PM robinrohan has not yet responded
 Message 75 by Faith, posted 08-05-2006 9:37 PM robinrohan has responded
 Message 77 by Faith, posted 08-05-2006 9:55 PM robinrohan has not yet responded

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2257 days)
Posts: 12961
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 69 of 99 (338171)
08-05-2006 9:23 PM
Reply to: Message 65 by robinrohan
08-05-2006 9:12 PM


Re: Thank you
Any logic begins with a premise which is an assumption which may or may not be subjective.

quote:
I'm talking about the logic, not the premises.

But all logic begins with premises, and those may or may not be subjective.

If you begin with subjectivity, it doesn't suddenly become "objective" once you apply the rules of logic.

"Subjective" is not, by definition, "equal".

quote:
It is in terms of being evidence of anything. If one's ideal is subjective, it's no good as evidence.

Show me the logical steps by which you came to your conclusion.

Your original statement was:

quote:
Viewed objectively, all purposes are equal

I, what you mean to say is, "Relying only on empirical evidence and logic, one can't say one purpose is better than another purpose", then I agree.

But you can't then say that there is no basis whatsoever for judging one basis as superior than any other, which is not true.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by robinrohan, posted 08-05-2006 9:12 PM robinrohan has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 73 by robinrohan, posted 08-05-2006 9:29 PM nator has responded

    
nator
Member (Idle past 2257 days)
Posts: 12961
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 70 of 99 (338172)
08-05-2006 9:25 PM
Reply to: Message 67 by iano
08-05-2006 9:21 PM


Re: Windows to the soul indeed
You assume that everyone has as much trouble looking into their own eyes as you do, ian.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 67 by iano, posted 08-05-2006 9:21 PM iano has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 72 by iano, posted 08-05-2006 9:28 PM nator has responded

    
iano
Member (Idle past 797 days)
Posts: 6164
From: Co. Wicklow, Ireland.
Joined: 07-27-2005


Message 71 of 99 (338173)
08-05-2006 9:26 PM
Reply to: Message 68 by robinrohan
08-05-2006 9:23 PM


Re: Windows to the soul indeed
A person has a dead spirit even though they are physically alive. It is you alright. As you are. It is discordant because it is not the way it is meant to be. Somethings wrong with you.

Because something IS wrong with you. Which he wants to put right.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 68 by robinrohan, posted 08-05-2006 9:23 PM robinrohan has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 74 by nator, posted 08-05-2006 9:36 PM iano has not yet responded

  
iano
Member (Idle past 797 days)
Posts: 6164
From: Co. Wicklow, Ireland.
Joined: 07-27-2005


Message 72 of 99 (338174)
08-05-2006 9:28 PM
Reply to: Message 70 by nator
08-05-2006 9:25 PM


Re: Windows to the soul indeed
I assumed reflection on self whilst doing so. You can assert that you do do if you like. But how do you know that you are doing that. Have you demonstrable evidence that you do this? :)
This message is a reply to:
 Message 70 by nator, posted 08-05-2006 9:25 PM nator has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 78 by nator, posted 08-05-2006 9:56 PM iano has responded

  
robinrohan
Inactive Member


Message 73 of 99 (338175)
08-05-2006 9:29 PM
Reply to: Message 69 by nator
08-05-2006 9:23 PM


Re: Thank you
Relying only on empirical evidence and logic, one can't say one purpose is better than another purpose", then I agree.

Well, obviously that's what I meant.

But you can't then say that there is no basis whatsoever for judging one basis as superior than any other, which is not true.

If it's not a result of induction or deduction, it's worthless in terms of being evidence of truth. Surely you would agree with this?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 69 by nator, posted 08-05-2006 9:23 PM nator has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 76 by nator, posted 08-05-2006 9:49 PM robinrohan has responded

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2257 days)
Posts: 12961
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 74 of 99 (338177)
08-05-2006 9:36 PM
Reply to: Message 71 by iano
08-05-2006 9:26 PM


Re: Windows to the soul indeed
There's nothing fundamentally wrong with me.

It's such a trajedy that you think that something is fundamentally wrong with you.

No wonder my picture bothers you so much.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 71 by iano, posted 08-05-2006 9:26 PM iano has not yet responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 26721
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 75 of 99 (338178)
08-05-2006 9:37 PM
Reply to: Message 68 by robinrohan
08-05-2006 9:23 PM


Re: Windows to the soul indeed
This thing I'm looking at in the mirror is not dead. It's just not me.

OK, now I get it. Sort of. In my case it's probably just the melancholy fact of aging, though you may mean something more existential about it. Yes, that's definitely not me in the mirror NOW. I was willing to own her up to, oh, maybe twenty years ago.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 68 by robinrohan, posted 08-05-2006 9:23 PM robinrohan has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 94 by robinrohan, posted 08-09-2006 10:09 AM Faith has not yet responded

    
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