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Author Topic:   Was Christ a communist?
Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 16 of 128 (389411)
03-13-2007 1:19 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by bluegenes
03-13-2007 7:58 AM


There's a long history of Christian communism, going back way before the modern secular and often atheistic or anti-theistic communism with which the word is usually associated today. Many have argued that the various forms of Marxism were born out of the Christian ethos.
This sounds like some other speculations I've heard. Sometimes there are some asinine discussions on whether Jesus was a liberal or a conservative; a Democrat or a Republican. He is neither. Jesus is Jesus-- and there is no other like him.
As you've alluded to, there are some forms of communism that are more compatible with Christianity then others. Stalinism is in no way compatible with Christianity, and neither is Marxism. However, since the ideal of communism is a very pure belief, the real question is why no one is able to make it a lasting reality.
Here are two obvious examples of the kind of Biblical extracts used by Christian communists to make their point:
Acts 2: 42, 44, and 45:
quote:
And they continued steadfastly in the apostles' doctrine and in fellowship ... 44 And all that believed were together, and had all things in common; 45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need.
All this is saying is that they left behind their worldly goods and gave them to the needy, so they can take up Jesus' last command, which is the Great Commission. I don't see communism anywhere in there.
Matthew 19:16-24
quote:
And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? 17 And he said unto him, Why do you ask me about what is good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. 18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, 19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet? 21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me. 22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions. 23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven. 24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
This is a caveat about the superficial love of money and how to avoid its pitfalls.
You can see the similarity between the first and the basic principle of all communists: "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs".
Communism is the ideal to destroy the culture of the proletarian by removing class structure and subverting the status quo. You are making communism out to be a society where people give things away, where you get something for nothing. That isn't even slightly true. What may appear to be free healthcare or free housing is not. In a communist economy, most of your earnings go to taxes. You have to pay into those services just like anyone else.
These verses are talking about giving to the poor as a charitable deed to the needy. I see no similarity.
About the most similarity I see with the early Apostles were that they lived in a communal environment. This wasn't for everyone. These men left behind their families for long periods of time. Obviously that type of environment would not be conducive to a whole society. I think it is a mistake make parallels with an economic system with a moral issue. This is what ultimately drives communism to its failure. Its supposed to be an economic system, that slowly synthesizes into an ideology that writes checks it simply cannot cash. It can't make due on its promises.

"Somewhere at the back of my father's mind, at the bottom of his heart, in the depth of his soul, there was an empty space that had once been filled by God and he never found anything else to put in it... At the centre of me is always an eternally terrible pain - a curious wild pain - a searching for something beyond what the world contains." -Bertrand Russell

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by bluegenes, posted 03-13-2007 7:58 AM bluegenes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by bluegenes, posted 03-13-2007 2:13 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied
 Message 22 by ringo, posted 03-13-2007 2:26 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied

  
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