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Author Topic:   Has the Theory of Evolution benefited mankind?
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Message 76 of 104 (302858)
04-10-2006 10:09 AM
Reply to: Message 74 by Faith
04-10-2006 9:39 AM


Re: Here's one
Faith writes:
I am not posting on science threads because the powers that be don't like my style,...
I guess this could be considered accurate, if by style you mean ignoring moderator requests and persistently posting off-topic.
...but I will answer this just to repeat my usual theme song, which I've certainly said often enough: Genetics is not the ToE.
As has been suggested to you several times, if you would like to discuss the definition of evolution and/or propose your own definition then please propose a thread for this purpose. But please do not introduce your own private definition into threads as rebuttal. What you are doing is analogous to entering a debate about which car engine has the most horsepower and arguing that the definition of horsepower is wrong. Your argument would get lots of attention, but debate on the original topic would cease.
Because of your persistence at trying to draw threads off-topic, I've removed your posting privileges in all the science forums.

--Percy
EvC Forum Director

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radjennifer
Inactive Junior Member


Message 77 of 104 (303683)
04-12-2006 8:30 PM


Well I wouldn't exactly say it has "benefited" mankind quite,
but it does have it's valid points
I'm Christian & totally believe in God, and also believe evolution might be true. Just curious, does anyone have any arguments to that?

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scoff
Member
Posts: 37
Joined: 01-20-2006


Message 78 of 104 (303726)
04-12-2006 10:13 PM
Reply to: Message 77 by radjennifer
04-12-2006 8:30 PM


Too Much Evidence
Jen:
Well I wouldn't exactly say it has "benefited" mankind quite,
but it does have it's valid points
I'm Christian & totally believe in God, and also believe evolution might be true. Just curious, does anyone have any arguments to that?
There are many shades of believers and non-believers. (As a child, I was a believer myself.) Not speaking for anyone else in this forum, but I'm sure you'll find some who agree and some who don't. As for myself, I have the opposite view. I'm convinced evolution is the sole reason for our existence on this planet. There's too much evidence to ignore, too much interlinked evidence in many different fields of science, and evolution explains that evidence better than the mythology of a 2000 year old culture.
It doesn't mean I'm right or wrong, it's just my view.

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pesto
Member (Idle past 5587 days)
Posts: 63
From: Chicago, IL
Joined: 04-05-2006


Message 79 of 104 (303902)
04-13-2006 11:59 AM
Reply to: Message 77 by radjennifer
04-12-2006 8:30 PM


Well I wouldn't exactly say it has "benefited" mankind quite
If you haven't read through the thread yet, at least check out Message 46.

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EZscience
Member (Idle past 5154 days)
Posts: 961
From: A wheatfield in Kansas
Joined: 04-14-2005


Message 80 of 104 (304205)
04-14-2006 11:34 AM
Reply to: Message 79 by pesto
04-13-2006 11:59 AM


Another One
Quetzal's examples are good ones, but I could fill pages with more of them.
How about just one.
The expression of the genes for Baccillus thuringensis toxins in corn have revolutionized control of a key pest of corn, the European corn borer. However, both Monsanto and the EPA have insisted that farmers continue to plant a fraction of their land to conventional corn to serve as a 'genetic refuge', The rationale is based on understanding of the resistance evolution in insects and the recognition that planting *all* the corn with Bt expression would comprise strong directional selection for resistance that should be countered by ensuring some susceptible genotypes would be surviving in the refuges every year. These then mate with any resistant ones coming out of the BT corn and dilute the strength directional selection for resistance, assuming any gene for resistance will be recessive, which is most likely.
Acreage planted to BT corn has increased every year for the past 5-6 years and is now in the 10's of millions. BT corn has saved farmers money and also reduced the usage of dangerous insecticides in corn significantly. And we have no significant resistance yet detected in the insect population because *evolutionary reasoning* was used to guide the application of this new technology and ensure its sustained viability.

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pesto
Member (Idle past 5587 days)
Posts: 63
From: Chicago, IL
Joined: 04-05-2006


Message 81 of 104 (304241)
04-14-2006 2:18 PM
Reply to: Message 80 by EZscience
04-14-2006 11:34 AM


Re: Another One
That right there is pretty cool.

This message is a reply to:
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EZscience
Member (Idle past 5154 days)
Posts: 961
From: A wheatfield in Kansas
Joined: 04-14-2005


Message 82 of 104 (304247)
04-14-2006 2:35 PM
Reply to: Message 81 by pesto
04-14-2006 2:18 PM


And Another One
The applications of evolutionary reasoning to predicting insect behavior for pest management purposes are myriad. In many cases, it enables us to predict how insects will respond to a particular management tactic BEFORE it is tested.
A good example is management of the apple maggot fly in apple orchards pioneered by the recently deceased entomologist Ron Prokopy.
Ron's group found that female flies mark a fruit after they lay an egg in it using a special 'oviposition marker pheromone' that all females recognize and respond to. This compund was next identified and then synthesized. The problem - how to use it to reduce damage to apples? Maybe spray the pheromone on trees to keep the flies from laying eggs? But not so fast...
Brief backgound: Apple maggots are cannibals and only one larva will survive in a fruit - hence evolution of the marker pheromone so females can avoid laying in occupied fruit.
Problem: theory of evolution (behavioral evolution, re: Maynard Smith's game theory) predicts that response to the pheromone will break down after a large number of fruit are encountered by a gravid female - if all fruit are occupied, the female can still gain SOME fitness by letting her larvae compete in occupied fruit. So the pheromone BY ITSELF is not going to work.
With a good knowledge of how female flies forage for fruit (they like the biggest, best fruit -same as us - and they search visually)
Ron figured out a way to make it work.
You place a single insecticide-impregnated trap in each tree that resembles the largest, reddest apple in the tree.
Then you spray the trees with the pheromone.
Now as flies arrive, the won;t lay on the first few fruit they land on because they detect the pheromone. Within on or two flights they die on the trap -BEFORE attenuation of their response to the pheromone.

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CACTUSJACKmankin
Member (Idle past 6273 days)
Posts: 48
Joined: 04-22-2006


Message 83 of 104 (306323)
04-24-2006 4:58 PM
Reply to: Message 82 by EZscience
04-14-2006 2:35 PM


Re: And Another One
I think the greatest benefit of evolution is knowing how we got here. It's one of the fundimental questions that humans have been asking since we've had the ability to ask it. The fossil record for humans is quite clear from the three genera and over a dozen species that separate us from our common ancestor with chimpanzees. Then there's the genetic and molecular biologic evidence which further prove relatedness, especially with protein sequencing and mitochondrial DNA. Philosophically, it puts us in our place and shows us how we really aren't as special as we'd like to think we are. Galileo did a similar thing when he showed that the earth is not the center of the universe. Humans are like any other animal, we just happen to be orders of magnitude more complex because of our large brains.
So, the benefits of knowing how viruses, bacteria, and pests evolve don't even compare to the fact that evolution gives us the answer to one of life's major questions.

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EZscience
Member (Idle past 5154 days)
Posts: 961
From: A wheatfield in Kansas
Joined: 04-14-2005


Message 84 of 104 (306426)
04-25-2006 7:39 AM
Reply to: Message 83 by CACTUSJACKmankin
04-24-2006 4:58 PM


Tangible benefits...
I agree that evolutionary theory pretty much delineates our taxonomic status in the world, or 'how we got here'. (For some this is not enough - they also demand a 'why'. although I am not sure there is a 'why'). But my interpretation of the OP was a request for practical,tangible benefits that evolutionary thought has provided the human race.
One example not yet touched on is plant breeding which has provided us with all the currently grown crop varieties we rely on for food. Plant breeding relies heavily on evolutionary biology both methodologically and theoretically. ToE also reminds us that in breeding plants that produce concentrations of resources desirable to us (large seeds, high yields, etc.), we are often forcing tradeoffs in plant physiology that can result in requirements for supplemental inputs from us (fertilizer, herbicides, insecticides, fungicides) if the plant is to reach its yield potential.

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 Message 83 by CACTUSJACKmankin, posted 04-24-2006 4:58 PM CACTUSJACKmankin has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 85 by CACTUSJACKmankin, posted 04-25-2006 11:48 AM EZscience has replied

  
CACTUSJACKmankin
Member (Idle past 6273 days)
Posts: 48
Joined: 04-22-2006


Message 85 of 104 (306495)
04-25-2006 11:48 AM
Reply to: Message 84 by EZscience
04-25-2006 7:39 AM


Re: Tangible benefits...
I know what the OP was talking about, my point is simply that the tangible and practical benefits are irrelevant in comparison to the contribution to our knowlege of ourselves and how we got here.

This message is a reply to:
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EZscience
Member (Idle past 5154 days)
Posts: 961
From: A wheatfield in Kansas
Joined: 04-14-2005


Message 86 of 104 (306508)
04-25-2006 1:13 PM
Reply to: Message 85 by CACTUSJACKmankin
04-25-2006 11:48 AM


Re: Tangible benefits...
CJM writes:
the tangible and practical benefits are irrelevant in comparison to the contribution to our knowlege of ourselves and how we got here
That's a rather subjective judgement on your part.
While I happen to agree that it also an important contribution of ToE, many have not reached the point of accepting that ToE tells us anything about human origins at all.
I liked the concept of this thread because of it's potential to lure in doubters of evolution who still might be curious about how it has been used to assist human advancement in practical terms. The ultimate goal is education. If we can repeatedly demonstrate the utility and value of ToE reasoning in practical terms, its extrapolation to more 'religiously-charged' issues might eventually meet with less emotional resistance among the 'spiritually-inclined'.

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2ice_baked_taters
Member (Idle past 5851 days)
Posts: 566
From: Boulder Junction WI.
Joined: 02-16-2006


Message 87 of 104 (306621)
04-26-2006 2:42 AM


I have often asked myself this question. Indeed...beyond the fact that it is an interesting idea....ok..this was facinating....so now what?
Long before the theory of evolution, man manipulated plant and animal species. Can we say that it would not have been possible to realise many of todays practicle applications of examples cited without this concept? I think it likely that the theory unified ideas and in that sense it was able to inspire more people to want to know more.
As to evolution on an historic scale I believe it would be accurate to say that ToE has given us a basic framework to explain how "a" likely arose from "b" in a biologically mechanical sense. Can we say anything beyond that?
It has fallen prey to some who use it to attempt to advance thier beliefs but we do that with any concept of this nature.

  
ikabod
Member (Idle past 4493 days)
Posts: 365
From: UK
Joined: 03-13-2006


Message 88 of 104 (306634)
04-26-2006 4:53 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Dierotao
04-05-2006 12:38 PM


the ToE started the search for the mechinisum of inheritance which has lead to the moden science of genetics ..which is clearly both a benifit and a danger
the ToE has caused the myths about the origins of the man to be questioned , and scientific theories put forward ....which in honest hand rebuffs racist doctrines ... yes in corrupt hands it does the reverse .. but then so does the word of god/s ...
the ToE by the mass public debate is caused has brought science it to the public domain and has lead to greater awareness and questioning of "given facts " in science , religion and politics .

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tanzanos
Inactive Member


Message 89 of 104 (307384)
04-28-2006 12:05 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Dierotao
04-05-2006 12:38 PM


the benefits from evolution!
Evolution has benefited manking in more than one way. Firstly evolution allowed for biology to become a science, and thus through biology medicine benefited. Our understanding of the organisms be they worms or birds or human has taken the art of healing from excorcisms to where it belongs: In hopitals. Let us not forget that Biology without the ttheory of evolution makes no sense. Also All science is interrelated; biology,geology,chemistry etc, all have a common denominator: The laws of physics. Anyone who thinks evolution has not benefited mankind is ungrateful to say the least. He or she enjoy the fruits of science but on the other hand they denounce it.

Mighty is the sword that draws blood!
Mightier is the Pen that draws ink!
Mightiest is the tongue that draws ears! (Yiannis Mantheakis)

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EZscience
Member (Idle past 5154 days)
Posts: 961
From: A wheatfield in Kansas
Joined: 04-14-2005


Message 90 of 104 (307422)
04-28-2006 2:37 PM
Reply to: Message 89 by tanzanos
04-28-2006 12:05 PM


Re: the benefits from evolution!
tanzanos writes:
...biology,geology,chemistry etc, all have a common denominator: The laws of physics.
I agree that ToE has served to unify other scientific enterprises. It provided biology with an essential temporal component, and so brought it into concert with other disciplines that had already incorporated temporal compenents.
The laws of physics indicate that one dimension of reality is time. There exists an 'arrow of time', i.e. it has directionality. Events in the past cannot be undone, and other events are contingent on those that came beforehand.
Evolutionary theory is really no more than an objective characterization of contingent biological events along the arrow of time. To deny evolution is, in one sense, to deny that all things must change over time, regardless of whether they are organic or inorganic.

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