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Author
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Topic: Must religion be logical?
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Sure and for the sake of argument, Yes. Well, I don't know that that's implausible. It sounds plausible. And if we go a step further, we might think, "Suppose this 'soul' is incorporeal. Where did it come from? If it didn't in some strange way evolve from a corporeal thing, it must have come from an incorporeal thing. But the only thing we know of that might be incorporeal is our minds (soul). But we are not things: we are beings. So perhaps this incorporeality came from an incorporeal Being." Edited by robinrohan, : No reason given.
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member
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So perhaps this incorporeality came from an incorporeal Being. Yeah, I'd call it God. I don't think we're being illogical either. To say that because there is no scientific evidence for the soul then we must assume it doesn't exist seems more illogical to me, outside of the lab, that is. Its almost like putting faith in science, ya know?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 46 by robinrohan, posted 08-10-2006 5:28 PM | | robinrohan has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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To say that because there is no scientific evidence for the soul then we must assume it doesn't exist seems more illogical to me, outside of the lab, that is. Its almost like putting faith in science, ya know? Yes, I see what you are saying now. It's about private experience versus experience that can be tested. If it can be tested, it can't be private.
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DominionSeraph
Member (Idle past 4776 days) Posts: 365 From: on High Joined: 01-26-2005
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You don't test it. You just weigh it mentally and decide if you believe it or not.
weigh it against what? Plausibility Talk about incoherent. What you're doing is weighing it against what (you think) you know about the universe to determine its plausibility. Change universes, and you change what is plausible. (Can the nerdy girl in school become an uber-witch who comes within an inch of destroying the world? Sure, if you're in the Buffy the Vampire Slayer universe. Here? Not so much.) So, the question becomes: How much of what you think is true is crap?
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DominionSeraph
Member (Idle past 4776 days) Posts: 365 From: on High Joined: 01-26-2005
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Are you saying that you always use: "Assertion X has no connection to reality. Therefore, X is true." That doesn't look like it'd work. And if you're using a method that doesn't work...
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member
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What you're doing is weighing it against what (you think) you know about the universe to determine its plausibility. What's wrong with that? Hey, I jumped a 25' double on my dirt bike last weekend. Do you believe me? How do you decide? Do we really have to collect evidence for everything before we believe it or can we just weigh it mentally? You could weigh "it against what (you think) you know about the universe to determine its plausibility", no? How was I being incoherent?
So, the question becomes: How much of what you think is true is crap? Well I think the stuff that I think is true is true. For the stuff that I can't verify, that I have to weigh out mentally, I don't know how I can tell if it is crap or not other than just thinking about whether or not I think its possible. Any suggestions?
Change universes, and you change what is plausible. I don't get the point of that line, we can't change universes.
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 54 by Woodsy, posted 09-24-2006 4:04 PM | | New Cat's Eye has replied |
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member
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Are you saying that you always use: "Assertion X has no connection to reality. Therefore, X is true." Nope, not even close.
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member
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Message 53 of 164 (347308)
09-07-2006 3:17 PM
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bump for kalimero
Re: Message 43 I see you're logged in. Remember this thread? Has it been too long to reply? Just reply to message 43, if you will.
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Woodsy
Member (Idle past 3396 days) Posts: 301 From: Burlington, Canada Joined: 08-30-2006
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How about the "I don't know" position? I suspect we would all believe a lot less "crap" if only it wasn't so hard to say "I don't know", and wait patiently for more information. Personally, I suspect that this is the origion for much of religion.
In addition to "I don't know", the idea of degrees of confidence can be very useful.
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Butcer 
Inactive Member
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Message 55 of 164 (352023)
09-25-2006 7:29 AM
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Reply to: Message 3 by robinrohan
08-09-2006 8:55 AM
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removed spam garbage Edited by AdminAsgara, : No reason given.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 3 by robinrohan, posted 08-09-2006 8:55 AM | | robinrohan has not replied |
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Legend
Member (Idle past 5028 days) Posts: 1226 From: Wales, UK Joined: 05-07-2004
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Message 56 of 164 (352039)
09-25-2006 8:18 AM
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Reply to: Message 54 by Woodsy
09-24-2006 4:04 PM
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God of the gaps
quote:
How about the "I don't know" position? I suspect we would all believe a lot less "crap" if only it wasn't so hard to say "I don't know", and wait patiently for more information. Personally, I suspect that this is the origion for much of religion.
Spot on. It's called the 'God of the gaps' mentality. Anything we can't (currently) explain we attribute to the gods. When we finally fill in the gaps in our knowledge the gods seem to just wither away and die. We all know what happened to Zeus since we discovered where thunderbolts really come from! 
"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the pigeon and some days you'll be the statue."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 54 by Woodsy, posted 09-24-2006 4:04 PM | | Woodsy has not replied |
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member
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Message 57 of 164 (352058)
09-25-2006 10:02 AM
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Reply to: Message 54 by Woodsy
09-24-2006 4:04 PM
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quote:
How about the "I don't know" position?
I don't like it. I want to know as much as possible. For the things that I cannot objectively determine, I'll just try to figure them out some other way, or talk to people and get a good model through our discussions/philosophical musings.
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I suspect we would all believe a lot less "crap" if only it wasn't so hard to say "I don't know", and wait patiently for more information.
Clutch writes: Engineer the future now. Damn tommorow, future now! Throw the switches, prime the charge, Yesterday's for mice and gods. I'm impatient. I don't want to sit back and wait for more info. I want to have a real position, 'cause 'i don't know' is too lame for my comfort. I'd rather think about the possibilities and decide on what I believe than sit back and not know.
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Personally, I suspect that this is the origion for much of religion.
yeah, probably.
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In addition to "I don't know", the idea of degrees of confidence can be very useful.
Yes, when they can be quantified.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 54 by Woodsy, posted 09-24-2006 4:04 PM | | Woodsy has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 58 by Woodsy, posted 09-25-2006 12:42 PM | | New Cat's Eye has replied |
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Woodsy
Member (Idle past 3396 days) Posts: 301 From: Burlington, Canada Joined: 08-30-2006
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Let's try a little experiment (following Tolkein). I ask: "What do I have in my pockets?" How do you proceed? (hint: I have only things that I commonly do, this is not a setup.)
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New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member
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Message 59 of 164 (352125)
09-25-2006 2:32 PM
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Reply to: Message 58 by Woodsy
09-25-2006 12:42 PM
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Let's try a little experiment (following Tolkein). alright
"What do I have in my pockets?" I don't know, what?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 58 by Woodsy, posted 09-25-2006 12:42 PM | | Woodsy has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 60 by Woodsy, posted 09-25-2006 2:49 PM | | New Cat's Eye has replied |
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Woodsy
Member (Idle past 3396 days) Posts: 301 From: Burlington, Canada Joined: 08-30-2006
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That's what I hoped you would reply. You set out to find out!
Now, suppose I am slow in replying (I will answer soon, not teasing), and you are feeling impatient (as you might, according to your post), how might you carry on?
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