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Author | Topic: Christianity: For entertainment purposes only? | |||||||||||||||||||||||
SqU1r3 Junior Member (Idle past 5777 days) Posts: 6 From: Cape Town, South Africa Joined: |
"Christians help people because they want a reward when they die"
Brian, this is a hugely mistaken claim. You cannot soley base your argument on your OWN assumptions as to how other Christians live.Christians reach out to others in gestures of Love and kindness, as instructed from scripture. As a side note, try an Evangelical church sometime. You'll be surprised as to how God moves in those places... Sometimes even to live is an act of courage. ”Seneca
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Grizz Member (Idle past 5492 days) Posts: 318 Joined: |
Christians help people because they want a reward when they die" Brian, this is a hugely mistaken claim. You cannot solely base your argument on your OWN assumptions as to how other Christians live. Christians reach out to others in gestures of Love and kindness, as instructed from scripture. I recently read an article by NT Wright were here offered up a rebuttal to Liberal Christian theologians who deny the resurrection. One quote struck me as odd: "If the resurrection is not true then all is for naught. What is the point of being a Christian if not for the resurrection?" In other words, why would you want to be a Christian and follow the moral commandments if not for the truth of a redemptive act which ensured eternal life for Christians? So, If the resurrection were not true, would you still think it worthwhile to "reach out to others in gestures of Love and kindness," or do you need instructions and the presence of an implicit reward or punishment to do such things? Let's say Jesus were to tell you that the gates of Heaven have been closed and nobody else gets in; your death represents the expiration of your existence. You are free to do as you wish without fear of reward or punishment. Out of your love for God you are asked to continue to follow the moral law and commandments, not because of a reward or punishment but because of your respect for God who gave you life. Of course, as a Christian I understand your response will be "this is impossible"; still, as a hypothetical, what would your answer be and how would your view the "moral law" as presented in scriptures? Are gestures of love and kindness to be done for their own sake or because we are told do these things? Which approach to morality is more shallow and which is more "righteous?" Which do you think a God would be more pleased by? Edited by Grizz, : No reason given.
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Brian Member (Idle past 4980 days) Posts: 4659 From: Scotland Joined: |
Hoots mon!
I am neither Celtic nor pure! And sometimes it is so cold here that you don't need to put woad on to look blue.
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Brian Member (Idle past 4980 days) Posts: 4659 From: Scotland Joined: |
You said on the streets where you can't avoid them. I never said this.
Now you're changing your gripe/rant to evangelists who you can avoid if you don't like their message or collection plates to support their work. I'm not changing anything. My initial post was regarding steert preachers in the UK,and obviously where I live in particular. Street preachers in the USA are not covered by the new UK law, so your mention of USA street preachers is irrelevant. Are you telling me that there are no ministers/preachers/priests/pastors etc that do not make a wage from preaching?
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Brian Member (Idle past 4980 days) Posts: 4659 From: Scotland Joined: |
Besides, all is the LoRD's anyways, so it's fully within his "rights" to ask for a little back. Can you prove this or is this information for entertainment purposes only? Edited by Brian, : No reason given.
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Brian Member (Idle past 4980 days) Posts: 4659 From: Scotland Joined: |
Christians reach out to others in gestures of Love and kindness, as instructed from scripture. And scripture is quite clear about what will happen if you do not reach out to others with love and kindness. Yahweh is very good at threatening people into doing what He wants them to, and Christians will do it because they know how evil and jealous yahweh is.
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
Brian writes: And scripture is quite clear about what will happen if you do not reach out to others with love and kindness. What will happen to a born again child of God's? God Bless, "John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."
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Buzsaw Inactive Member |
Grizz writes: I recently read an article by NT Wright were here offered up a rebuttal to Liberal Christian theologians who deny the resurrection. One quote struck me as odd: "If the resurrection is not true then all is for naught. What is the point of being a Christian if not for the resurrection?" In other words, why would you want to be a Christian and follow the moral commandments if not for the truth of a redemptive act which ensured eternal life for Christians? So, If the resurrection were not true, would you still think it worthwhile to "reach out to others in gestures of Love and kindness," or do you need instructions and the presence of an implicit reward or punishment to do such things? Let's say Jesus were to tell you that the gates of Heaven have been closed and nobody else gets in; your death represents the expiration of your existence. You are free to do as you wish without fear of reward or punishment. Out of your love for God you are asked to continue to follow the moral law and commandments, not because of a reward or punishment but because of your respect for God who gave you life. Of course, as a Christian I understand your response will be "this is impossible"; still, as a hypothetical, what would your answer be and how would your view the "moral law" as presented in scriptures? Are gestures of love and kindness to be done for their own sake or because we are told do these things? Which approach to morality is more shallow and which is more "righteous?" Which do you think a God would be more pleased by? 1. If Jesus spoke and I knew the message was from him I'd likely do his bidding, knowing he knew what was best for me and my descendents. 2. I would consider the history of the world, knowing that here and now life on earth works best when Biblical principles are applied to cultures. 3. I would likely not bother with promoting the ministry of the gospel of salvation with funds and participation. 4. I'd continue to attend church services and worship Jehovah God, knowing he does exist. BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW. The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.
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Brian Member (Idle past 4980 days) Posts: 4659 From: Scotland Joined: |
What will happen to a born again child of God's? According to Christian mythology they will live happily ever after in the Kingdom of God. Can you tell me what will happen to someone who isn't a born again child of God? Edited by Brian, : Grammar and spelling
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
Brian writes: According to Christian mythology they will live happily ever after in the Kingdom of God. You missed the question. You said they are doing good deeds to be rewarded in the hearafter. I asked if a born again child of God did not do the things you said people were doing to be rewarded in the hearafter what would happen to them.
Brian writes: Can you tell me what will happen to someone who isn't a born again child of God? They get to spend eternity with their father the Devil. God Bless, "John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."
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Coragyps Member (Idle past 755 days) Posts: 5553 From: Snyder, Texas, USA Joined: |
'Can you tell me what will happen to someone who isn't a born again child of God?'
"They get to spend eternity with their father the Devil." Is there an echo here? Something about infants and righteous savages? "The wretched world lies now under the tyranny of foolishness; things are believed by Christians of such absurdity as no one ever could aforetime induce the heathen to believe." - Agobard of Lyons, ca. 830 AD
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Fosdick  Suspended Member (Idle past 5521 days) Posts: 1793 From: Upper Slobovia Joined: |
Brian writes:
"Woad," of course! Thanks for the correct spelling. Scotland has always been a fascination to me. Just curious: Do people from Scotland call themselves "Scots," "Scotch," pr 'Scottish"? Hoots mon!I am neither Celtic nor pure! And sometimes it is so cold here that you don't need to put woad on to look blue. ”HM
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Brian Member (Idle past 4980 days) Posts: 4659 From: Scotland Joined: |
I asked if a born again child of God did not do the things you said people were doing to be rewarded in the hearafter what would happen to them. You didnt ask this you asked: "What will happen to a born again child of God's?" Anyway, your born again child of God who doesn't beg the ass off God and doesn't do good deeds will join 'their father the devil'. You worship such a lovely God you know. It is intensely embarrassing that adults can take Christianity seriously. What is missing in your life that you have to cling to an ancient fairytale to make you happy, or was it some traumatic episode that done something to your mind? A recovering alcoholic maybe, or drug addict, or NDE?
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LinearAq Member (Idle past 4697 days) Posts: 598 From: Pocomoke City, MD Joined: |
ICANT writes: What will happen to a born again child of God's? According to Jesus in Matthew 25:
quote:Looks like they burn too. At least I don't see something that excludes born-agains from the parameters of this parable. Likewise if they don't adequately invest what God has given them. Also from Matthew 25:
quote: Again, no exclusion concerning those who follow Paul's conversion process. Seriously though... It seems that most Christians who help out at shelters or soup lines are there because their church already sponsors/helps in those places. The members of the church are asked or encouraged to help out. They start out helping because it is part of their group identity or dynamic. This is not to say that the volunteers get nothing from the experience. They still get a sense of satisfaction from helping others but no more than an atheist would. This satisfaction is what brings them back after the first time. Additionally, not all Christians help out. The vast majority don't do anything beyond dropping coin in the collection plate.
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
LonearAq writes: Additionally, not all Christians help out. The vast majority don't do anything beyond dropping coin in the collection plate. Christians - Wikipedia
Christian is a person who adheres to Christianity, a monotheistic[1] religion centered on the life and teachings of Jesus Christ as presented in the New Testament[2] and interpreted by Christians to have been prophesied in the Hebrew Bible/Old Testament Now if this is the definition of Christian you are using I will agree with you. But this definition has nothing to do with anything other than religion. That is why I do not claim to be a Christian. I do claim to be a born again child of the King. King Jesus. Let me put a couple of things straight here. When I was 9 years and 11 months old I asked Jesus to take my spirit and take care of it. At that moment I was born again and He sent the Holy Spirit to lead me and guide me for my journey here on earth. The Holy Spirit sealed my soul until the day of redemption.
Ephe 4:30 (KJV) And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption. I shall never perish.
John 10:28 (KJV) And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. So Jesus saved me. The Holy Spirit sealed me. Jesus gave me eternal life and I shall never perish. Nobody, or power can get me out of the hand of Jesus. That means I don't have to do anything to go to heaven but die physically. So if I can't lose it how can you say what I do, (I will not speak for other people) I do expecting a reward. I help because I want other's to share what I have been blessed with. I do understand your viewpoint as you do not know my friend, my Jesus. There are billions of professors but only a few posessors. If a person is doing something to receive a reward from God they have already received their reward. A child of God does not have to do anything to get the reward that you put forth he will receive.Matthew chapter 25 has nothing to do with a born again child of God as they will have had their judgment at least 3 1/2 years prior to the judgment of the nations. Since you are such a great theologian would you please point out the scripture that tells me that I have to do anything besides make disciples, baptize them and teach them the all things that Christ commanded. Matt. 28:19, 20. This was the orders given to the New Testament Church.And the two commandments Jesus gave me. Matt 22:37 (KJV) Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. Now he gave a lot of rules through Paul on how I am supposed to conduct myself within the local Church. Church member to church member. Paul said concerning feeding the poor. BTW he is the only one who mentioned it. 1Cor 13:3 (KJV) And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing. Paul said he could give everything he had to feed the poor and it would profit him nothing. Withouty Charity (Charity here means Love)So if he did it for reward he gets nothing. God Bless, "John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."
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