Congress goes off the deep end

Very well stated Schraf.Those of us active in the Peace and Justice movements are not suffering under the delusion that we are going to acheive total harmony among the peoples of this world or that human suffering will be completely eradicated. What we are working towards is the lessening of injustice and violence and speaking out against the people/governments who perpetrate such acts because we feel that if we do not then we are just as bad as them (if not worse, because, unlike them, we recognize the actions as abhorrent)."To stand in silence when they should be protesting makes cowards out of men." - Abraham Lincoln"He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it." - Martin Luther King, Jr."Als die Nazis die Kommunisten holten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Kommunist.

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Als sie die Sozialdemokraten einsperrten,
habe ich geschwiegen;
ich war ja kein Sozialdemokrat.

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Als sie die Gewerkschafter holten,
habe ich nicht protestiert;
ich war ja kein Gewerkschafter.

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Als sie die Juden holten,
habe ich nicht protestiert;
ich war ja kein Jude.

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Als sie mich holten,
gab es keinen mehr, der protestierte.

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When the Nazis arrested the Communists,
I said nothing; after all,
I was not a Communist.
When they locked up the Social Democrats,
I said nothing; after all,
I was not a Social Democrat.
When they arrested the trade unionists,
I said nothing; after all,
I was not a trade unionist.
When they arrested the Jews, I said nothing; after all,
I was not a Jew.
When they arrested me, there was no longer anyone who could protest. "

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-Pastor Martin Niemoller

What's even more sad, holmes, about CS's apathy is that he would deny me my right to get married to the woman I want to spend the rest of my life with because he might abuse the system to get benefits for his BMX buddy and therefore destroy the meaning of a WORD for him, but he doesn't care two shits about people being tortured or their constitutional right to habeas corpus being taken away or their privacy being violated, etc etc.And the religious right conservatives are worried about this country going down the drain because I"M GAY????Give me a frakkin break! (yes, I'm a BSG geek )

Thanks, Jaderis!

So to be "safe" you are willing to give up all the principles that this country is founded on?

• Freedom
• Justice
• Equality
• Dignity
• Respect

You also don't mind if our soldiers are tortured?You think we should ignore all treaties that have been signed by past administrations?Can you tell me what you think is worth protecting?Just wondering how far you will go.Of course turning the USof(N)A into a fascist hegemony should solve the immigration problem, eh? Of course the walls and fences will be usefull for keeping people in then eh?Enjoy.Edited by RAZD, : .

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we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand

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RebelAAmericanOZen[Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.

Hey, I'm still confused in that I asked for a person to explain how it fit with traditional conservative principles, and he delivered a response of "what, me worry?". That isn't what I asked at all.And what's more, according to his own line of argument he would have no problem with outlawing weapons. That would clearly be against the values of the traditional rep base. But I see no reason he could give to be against it.Indeed I find some eyebrow arching power in the fact that NRA members are not up in arms with what Bush and Co are doing. So many claim that ownership is their right in order to defend themselves against a tyrranical gov't. How exactly are they planning on coordinating such efforts without the right to privacy or private communication? They might as well hand over their guns now. To be fair this country really is going down the drain because you, in specific, are gay. If you'd just straighten up and fly right this nation could really pull itself together. By total chance I decided to watch some tv when a dutch channel was running the first episode of the first season of BSG.I liked the original as a kid, though understand the cheesy quality of it now and loathe the whole remake industry hollywood has become. Thus I was not really expecting much and wasn't even sure I wanted to waste the time giving the remake a chance. I figured it might be a total spoof like the Charlie's Angel franchise, or the absolutely humor free remakes like Scooby Doo.But watch it I did and I was stunned. I couldn't believe the quality of the production up and down the board. And it was mature too. Unfortunately dutch tv showed only the first season and now I'm stuck. Frak.

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holmes {in temp decloak from lurker mode}
"What a fool believes he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away." (D.Bros)

Of course not. I would think that someone with traditionally conservative ideals could do no such thing, so you are left with the Bush worshippers who probably don't even understand the question and people, like CS, who just stick their head in the sand. Hey, you may be on to something, here. Maybe they just aren't seeing it in that light, yet. At any rate, their silence is interesting indeed. I know, I know. I'm just too busy luring young, innocent, straight girls into my web of sin. I felt the same apprehension going in because, to be quite frank, the majority of SciFi shows are pretty subpar in all areas except special effects (and even some of the shows are lacking in this) and the original series makes me cringe. However, I am completely addicted to this new series because of the excellent writing, outstanding cast, great cinematography and the intellectual and moral challenges it presents to the viewer. This is what true Sci-fi is all about - timely political commentary (not forced down your throat, but allowing you to ponder and conclude for yourself what you would do, feel, think in such a situation) wrapped up in a fantastical, entertaining and gripping shellYou really should either buy the DVD's or download the series on a BitTorrent client (Hey the show is free to watch, so why not free to download).Sorry Admins, I know this last bit is OT. That's the last of the BSG discussion