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Author Topic:   The Case of the missing inventions.
Tranquility Base
Inactive Member


Message 16 of 21 (217501)
06-16-2005 11:10 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by jar
06-16-2005 10:58 PM


Back 10 years ago I'd never heard of the Anasazi and was quite fascinated to find stuff like that north of Mexico. But I presume the Anasazi is pretty much unique as far as its (still-standing) legacy of non-timber buildings/villages north of Mexico? I know nothing of the Missisipi sites - are these the most impressive non-nomadic east-coast sites?
PS for the unitiated - here's a photo of an Anasazi site in Colorado (mine aren't scanned yet):
This message has been edited by Tranquility Base, 06-16-2005 11:12 PM

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jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 17 of 21 (217510)
06-16-2005 11:22 PM
Reply to: Message 16 by Tranquility Base
06-16-2005 11:10 PM


We're still just beginning to learn about the Mississippian culture since most of the structures they built were earthen mounds and wooden structures, neither of which really stood up to weather. If you ever get a chance though, visit the Etowah sites.
Throughout the south west there were also many structures, but again, most were adobe and so little remains. We do have much information though based on some of the canal work which was done. There were old canals hundreds of miles long and as wide as thirty feet. Construction on that scale implies a fairly high level of organization and civilazation, and are not the kind of project that would be undertaken unless there were large settled population centers.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

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Silent H
Member (Idle past 5819 days)
Posts: 7405
From: satellite of love
Joined: 12-11-2002


Message 18 of 21 (217553)
06-17-2005 4:21 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by jar
06-16-2005 4:40 PM


The hunter-gathers certainly existed but they existed alongside agricultural ones. The terraced farming found in Peru is still functional today
Well. like I said, I was just sort of speculating so I'm really just throwing out ideas to mull over. I realize there eventually were more sedentary civilizations that came about, but they were later than European civilizations and they may have "skipped over" ideas about wheels or draught animals based on their previous nomadic experiences.
Especially in some of the hard to reach spots like peru, draught animals could have been very difficult. Of course why they wouldn't invent plows and have humans drag them... I don't know.

holmes
"...what a fool believes he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.."(D. Bros)

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jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 19 of 21 (217898)
06-18-2005 1:57 PM


Leading to yet another question ...
There is another glaring example of differences between the old world and the newer worlds and that involves the pervasiveness and ubiquitous use of writing.
There are a few examples of writing found in the New Worlds, we can find some carvings on some of the central american edifices and there are reports of the Europeans burning codices, from reports they were printed on wood slabs, during the Aztec conquest. But written language never seemed to catch on or get spread in the New Worlds as it did in the older. Many civilzations, the Inca as a great example, seemed to have no written language at all.
Yet other areas, mathematics as an example, the Newer Worlds people were as advanced or perhaps even more advanced than in Europe at the time. The amount of detail recorded in the Incan quipus was phenominal and used a version of the decimal system.
Why?

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

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 Message 20 by Andya Primanda, posted 06-19-2005 10:38 AM jar has replied

  
Andya Primanda
Inactive Member


Message 20 of 21 (218014)
06-19-2005 10:38 AM
Reply to: Message 19 by jar
06-18-2005 1:57 PM


Re: Leading to yet another question ...
Easier terrain on the Middle East & Mediterranean would have helped the spread of writing, IMO.
The old Old World had several civilizations that grow near each other--Egypt, Fertile Crescent, Greece. Surely this proximity and ease of travel (assisted by water transport and pack animals) would have promoted contact and learning.
The ancient Americans were separated from each other by jungles and deserts, and lack of means of transport.
Jar, if you read Jared Diamond's Guns, Germs and Steel, your question would be settled. I think it's one of the most informative books ever written.

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 Message 19 by jar, posted 06-18-2005 1:57 PM jar has replied

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jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 21 of 21 (218022)
06-19-2005 12:31 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by Andya Primanda
06-19-2005 10:38 AM


Re: Leading to yet another question ...
Andya, that might be true but again, it seems to have some issues. The terrain of the New World is as varied as anywhere else. To say that the civilizations were seperated by Jungle and desert ignores the long coasts of the Americas as well as the many rivers reaching into the interior. It's certainly an idea to examine though.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

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