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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Bible Study Cover to Cover | |||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
brennakimi writes: this doesn't seem to be going anywhere, but i fully intend to keep it up. Don't be discouraged. Say something really stupid and you'll hear from me. Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
well. seeing as my thoughts were summed up in my notes, i don't think that's going to happen.
bible study doesn't necessarily mean 'zomg lets defend inerrancy'.
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ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
brennakimi writes: bible study doesn't necessarily mean 'zomg lets defend inerrancy'. Errantists can be wrong too. If you ever are, I'll let you know. Edited by Ringo, : Fixed smilie. Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
i don't get you. like, metaphysically. but that's okay.
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DorfMan Member (Idle past 6081 days) Posts: 282 From: New York Joined: |
quote:Your annotations are hysterical. Literally. Condescending and an affront to a serious believer. Why would you discuss what you clearly do not understand and have no sense about? It's like watching a wet tee-shirt contest, once you've seen one, all the others are also boobs.
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Chiroptera Inactive Member |
Well, you could offer a more correct annotation. If you don't have anything constructive to contribute, why don't you shut the hell up?
- P.S.
It's like watching a wet tee-shirt contest, once you've seen one, all the others are also boobs. Talk about freaking condescending. Edited by Chiroptera, : No reason given.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
after twenty-one years of being a serious believer, i think i've as much right to discuss it as anyone else. but i'm interested in a literary examination as much as a theological one. but i'm not sure what purpose a theological discussion really has, especially with someone of your attitude. in a theological discussion, i'll simply be faced with the same non-answers i've heard since childhood. i'm not convinced that they would give me a closer relationship with my god. as such, i'm stuck with a literary discussion. a literary discussion necessarily requires that one question the veracity of the statements presented and the defensibility of the positions taken.
if you're not prepared to do that, then i don't guess a literary discussion is for you. but if, instead of proclaiming my ignorance, you wanted to discuss any particular issue, i'm more than willing to explain my thoughts and discuss the text with you. Edited by brennakimi, : No reason given.
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
OK.. I was not paying attention. I'll comment only on the parts that interest me. I will read all of it, but I could care less about some of the historical accounts of ancient peoples long since gone. I suppose I never would make a good Bible scholar. You will hear my reply sometime before the end of the month. The OT has always been boring to me, however...why didnt you just skip to the NT??
Anyway...im sure there are a few highlights, and maybe if the discussion actually becomes interesting, it would substantiate the theory that God actually talks to our hearts through study of the Bible. Dunno, but I'll give it a fair shot. I have just been busy at work, and between that and hanging out debating in the chat room, the last thing I usually think about is actually reading the Bible.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
The OT has always been boring to me, however...why didnt you just skip to the NT?? because it's too cool for memostly because i've yet to manage to read the whole thing and i thought it'd be a good excuse to start. motivation, wot. but so much of the theology is really based in the ot and to really get a solid look at the basis for what is in the nt you've got to read the old stuff. it can't stand alone. plus you get people saying "oh well this is from the ot and it's a prophecy and blah blah blah" but if we haven't read the ot, then we don't know what we're talking about, do we?
I have just been busy at work, and between that and hanging out debating in the chat room, the last thing I usually think about is actually reading the Bible.
this seems to be the general consensus.
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jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
A couple points.
First, you are very right about the differences in God in the two Creation Myths. The God found in the younger myth of Genesis 1 is separate from the creation, transcendent, aloof and creates simply by an act of will. The God of the next myth, the older story, is far more human. This God is hands on, a tinkerer, but very intimate, very much present within the creation. The second and I think very important point that you touch on is that naming something, knowing its real name, gives on power over it. This feature is missing from the younger tale found in Genesis 1, but is interlaced throughout the rest of Genesis. Genesis 2:23 reflects that, since it is Adam that names "Woman" is a continuation of the control theme. Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
i quite agree. i'm interested in seeing where either idea of god is demonstrated in the rest of the text. i think this second god is the one who fought with jacob. it is this god i want to know. i wonder which god is the god of job? i wonder what modern christianity would be like if we really knew the god of genesis 2. our god is so distant and aloof, even though we talk about him being very present. is it just that nasty modern thought which demands that god be distant because of the lack of evidence?
i wonder about this idea of names. it's clear that god is very clever and we'll see more about him evading man's attempts to learn his name and control him. maybe this is all so much more philosophical than we imagined. we really can't fully understand god (or the universe) until we know everything about him. but if we learn his name, can we control him and be greater than he is? if that's the case, god would certainly never permit that. i can't imagine anyways. but note a bride takes the name of her husband. if we are to be his bride, then we will have his name and then call ourselves by it. which then brings the idea that we'd have our own real name and be able to control ourselves... i could do this for hours. Edited by brennakimi, : No reason given.
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jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Remember, what we are seeing is the evolving human image of God.
i'm interested in seeing where either idea of god is demonstrated in the rest of the text. Be careful. You also need to remember that it is not one story, but as I have mentioned in the past, an anthology of anthologies. Many of the stories are actually combinations of several different stories, so even within one story there can be inconsistencies. That is particularly so in the Flood myths where several different stories were combined into one which results in the different numbers of critters and types of birds being the harbingers of the end of the flood. The bit about naming though is very important. At the time some of the stories were written, the idea of controlling someone or something by naming it was a major influence, and we even see hints of that continuing into the NT. AbE:
our god is so distant and aloof, even though we talk about him being very present. is it just that nasty modern thought which demands that god be distant because of the lack of evidence? No. As you can see from the creation myth found in Genesis 1, the idea of a trancendent God is not modern, but rather has a long, long history. Edited by jar, : No reason given. Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
Be careful. You also need to remember that it is not one story, but as I have mentioned in the past, an anthology of anthologies. naturally. but it was compiled by a much smaller number of people who probably selected specific story renderings based on their personal theology. and, while i don't think the book is particularly inspired, i do think it got to us the way it did for a reason.
As you can see from the creation myth found in Genesis 1, the idea of a trancendent God is not modern, but rather has a long, long history. i didn't mean modern as 20th century, or even 1500 (the political definition). i think i was referring to the generally post-tribal world. those who are less likely to see miracles, i guess. but yes, it clearly has a long history.
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jar Member (Idle past 394 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
but it was compiled by a much smaller number of people who probably selected specific story renderings based on their personal theology. Don't limit it to just theology. It is important to remember that the contents were also selected for political reasons, and for societal reasons, for economic reasons, and for legal necessity. Almost all of these were also specific to a particular milieu. Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
well naturally. i was just being specific to that particular issue since we were talking about the nature of god.
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