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Author Topic:   The bible and homosexuality: Round 3
Dr Jack
Member
Posts: 3514
From: Immigrant in the land of Deutsch
Joined: 07-14-2003
Member Rating: 8.7


Message 181 of 306 (157613)
11-09-2004 11:45 AM
Reply to: Message 180 by berberry
11-09-2004 11:22 AM


Re: Why are some admins so upset about this?
Because this board's expressed purpose is a discussion of evolution and creationism?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 180 by berberry, posted 11-09-2004 11:22 AM berberry has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 182 by berberry, posted 11-09-2004 11:47 AM Dr Jack has not replied

berberry
Inactive Member


Message 182 of 306 (157614)
11-09-2004 11:47 AM
Reply to: Message 181 by Dr Jack
11-09-2004 11:45 AM


Re: Why are some admins so upset about this?
A cursory glance at the list of forum titles shows that it goes far beyond that. I've always thought that any topic related to the bible was fair game here. Am I wrong?

Dog is my copilot.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 181 by Dr Jack, posted 11-09-2004 11:45 AM Dr Jack has not replied

Tusko
Member (Idle past 101 days)
Posts: 615
From: London, UK
Joined: 10-01-2004


Message 183 of 306 (157618)
11-09-2004 11:57 AM
Reply to: Message 177 by PecosGeorge
11-09-2004 8:41 AM


Re: It does
PecosGeorge said:
Homosexuality is a useless practice in that it does not assure procreation
So is an infertile heterosexual couple useless too?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 177 by PecosGeorge, posted 11-09-2004 8:41 AM PecosGeorge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 184 by PecosGeorge, posted 11-09-2004 12:25 PM Tusko has not replied

PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6873 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 184 of 306 (157630)
11-09-2004 12:25 PM
Reply to: Message 183 by Tusko
11-09-2004 11:57 AM


Technically
speaking, yes!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 183 by Tusko, posted 11-09-2004 11:57 AM Tusko has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 186 by NosyNed, posted 11-09-2004 12:35 PM PecosGeorge has replied

MonkeyBoy
Inactive Member


Message 185 of 306 (157632)
11-09-2004 12:31 PM
Reply to: Message 177 by PecosGeorge
11-09-2004 8:41 AM


Re: It does
however equate to sex without marriage and that is forbidden as in fornication.
But since "you people" want to make it impossible for gays to marry at all, what are they to do?
Homosexuality is a useless practice in that it does not assure procreation.
Procreation is the primary purpose of sex? I, along with many other men have underwent a vasectomy; according to my doctor, I CANNOT get my wife pregnant. Not because of a disease, illness or anything other than my choice. I choose to have sex because it feels great, it is an experience that my wife and I share together and...did I mention it feels great?
This discussion goes round and round, and at the end of each lap, stands God with 'Adam and Eve I have made them' and nothing other than that.
lol.
Seriously, Phat, Pecos and J_F I have to assume that you are all straight, and with that assumption in mind, what right would an organization have to tell you who you could and could not fall in love with? How can god love gays, but be against gay sex?
Lam and Berberry you have exercised extreme patience;I am a bit of a hot head, and if I were gay, I'd most likely be incarcerated by now for assault.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 177 by PecosGeorge, posted 11-09-2004 8:41 AM PecosGeorge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 190 by coffee_addict, posted 11-09-2004 1:31 PM MonkeyBoy has not replied
 Message 194 by PecosGeorge, posted 11-09-2004 3:41 PM MonkeyBoy has not replied

NosyNed
Member
Posts: 8996
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003


Message 186 of 306 (157633)
11-09-2004 12:35 PM
Reply to: Message 184 by PecosGeorge
11-09-2004 12:25 PM


Re: Technically
So marriages between infertile couples of all genders should be banned?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 184 by PecosGeorge, posted 11-09-2004 12:25 PM PecosGeorge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 195 by PecosGeorge, posted 11-09-2004 3:44 PM NosyNed has not replied

AdminHambre
Inactive Member


Message 187 of 306 (157639)
11-09-2004 12:54 PM
Reply to: Message 180 by berberry
11-09-2004 11:22 AM


Re: Why are some admins so upset about this?
I think your second point is the most relevant. The subject is the moral equivalent of shooting fish in a barrel, and it just becomes a flamewar between the ignorant and the ones who like to bait and goad them. The rhetoric is far too emotional on either side. Everyone here has his or her mind made up on the subject already, and I despair of ever hearing a new argument raised in the debate. Worst of all, discussing the subject doesn't bring out the best in either camp. People I consider intelligent and objective end up sounding strident and dogmatic. As Daniel Dennett once said (or was it Leo Berg?), "There's nothing worse than hearing a position you agree with, stated badly."
I think the subject of abortion has the same qualities that make it an impossible issue for a constructive debate. It only lends itself to hysteria, polarization, and scrambling for the moral high ground. I've personally been involved in absolutely futile exchanges of invective disguised as discussions on the question of abortion, and I don't intend to enter into any more.
I'd have the same reaction if we kept having threads started on the subject of racism. It's a valid matter for discussion, but how far would we get before the debate degenerated into name-calling, self-righteousness, and emotionalism?
Adminssimo Hambre

This message is a reply to:
 Message 180 by berberry, posted 11-09-2004 11:22 AM berberry has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 188 by coffee_addict, posted 11-09-2004 1:29 PM AdminHambre has not replied
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coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 477 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 188 of 306 (157651)
11-09-2004 1:29 PM
Reply to: Message 187 by AdminHambre
11-09-2004 12:54 PM


Re: Why are some admins so upset about this?
I beg to differ. Personally, I have no problem with people being bigots as long as they stay out of my way. What I have a problem with are these self-proclaim christians who claim the bible supports their side yet they can't even come up with a single bible passage that isn't questionable to support their side. Yet, people like paisano keeps saying "the bible blah blah blah..." This is a black and white matter.
So far, George is the only person who actually brought up a somewhat valid biblical point regarding Adam and Eve. However, even then it is a bit of stretch to think that the particular bible passage is referring to homosexuals.
And where the hell is paisano? He was the one that made the bold statement about homosexuality and the bible.

Hate world.
Revenge soon!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 187 by AdminHambre, posted 11-09-2004 12:54 PM AdminHambre has not replied

berberry
Inactive Member


Message 189 of 306 (157652)
11-09-2004 1:30 PM
Reply to: Message 187 by AdminHambre
11-09-2004 12:54 PM


Re: Why are some admins so upset about this?
So are you saying that any topic related to the bible will be allowed here in future except for homosexuality, abortion and racism? I hope not.
If homosexuality topics are banned, will any mention of homosexuality also be banned? Will a fundie be banned if he or she brings up homosexuality in a thread about, for instance, the recent election? Or is it only gays who are expected to show restraint?

Dog is my copilot.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 187 by AdminHambre, posted 11-09-2004 12:54 PM AdminHambre has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 191 by Adminnemooseus, posted 11-09-2004 1:38 PM berberry has not replied

coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 477 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 190 of 306 (157656)
11-09-2004 1:31 PM
Reply to: Message 185 by MonkeyBoy
11-09-2004 12:31 PM


Re: It does
the monkey writes:
Lam and Berberry you have exercised extreme patience;I am a bit of a hot head, and if I were gay, I'd most likely be incarcerated by now for assault.
Believe you me, if there is a device that allows me to physically injure somebody over the internet...

Hate world.
Revenge soon!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 185 by MonkeyBoy, posted 11-09-2004 12:31 PM MonkeyBoy has not replied

Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3974
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 191 of 306 (157658)
11-09-2004 1:38 PM
Reply to: Message 189 by berberry
11-09-2004 1:30 PM


Re: Why are some admins so upset about this?
I have atempted to take this discussion to the "Change in Moderation?" topic. My message is here.
Please take any further discussion to the above cited topic.
Adminnemooseus
ps: I see that you have already moved your message, prior to me getting this one posted. I'll post it anyway, to try to divert all such discussion there.

Comments on moderation procedures (or wish to respond to admin messages)? - Go to:
Change in Moderation? (General discussion of moderation procedures)
or
Thread Reopen Requests
or
Considerations of topic promotions from the "Proposed New Topics" forum
or
Introducing the new "Boot Camp" forum

This message is a reply to:
 Message 189 by berberry, posted 11-09-2004 1:30 PM berberry has not replied

lfen
Member (Idle past 4677 days)
Posts: 2189
From: Oregon
Joined: 06-24-2004


Message 192 of 306 (157664)
11-09-2004 2:12 PM
Reply to: Message 158 by Phat
11-08-2004 9:54 AM


Re: sorry...but wrong
Yes. My assertion and accusation, based upon limited personal observation, suggests that many of the "enlightened" church leaders present a social relevant message rather than a historic "yahweh or the highway" one.
Phat,
Let's get back to the real old time religion, none of this modern watered down stuff. Let's you and I go out and burn some lambs and buy some slaves and stone to death some adulters!!
I wish I could write like Mark Twain. He has written some very funny yet right on criticism of this unthinking attitude of religion:
The Christian's Bible is a drug store. Its contents remain the same; but the medical practice changes...The world has corrected the Bible. The church never corrects it; and also never fails to drop in at the tail of the procession- and take the credit of the correction. During many ages there were witches. The Bible said so. the Bible commanded that they should not be allowed to live. Therefore the Church, after eight hundred years, gathered up its halters, thumb-screws, and firebrands, and set about its holy work in earnest. She worked hard at it night and day during nine centuries and imprisoned, tortured, hanged, and burned whole hordes and armies of witches, and washed the Christian world clean with their foul blood.
Then it was discovered that there was no such thing as witches, and never had been. One does not know whether to laugh or to cry.....There are no witches. The witch text remains; only the practice has changed. Hell fire is gone, but the text remains. Infant damnation is gone, but the text remains. More than two hundred death penalties are gone from the law books, but the texts that authorized them remain.
- "Bible Teaching and Religious Practice," Europe and Elsewhere
I think it's fine if you have a religion that makes you happy and loving, but not if it means you give up thinking! The ancients who wrote the various books that are assembled in the Bible have been improved upon. And I for one am grateful for churches that try to go forward rather than backwards.
lfen

This message is a reply to:
 Message 158 by Phat, posted 11-08-2004 9:54 AM Phat has not replied

PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6873 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 193 of 306 (157689)
11-09-2004 3:27 PM
Reply to: Message 179 by Dan Carroll
11-09-2004 10:49 AM


Re: I can think of a couple uses for sex without childbirth, personally...
Thank you. My heart is warmed by your compassion.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 179 by Dan Carroll, posted 11-09-2004 10:49 AM Dan Carroll has not replied

PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6873 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 194 of 306 (157698)
11-09-2004 3:41 PM
Reply to: Message 185 by MonkeyBoy
11-09-2004 12:31 PM


Re: It does
You misunderstand, no one has the right to tell someone how to live his/her life. Even God does not 'make' you.
I wouldn't think of telling you your personal conduct. Technically speaking, it is so wonderfully not my business.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 185 by MonkeyBoy, posted 11-09-2004 12:31 PM MonkeyBoy has not replied

PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6873 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 195 of 306 (157700)
11-09-2004 3:44 PM
Reply to: Message 186 by NosyNed
11-09-2004 12:35 PM


Re: Technically
Judging by your posts that I have read, this question is unworthy of you. I mean that with all sincerity, Ned.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 186 by NosyNed, posted 11-09-2004 12:35 PM NosyNed has not replied

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