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Author Topic:   Does teaching of evolution cause social decay?
Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 36 of 137 (105626)
05-05-2004 4:20 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by almeyda
05-05-2004 1:25 PM


Re: ...
quote:
The point is there isnt even a basis for morality!
Exactly! Evolution is not a basis for morality. It is a description of what we observe in biological species, and an explanation of what we observe. It is a scientific theory that attempts to describe reality. It has nothing to do with morality, just like the theory of gravitation or Maxwell's equations have nothing to do with morality.
Morality has to come from your religious/spiritual/philosophical beliefs. It cannot come from science.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by almeyda, posted 05-05-2004 1:25 PM almeyda has not replied

  
AdminAsgara
Administrator (Idle past 2302 days)
Posts: 2073
From: The Universe
Joined: 10-11-2003


Message 37 of 137 (105654)
05-05-2004 5:34 PM
Reply to: Message 31 by almeyda
05-05-2004 2:12 PM


almeyda
Hi almeyda, welcome to EvC.
I'm going to make a suggestion that will make your time here much easier on all of us.
Take ONE point, support that point with evidence, not just assertions and biblical quotes, and debate that ONE point.
When you have been here a while you will probably be able to handle multiple points on multiple threads, but when you first start in debates such as these it is easy to become overwhelmed by the responses you recieve. Dealing properly with one point at a time teaches you how the forum works, how debating works, and how logic works.
I suggest you read Style Guide for EvC and the Forum Guidelines
Next you should demonstrate that you understand what everyone means when they ask you for evidence not assertions.

AdminAsgara
Queen of the Universe

This message is a reply to:
 Message 31 by almeyda, posted 05-05-2004 2:12 PM almeyda has not replied

  
berberry
Inactive Member


Message 38 of 137 (105710)
05-05-2004 8:04 PM


It's really air conditioning
Social decay is obviously caused by air conditioning, not evolution. Air conditioning represents man's attempts to scientifically control his God-given environment. Until 1902, when Carrier's invention was used to control the environment in a Brooklyn printing press, God had always decided when it would be hot and what the humidity level would be. A mere one year after man first defied God by scientifically controlling his own environment, God showed us how angry he was by starting the Bolshevik Revolution.
In 1915, the Carrier Corporation was formed to promote the new technology of air conditioning and develop units that could be used in smaller areas, such as homes. This made God even angrier. He showed us how angry he was by getting us involved in World War I.
In 1924, a department store in Detroit was the first retail business to be air-conditioned. By this time, God was really angry indeed. He started bringing fascist governments to power all over Europe and he put Joseph Stalin in power in the USSR.
In 1928 the godless Carrier corporation, still as bent as ever on controlling what God had always controlled, introduced the first home air conditioning units. God got so angry that he started the Great Depression!
In 1939, the Packard Corporation introduced the first air-conditioned automobiles and God started WWII.

Replies to this message:
 Message 39 by SRO2, posted 05-05-2004 8:12 PM berberry has not replied
 Message 40 by Coragyps, posted 05-05-2004 8:25 PM berberry has not replied
 Message 41 by JonF, posted 05-05-2004 9:15 PM berberry has replied

  
SRO2 
Inactive Member


Message 39 of 137 (105713)
05-05-2004 8:12 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by berberry
05-05-2004 8:04 PM


Re: It's really air conditioning
God finally gave up and just made freon bad for the ozone layer...he's gonna' have the last By-God say in this even if it kills us all.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 38 by berberry, posted 05-05-2004 8:04 PM berberry has not replied

  
Coragyps
Member (Idle past 734 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 40 of 137 (105716)
05-05-2004 8:25 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by berberry
05-05-2004 8:04 PM


Re: It's really air conditioning
Berberry - that was brilliant!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 38 by berberry, posted 05-05-2004 8:04 PM berberry has not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 167 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 41 of 137 (105735)
05-05-2004 9:15 PM
Reply to: Message 38 by berberry
05-05-2004 8:04 PM


Re: It's really air conditioning
Lovely! But ...
Until 1902, when Carrier's invention was used to control the environment in a Brooklyn printing press, God had always decided when it would be hot and what the humidity level would be. A mere one year after man first defied God by scientifically controlling his own environment, God showed us how angry he was by starting the Bolshevik Revolution.
Last time I looked the Bolshevik Revolution started in 1917.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 38 by berberry, posted 05-05-2004 8:04 PM berberry has replied

Replies to this message:
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 Message 43 by berberry, posted 05-05-2004 9:28 PM JonF has not replied

  
SRO2 
Inactive Member


Message 42 of 137 (105736)
05-05-2004 9:21 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by JonF
05-05-2004 9:15 PM


Re: It's really air conditioning
He's always been slow to react...thats why he can never get our attention...we're like dogs, we done forgot what the problem was by the time we're punished for it.

This message is a reply to:
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berberry
Inactive Member


Message 43 of 137 (105740)
05-05-2004 9:28 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by JonF
05-05-2004 9:15 PM


Re: It's really air conditioning
Good point, but it arguably began in 1903 when the Bolsheviks, under Lenin, first became a political party in opposition to the czar. 1903 was also the worst year of drought in Russia. Millions died, food prices went up, and the gap between rich and poor widened. All of this strengthened the Bolsheviks.
In other words, it can still be demonstrated that God was really mad.

This message is a reply to:
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almeyda
Inactive Member


Message 44 of 137 (105818)
05-06-2004 4:19 AM


...
JAR - How do you agree with both Evolution and The Bible if they contradict each other?.Every word mentioned in the Bible relating to time is in context of literal time and days.Reinterpretations have what led people into changing Gods Word to big gaps,and long periods of time.And as for the Koran?Containing no fullfilled prophecy,coming after the Bible,changing the story well in our version jesus did this?.The Bible cannot even be compared to such a book.If Evolution is true then there is no truth.Yes you may have your philosophical views but that means everyone can listen to there own views.Right? What does that lead do again? A pretty f*cked up world with chaos and war.Evolution eventually leads to social decay
JON E - Take a look at the teenagers of today?.Wouldnt you say theyve all gotten pretty messed up.I mean drugs and alcohol and sex is the norm now.It wasnt in the past.Teenagers have been taught since what 1932? That there is no God,Only if you feel the need for one.What has hapened since well one the kids grow up then there kids have a lesser standard of morals and it goes on and on.And Evolution is to blame indirectly or directly because with Evolution there is no moral standard
JAR - Yes a book is only as good as its credentials.How can you belive something if you dont trust it in whatever it says? I surely couldnt.One inch of doubt and the next thing you know your doubting or rejecting whatever you feel like.If the genesis story is false? Then i wonder if Jesus existed or if God even exists? Understand?
I am not wrong! The Bible was written by over 40 or so men.This issue is not debatable.How many men do you think if any wrote the Bible ??? No evidence of a flood? Damm if only i had it with me.I guess your right for now.But to say there is absolutely no flood evidence is walking on very thin ice
PAUL K - Evolution means man independant of God.Since that becomes opinion vs opinion because theres no higher power involved then that means that yes there is no absolute moral standard.And as for accepting Gods word well we dont interpret it we take it for what it is.It says dont murder so we dont murder.But of like normal symbolic english we dont cut our hands off when jesus says if your hands sins cut it off for its better to lose a hand and go to heaven then be cast to hell.
LAM - I get my resource from the King James version which is exactly the same in meaning as the original text.
JAR - The ark was the equivalent volume of 522 railroad stockcars,each which can hold 240 sheep.This size was naturally perfect for such a global flood.Are you joking about the sterilization?..Such early life in Leviticus shows how ignorant man can be of such things..(A bit like an evolutionized man without God) God teaches them all about hygeine.
Parsimonious Razor - What your saying is not consistant.Its forcing the idea that people are the same or naturally have the same moral guide.This simply isnt true.This is an evolutionary world where things just happen and more overthere is no moral standard.What you are trying to do is indoctrinate mankind with some sort of humanistic religion.
Chiroptera - So you just admitted that each must listen to his innerself or religion to feel what is right.What if i feel like killing people and raping girls?.Im being totally consistant arent i? Sure i can face punishment by the majority but if i can get away with it,then so be it.Besides who are you to tell me its wrong?.

Replies to this message:
 Message 45 by PaulK, posted 05-06-2004 4:37 AM almeyda has replied
 Message 46 by Rand Al'Thor, posted 05-06-2004 4:42 AM almeyda has replied
 Message 71 by jar, posted 05-06-2004 11:45 AM almeyda has not replied
 Message 80 by Chiroptera, posted 05-06-2004 12:30 PM almeyda has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 45 of 137 (105821)
05-06-2004 4:37 AM
Reply to: Message 44 by almeyda
05-06-2004 4:19 AM


Re: ...
Evolution doesn't say that man is independant of God. Have you even considered the writings of Christians who accept evolution like Kenneth Miller or Howard Van Till ?
And even if you could get people to agree that God's word says "don't murder" (and you can't) who gets to decide what constitutes murder ?
If you use the Bible as your guide was Phinehas (Numbers 25:7-8) a murderer ? If not, then why not ?
So we have two fundamental problems in your argument.
1) The alleged problem has nothing to do with evolution
2) The supposed solution won't work because it requires people to agree on what the word of God *is* and when that issue is resolved who gets to interpret it. In short it doesn't solve anything - the same problems remain.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by almeyda, posted 05-06-2004 4:19 AM almeyda has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 48 by almeyda, posted 05-06-2004 5:38 AM PaulK has replied

  
Rand Al'Thor
Inactive Member


Message 46 of 137 (105822)
05-06-2004 4:42 AM
Reply to: Message 44 by almeyda
05-06-2004 4:19 AM


Re: ...
Take a look at the teenagers of today?.Wouldnt you say theyve all gotten pretty messed up.I mean drugs and alcohol and sex is the norm now.It wasnt in the past.Teenagers have been taught since what 1932? That there is no God,Only if you feel the need for one.What has hapened since well one the kids grow up then there kids have a lesser standard of morals and it goes on and on.
Yup, last night my atheist friends and I were hanging out at my house drinking and smoking pot. We even got our girl friends drunk enough to have sex with us. The main problem was that everyone in my school is an atheist (from our biology classes teaching evolution) so my house was too crowded and got trashed. It is ok though I stabbed the people that messed up my computer. Their friends were kind of mad but hey, it's the norm now, right?
/sarcasm off
P.S. You might want to start putting spaces after your commas and periods.
This message has been edited by Rand Al'Thor, 05-06-2004 03:44 AM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by almeyda, posted 05-06-2004 4:19 AM almeyda has replied

Replies to this message:
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almeyda
Inactive Member


Message 47 of 137 (105823)
05-06-2004 4:49 AM
Reply to: Message 46 by Rand Al'Thor
05-06-2004 4:42 AM


Re: ...
Well this is an evolutionary world and things do just happen so yes that was fine!...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 46 by Rand Al'Thor, posted 05-06-2004 4:42 AM Rand Al'Thor has not replied

  
almeyda
Inactive Member


Message 48 of 137 (105828)
05-06-2004 5:38 AM
Reply to: Message 45 by PaulK
05-06-2004 4:37 AM


Re: ...
What are those Christians basing there belief on? Well there using Gods word and reinterpreting Genesis because what Evolutionists have showd us, Is something else.
In the Bible God constituted government and law. The governement was of course supposed to inforce Gods law and order thats how. Yes of course there would still be rebellion. But the foundation is critical. Such a foundation can teach children more than we came from a monkey and before that from a chemical. Teaching our children that they came from nowhere and going nowwhere and that life is whatever it is in a meaningless existence, You dont think there would be moral consequences in society as time goes on?..Of course many people dont wake up and go kill or act immorally but Evolution incresingly pervades the thinking of a society. It grows as generations come and go.Eventually many children,teenagers and adults no longer have a clear concept of Christian morality. Remember you cant have Christian morality without Christ,You cant have Christ without the Bible,And you cant have the Bible without Genesis 1:1..Further more Evolutionary thinking can indoctrinate into atheism (Just like all our universaties)..Christian morals and rules suddenly are unacceptable and become the enemy.You are suffering from some sort of pride,ignorance or sin problem if you dont feel that the foundation of society is essential for peace and order.
This message has been edited by almeyda, 05-06-2004 04:41 AM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 45 by PaulK, posted 05-06-2004 4:37 AM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 49 by PaulK, posted 05-06-2004 6:17 AM almeyda has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 49 of 137 (105833)
05-06-2004 6:17 AM
Reply to: Message 48 by almeyda
05-06-2004 5:38 AM


Re: ...
So what you are REALLY saying is that the only way to have morals is for everyone to agree with you.
As I said it doesn't come down to the "word of God" at all - it comes down to who gets to decide what is the "word of God"and who gets to produce the authoritative intepretation of that word. And your answer is that you do. So all you are really doing is setting yourself up as the final authority. And you really think that everyone else will agee with that ?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 48 by almeyda, posted 05-06-2004 5:38 AM almeyda has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 50 by almeyda, posted 05-06-2004 6:28 AM PaulK has replied

  
almeyda
Inactive Member


Message 50 of 137 (105835)
05-06-2004 6:28 AM
Reply to: Message 49 by PaulK
05-06-2004 6:17 AM


Re: ...
I AM NO GOD!..I am just a messenger of his word. Im just here to say look what God says. Havent you heard? "Thus sayeth the Lord". It really comes down to mans sinful nature always trying to pursue his own glory. Trying to put God out of the picture. All i can do is continue to fight for Gods word and hope to turn many to his light & love.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 49 by PaulK, posted 05-06-2004 6:17 AM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
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