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Author Topic:   Ideas of Reality
PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6872 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 16 of 27 (121946)
07-04-2004 11:20 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by One_Charred_Wing
07-04-2004 4:19 PM


It is imperative
to raise questions once you learn to think for yourself and have some successful "thinking's" under your belt. It keeps things from getting stagnant and is absolutely necessary for growth, individual and societal.
What you said about your parents takes me back to my init question....Is it a lie if what I say is truth to me but not to you?"
What your parents told you must surely have been truth to them, and it appears they raised you right, right to the point where you can make your own truth.
"Come let us reason together, says the Lord".....meanin', ifn it don' make sense, pick up the phone or send an e-mail.
Your generation is no different from any other, but every generation thinks it is.

"In that day I will also make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field, the birds of the sky and the creeping things of the ground. And I will abolish the bow, the sword and war from the land, and will make them lie down in safety. I will betroth you to Me forever; yes, I will betroth you to Me in righteousness and in justice, in lovingkindness and in compassion, and I will betroth you to Me in faithfulness. Then you will know the LORD."
-the prophet Hosea (8th century B.C.) in Hosea 2:18-20

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by One_Charred_Wing, posted 07-04-2004 4:19 PM One_Charred_Wing has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 17 by One_Charred_Wing, posted 07-05-2004 4:02 PM PecosGeorge has replied

  
One_Charred_Wing
Member (Idle past 6155 days)
Posts: 690
From: USA West Coast
Joined: 11-21-2003


Message 17 of 27 (122170)
07-05-2004 4:02 PM
Reply to: Message 16 by PecosGeorge
07-04-2004 11:20 PM


Re: It is imperative
...to raise questions once you learn to think for yourself and have some successful "thinking's" under your belt.
I agree. The only problem is that there are some people who don't think, and as such never get to raise question.
What you said about your parents takes me back to my init question....Is it a lie if what I say is truth to me but not to you?"
Depends, but probably not.
What your parents told you must surely have been truth to them, and it appears they raised you right, right to the point where you can make your own truth.
Well, I'm flattered as I'm sure they would be, but when one of them told me to 'not question things like what the Bible says' and 'an older person will always know better so listen to them', I think most of us will agree those are wrong, by just about anybody's standards.
The way I see it, question absolutely everything. If what you're questioning is really such ironclad truth, then it will withstand the skepticism.
"Come let us reason together, says the Lord".....meanin', ifn it don' make sense, pick up the phone or send an e-mail.
I agree. God knows what He's talking about regarding this.
Your generation is no different from any other, but every generation thinks it is.
I'm not sure I agree with this. The Baby Boomers are certainly taking aging differently than their parents, I'd say. Also, my generation has a strong lean toward questioning religion in particular; a large portion of churchgoers between the ages of 12-16 are just forced to go with their parents and are actually far from believing anything they're told. Obviously, there always were people like that, but I've asked some older pastors and they agree that 'atheism is on the rise'. That's both a good and bad thing in my opinion.
This message has been edited by Born2Preach, 07-05-2004 03:02 PM

Wanna feel God? Step onto the wrestling mat and you'd be crazy to deny the uplifting spirit. http://www.BadPreacher.5u.com (incomplete, but look anyway!)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 16 by PecosGeorge, posted 07-04-2004 11:20 PM PecosGeorge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by RAZD, posted 07-05-2004 4:39 PM One_Charred_Wing has replied
 Message 19 by PecosGeorge, posted 07-06-2004 10:50 AM One_Charred_Wing has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1404 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 18 of 27 (122184)
07-05-2004 4:39 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by One_Charred_Wing
07-05-2004 4:02 PM


Re: It is imperative
Born2Preach writes:
The way I see it, question absolutely everything. If what you're questioning is really such ironclad truth, then it will withstand the skepticism.
And if it doesn't make sense it needs to be questioned even more. The places where science advances is where it doesn't make sense ... the lab results where the scientist doesn't say 'eureka' but 'that's funny ...'
but I've asked some older pastors and they agree that 'atheism is on the rise'.
atheism or just a turning away from some hard core christian type beliefs? this is one of the side effects of making such a big deal out of the fundamental literal only approach ... that once that is questioned it is harder to accept the rest.
The reality could be in between.

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist
{{{Buddha walks off laughing with joy}}}

This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by One_Charred_Wing, posted 07-05-2004 4:02 PM One_Charred_Wing has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by PecosGeorge, posted 07-06-2004 10:54 AM RAZD has not replied
 Message 23 by One_Charred_Wing, posted 07-06-2004 4:07 PM RAZD has replied

  
PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6872 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 19 of 27 (122369)
07-06-2004 10:50 AM
Reply to: Message 17 by One_Charred_Wing
07-05-2004 4:02 PM


Be sure your
sins will find you out...is my advice to parents who do not teach their children to think for themselves. All the parent/teacher should really wish to do is point into directions, and the greater the interest in the student, point out the pro's and con's with unfettered honesty. The boogeyman ain't gonna get me....I'll soon find out when he hasn't showed up after the third or so threat.
The world becomes mine as soon as I am born, mine to inhabit and explore and to have opinions about.
When your parents told you not to question, they had your interest at heart the only way they knew how.
As for the growth of atheism? "Let not your heart be troubled"...."All things work together for those who believe in God"....It is as it should be. God is in control......'don't let your heart fail for fear'...all is as it should be.

"In that day I will also make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field, the birds of the sky and the creeping things of the ground. And I will abolish the bow, the sword and war from the land, and will make them lie down in safety. I will betroth you to Me forever; yes, I will betroth you to Me in righteousness and in justice, in lovingkindness and in compassion, and I will betroth you to Me in faithfulness. Then you will know the LORD."
-the prophet Hosea (8th century B.C.) in Hosea 2:18-20

This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by One_Charred_Wing, posted 07-05-2004 4:02 PM One_Charred_Wing has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 21 by One_Charred_Wing, posted 07-06-2004 4:03 PM PecosGeorge has not replied
 Message 22 by One_Charred_Wing, posted 07-06-2004 4:03 PM PecosGeorge has replied

  
PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6872 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 20 of 27 (122370)
07-06-2004 10:54 AM
Reply to: Message 18 by RAZD
07-05-2004 4:39 PM


the reality
between father and child is so highly individual as not to be understood by anyone other than father and child.
Unless it is sick.

"In that day I will also make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field, the birds of the sky and the creeping things of the ground. And I will abolish the bow, the sword and war from the land, and will make them lie down in safety. I will betroth you to Me forever; yes, I will betroth you to Me in righteousness and in justice, in lovingkindness and in compassion, and I will betroth you to Me in faithfulness. Then you will know the LORD."
-the prophet Hosea (8th century B.C.) in Hosea 2:18-20

This message is a reply to:
 Message 18 by RAZD, posted 07-05-2004 4:39 PM RAZD has not replied

  
One_Charred_Wing
Member (Idle past 6155 days)
Posts: 690
From: USA West Coast
Joined: 11-21-2003


Message 21 of 27 (122423)
07-06-2004 4:03 PM
Reply to: Message 19 by PecosGeorge
07-06-2004 10:50 AM


Re: Be sure your
(COPY AGAIN!! I figured out the culprit was the escape key. The little punk doesn't stop the post from going through.)
This message has been edited by Born2Preach, 07-06-2004 03:04 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by PecosGeorge, posted 07-06-2004 10:50 AM PecosGeorge has not replied

  
One_Charred_Wing
Member (Idle past 6155 days)
Posts: 690
From: USA West Coast
Joined: 11-21-2003


Message 22 of 27 (122424)
07-06-2004 4:03 PM
Reply to: Message 19 by PecosGeorge
07-06-2004 10:50 AM


Re: Be sure your
You're very philosophical, you know that?
When your parents told you not to question, they had your interest at heart the only way they knew how.
And you're right about that.
As for the growth of atheism? "Let not your heart be troubled"...."All things work together for those who believe in God"....It is as it should be. God is in control......'don't let your heart fail for fear'...all is as it should be.
No worries, I didn't say it was wholly a bad thing at all.

Wanna feel God? Step onto the wrestling mat and you'd be crazy to deny the uplifting spirit. http://www.BadPreacher.5u.com (incomplete, but look anyway!)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 19 by PecosGeorge, posted 07-06-2004 10:50 AM PecosGeorge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 27 by PecosGeorge, posted 07-06-2004 5:14 PM One_Charred_Wing has not replied

  
One_Charred_Wing
Member (Idle past 6155 days)
Posts: 690
From: USA West Coast
Joined: 11-21-2003


Message 23 of 27 (122425)
07-06-2004 4:07 PM
Reply to: Message 18 by RAZD
07-05-2004 4:39 PM


Re: It is imperative
atheism or just a turning away from some hard core christian type beliefs? this is one of the side effects of making such a big deal out of the fundamental literal only approach ... that once that is questioned it is harder to accept the rest.
The former. The latter as well if you're referring to literalism, which really, although it is probably all true and us skeptics are morons, isn't the main message. The main message of Christianity(as well as other religions) is love to all; it's turning away from that message that makes me notice.
(Edited to fix some plural-singular agreement)
This message has been edited by Born2Preach, 07-06-2004 03:08 PM

Wanna feel God? Step onto the wrestling mat and you'd be crazy to deny the uplifting spirit. http://www.BadPreacher.5u.com (incomplete, but look anyway!)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 18 by RAZD, posted 07-05-2004 4:39 PM RAZD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 24 by RAZD, posted 07-06-2004 4:36 PM One_Charred_Wing has not replied
 Message 25 by coffee_addict, posted 07-06-2004 4:49 PM One_Charred_Wing has not replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1404 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 24 of 27 (122437)
07-06-2004 4:36 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by One_Charred_Wing
07-06-2004 4:07 PM


Re: It is imperative
It seems one of the dangers of insisting on fundamental literal interpretations is that when one comes into an unresovable conflict with reality it is not just the conflicted part that is discarded, but the baby goes out with the water as well.

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist
{{{Buddha walks off laughing with joy}}}

This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by One_Charred_Wing, posted 07-06-2004 4:07 PM One_Charred_Wing has not replied

  
coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 476 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


Message 25 of 27 (122441)
07-06-2004 4:49 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by One_Charred_Wing
07-06-2004 4:07 PM


Re: It is imperative
I am reminded by a personal realization I once had. As everyone probably knows, little kids think that their parents are supposed to know everything about everything. I was like that. I first realized that my parents didn't know everything when I was punished for something that I didn't do and was punished again after I still refused to admit that I did it. In fact, it struck me hard when the truth was found out and my parents simply let it passed as if nothing had happened. I think that particular event set in motion my skeptical view of life.

The Laminator

This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by One_Charred_Wing, posted 07-06-2004 4:07 PM One_Charred_Wing has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 26 by PecosGeorge, posted 07-06-2004 5:08 PM coffee_addict has not replied

  
PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6872 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 26 of 27 (122446)
07-06-2004 5:08 PM
Reply to: Message 25 by coffee_addict
07-06-2004 4:49 PM


Even
When that happened to me, insult was added to injury with the statement -- 'you needed a beating and you must have done something wrong somewhere so we'll call us even'. It has imbued me with an unbending sense of justice that is all-pervasive. I have to admit, I'm grateful, and also learned that all things negative are also positive.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 25 by coffee_addict, posted 07-06-2004 4:49 PM coffee_addict has not replied

  
PecosGeorge
Member (Idle past 6872 days)
Posts: 863
From: Texas
Joined: 04-09-2004


Message 27 of 27 (122449)
07-06-2004 5:14 PM
Reply to: Message 22 by One_Charred_Wing
07-06-2004 4:03 PM


Thanks
a fine compliment.
George

"In that day I will also make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field, the birds of the sky and the creeping things of the ground. And I will abolish the bow, the sword and war from the land, and will make them lie down in safety. I will betroth you to Me forever; yes, I will betroth you to Me in righteousness and in justice, in lovingkindness and in compassion, and I will betroth you to Me in faithfulness. Then you will know the LORD."
-the prophet Hosea (8th century B.C.) in Hosea 2:18-20

This message is a reply to:
 Message 22 by One_Charred_Wing, posted 07-06-2004 4:03 PM One_Charred_Wing has not replied

  
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