EvC Forum: Life and Fine-tuning of the universe.

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Topic: Life and Fine-tuning of the universe.

General Nazort

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Message 13 of 31 (145376)
09-28-2004 1:45 PM

Reply to: Message 8 by coffee_addict
06-24-2004 12:34 AM

There are probably 10 X 10^99999999999999 planets, considering the number of stars that we can see and the planets around other stars that we have discovered.

Good job, Lam, at completely making up this number.

If you say there no absolutes, I ask you, are you absolutely sure?

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	Message 8 by coffee_addict, posted 06-24-2004 12:34 AM		coffee_addict has replied

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	Message 16 by coffee_addict, posted 09-28-2004 4:14 PM		General Nazort has not replied

General Nazort

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Message 14 of 31 (145382)
09-28-2004 1:59 PM

Reply to: Message 1 by sidelined
06-20-2004 4:01 AM

Hey sidelined - here is a good website to check out: Page not found - Reasons to Believe

According to Hugh Ross, an astronomer, "less than 1 chance in 10^282 exists that even one such life-support body would occur anywhere in the universe without invoking divine miracles."

He goes through a large number of aspects of our universe that are neccessary to support life - from the size of galaxies to the amounts of certain chemicals on earth.

If you say there no absolutes, I ask you, are you absolutely sure?

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	Message 1 by sidelined, posted 06-20-2004 4:01 AM		sidelined has not replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 15 by Rei, posted 09-28-2004 2:22 PM	General Nazort has replied
	Message 17 by jar, posted 09-28-2004 4:40 PM	General Nazort has replied

General Nazort

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Message 19 of 31 (145857)
09-29-2004 11:14 PM

Reply to: Message 15 by Rei
09-28-2004 2:22 PM

He explains the reasoning for why galaxies, dark matter, etc must have their specific properties here: www.reasons.org/.../solar_system_design...
{Shortened display form of URL, to restore page width to normal - AM}

While I somewhat agree that the probabilities seem a little made up, this list still shows that there are over 150 factors that must be in a fairly narrow range in order for life to exist.

This message has been edited by Adminnemooseus, 09-30-2004 02:17 AM

If you say there no absolutes, I ask you, are you absolutely sure?

This message is a reply to:
	Message 15 by Rei, posted 09-28-2004 2:22 PM		Rei has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 21 by jar, posted 09-29-2004 11:24 PM	General Nazort has replied
	Message 26 by Rei, posted 10-01-2004 7:48 PM	General Nazort has not replied

General Nazort

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Message 20 of 31 (145859)
09-29-2004 11:20 PM

Reply to: Message 17 by jar
09-28-2004 4:40 PM

we can't even define what exactly is a living organism. Is it you and me? How about the early proto-bacteria? How about viruses? What about extremophiles?

Hugh Ross addresses this in the beginning section of the page I posted above. While simpler life like bacteria can exist in harsher conditions, it is more easily damaged by radiation.

Ross identifies 6 zones in which life can exist:

1. unicellular, low metabolism life that persists for only a brief time period
2. unicellular, low metabolism life that persists for a long time period
3. unicellular, high metabolism life that persists for a brief time period
4. unicellular, high metabolism life that persists for a long time period
5. advanced life that survives for just a brief time period
6. advanced life that survives for a long time period

The list he gives is (supposedly) what is needed for life of any kind to exist.

If you say there no absolutes, I ask you, are you absolutely sure?

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	Message 17 by jar, posted 09-28-2004 4:40 PM		jar has not replied

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	Message 22 by NosyNed, posted 09-30-2004 2:23 AM		General Nazort has not replied

General Nazort

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Message 23 of 31 (146574)
10-01-2004 5:32 PM

Reply to: Message 21 by jar
09-29-2004 11:24 PM

As I pointed out a couple posts above, there are several major flaws with such an assertion. First, what we know about life is based on a sample of one. Only when we have been able to examine several (hopefully many life forms) will we have any idea what is required.

What exactly do you mean by a sample of one? Do you mean all the different kind life on this planet counts as one? Or do you mean that all the life on this planet has only one similar chemical structure?

If you say there no absolutes, I ask you, are you absolutely sure?

This message is a reply to:
	Message 21 by jar, posted 09-29-2004 11:24 PM		jar has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 24 by jar, posted 10-01-2004 7:00 PM	General Nazort has replied
	Message 27 by Loudmouth, posted 10-01-2004 7:51 PM	General Nazort has not replied

General Nazort

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Message 28 of 31 (147010)
10-03-2004 2:47 PM

Reply to: Message 24 by jar
10-01-2004 7:00 PM

OK, I agree with you on this. However, we can know what the requirements are for our kind of life. The "fine tuning" of the universe is not primarily concerned with the possibility of different kinds of life, it is concerned with the factors that go into making the kind of life we know on earth possible.

If you say there no absolutes, I ask you, are you absolutely sure?

This message is a reply to:
	Message 24 by jar, posted 10-01-2004 7:00 PM		jar has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 29 by jar, posted 10-03-2004 3:44 PM	General Nazort has not replied
	Message 30 by sidelined, posted 10-03-2004 3:54 PM	General Nazort has not replied
	Message 31 by Loudmouth, posted 10-03-2004 4:43 PM	General Nazort has not replied

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