Quantized redshifts strongly suggest that our galaxy is at the centre of the universe

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I suggest it means we don't have it right yet, we need to do more work.

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It looks like more work has been done, no quantized redshift found with a larger more complete sample size. System Unavailable [This message has been edited by Karl_but_not_THAT_Karl, 08-10-2002]

^ That paper concerns the special case of pairs of quasars/galaxies that are 'on top of each other' from our line of sight.The larger all-sky galaxy surveys do 'strongly' find the quantization effect.

FrankI will state it utterly clearly:The Hubble interpretation of redshift quantization is membranes of galaxies centred on us.Anything else is new physics.PS 1 - Yes some creationists did believe in non-Hubble interpretaitons of redshifts. I never agreed with them. Having said that I will still allow any crazy idea the possibiity of being right. However, the standard theory is always the 'first port of call' - and that is the Hubble theory.PS 2 - My scanner has blown up - I'll have to use the work one to scan in a creaitonist article! I hate doing that - I sort of feel like a Watergate burglar. You sort of even have the feeling that the scanner knows it's a creationist article.[This message has been edited by Tranquility Base, 08-11-2002]

HERE IT IS! We don't need to get my scanner working, AIG has just posted the Humphrey paper:http://www.answersingenesis.org/...j/docs/TJv16n2_CENTRE.pdf

Hope you were not injured in the scanner explosion. ""Let me give this and Karl's link a read.Clear Skies !Frank

^ I think I plugged a printer powerpack into my scanner.

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Originally posted by Tranquility Base:
^ I think I plugged a printer powerpack into my scanner.

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JM: Good, one less wacko creationist scanning propaganda!CheersJoe Meert

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Originally posted by Tranquility Base:
It would be fascinating to see QM effects this large but as an ex-QM (quantum electrodynamics actually) researcher I doubt it.

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Hey TB,I knew some one must have thought of this besides me That, or I read about it somewhere. Sometimes it is hard to keep track."During inflation, these quantum mechanical fluctuations are amplified and due to the accelerating expansion of the universe they are stretched to macroscopic length scales." Index | Relativity and Gravitation Group------------------
http://www.hells-handmaiden.com[This message has been edited by John, 08-13-2002]

^ Your link doesn't work John.

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Originally posted by Tranquility Base:
^ Your link doesn't work John.

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It does now.
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http://www.hells-handmaiden.com

^ Thanks.Fascinating.Maybe that's the origin of these membranes centred on us .

I was actually quite stunned to find the phrase "enemies of God" in a (supposedly) scientific/technical article. I would expect this from Osama bin Laden perhaps, but not here. Is this my mistake or not ?Clear Skies !Frank

^ Frank - it wouldn't have been my style. But fundamentally we believe that - at the conscience level - people went the evolutionary route becasue they preferred reason to obedience. Although the reasoning sounds so good, obedience is the one that actually gets you to the truth in our opinions.This does not for a second have to put anyone in the dark ages or diminish the advances of science. It simply means that if Christianity is correct, then there is something more important than reason. Family life for us is a teacher for all of life. Accountabilty, relational obedience and honouring of each other. Of course we also become smart, thinking beings but that is not what I like about my mother or my son! It is the same for God and us.How can we make such outrageous statements? Simply becasue we are convinced that life is actualy more like what it feels like than what science tells us.For example, our conscience tells us that we should be good, that what we do makes a differnce to other people, that what we do affects our own 'spiritual health', it even tells most (all?) people that there is a God. Our conscience tells most (all?) of us that we are not just flesh and blood. These things cannot ever be propoerly studied by reason so of course I can't prove it.I am as sure that I am not just a walking brain as I am that DNA codes for proteins and yet I can't prove the former to you.So our message is that if you just go reason you will miss out on the truth, on truly filling out your individual identity - and you will miss out on working out prehistory.[This message has been edited by Tranquility Base, 08-14-2002]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Tranquility Base:
[B]^ Frank - it wouldn't have been my style. But fundamentally we believe that - at the conscience level - people went the evolutionary route becasue they preferred reason to obedience. Although the reasoning sounds so good, obedience is the one that actually gets you to the truth in our opinions.
I am as sure that I am not just a walking brain as I am that DNA codes for proteins and yet I can't prove the former to you. [/QUOTE]JM: Actually, the message of creationists is to accept 'truth' as defined by a small sect of christianity. You assume that one cannot be a christian and also accept that science got it right. Many christians behold evolution on an old earth being in perfect harmony with an all powerful god and fully consistent with the scriptures because the scriptures are not a scientific treatise. What you are arguing is that you have the singular handle on 'christian truth'. That's a rather pompous and self-serving statement and is inconsistent with the beliefs of many other Christians.CheersJoe Meert

--JM: Actually, the message of creationists is to accept 'truth' as defined by a small sect of christianity. You assume that one cannot be a christian and also accept that science got it right. Many christians behold evolution on an old earth being in perfect harmony with an all powerful god and fully consistent with the scriptures because the scriptures are not a scientific treatise. What you are arguing is that you have the singular handle on 'christian truth'. That's a rather pompous and self-serving statement and is inconsistent with the beliefs of many other Christians.CheersJoe Meert--There is no indication anywhere in the Bible, that Genesis should not be taken literally. Quite the opposite - it is qouted as history all over the old and new testaments.Faith: Bible is the Word of God
Faith: God wrote the Bible, so we could know Truth
Conclusion: Only God's interpretation of the Bible is correct.Now, if God wants us to know the truth, what is the only possible way for everyone to come to the same conclusions in the Bible? By reading it in a straight-forward manner -- not using your imaginations/preconcieved ideas.Based on the above, there is a right way and a wrong way to read the Bible. That is why, one can be firm on a certain conclusion of the Bible, and not at the same time be arrogant. If you want to say Evolution fits in the Bible, you must go about it like this..."You're going in with six days in mind. But abandon that, and read Genesis the way it was written. Don't you get evolution from it?"David