Christian Evolutionists: How does that work? A Q&A session

whichever. in any case. both just plane sound like early civ myths.

From what I've read Chap 1 of Gen. deals with mainstream creation point a to point b. Chap 2 gives a short summary 2-3 sentences then goes into more detail about Adam and Eve and so on. So where is it that they disagree or are you misunderstanding it? And Paul came from Tarsus. His name was originaly Saul (the persecutor of Christians), but you probably already knew that. It is easy to say the bible is a "civ myth" when you don't care to take the time to read and understand it. You say you believe in the God of the bible but you don't believe that the inspired words that make up the bible are His. How easy it is to choose not to believe. The real battle is have a faith strong enough to withstand the weight of the world and all the anti-God world views. Later. -ZThis message has been edited by Zachariah, 10-29-2004 09:45 PM

We've had whole threads devoted just to the inconsistencies in Genesis 1 & 2, but a quick summary is that the order, method and details vary between the two.The basic belief of most Christian Churches is that the creation story in Genesis is simply an allegory and not something to be taken literally.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Well, I don't agree. And I feel that compressing everything that was said in Chap 1 into ten lines just as an overview before getting on with the main topics of Chap 2 and on would be reffered to as a summary. You have to keep this in perspective. The Pentateuch was written by Moses. On different occasions he backs up and reviews what is said so the people he is talking to will understand what has happened. More people came along after he first spoke of these things. He did the same thing in Deuteronomy when he was going over the laws given by God. Why would he give the same laws over and over and over. Because Moses was hundreds of years old and people were born and grew up and he told them the story along with the new information. So when he wrote it down he wouldn't go into as great a detail of the information previously discussed. -z

You said most christain churches believe that the Chap 1,2 in Gen isn't to be taken literaly. What churches are they? (Names) And why do they get to pick and choose what they get to believe and pass on? I know we have free will so don't try that excuse, I mean if they can say I believe this story is toooooo crazy to believe but I like this one, when do they know if they are correct. And what if they start making bad choices and mess up the story. You get cults then. Mormons, 7th day ads, Jehov wits, Muslim,....etc.

Many people hold views similar to yours. But the majority of Christians and Christian Churches believe that there were many different writers and redactors of Genesis and the other books of the Bible. Most Christian Churches believe that Gensis 2 is the older tradition while Gensis 1 was from much later.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Well, The Episcopal Church, Lutheran Church, Methodist Church, Roman Catholic Church, Presbyterian Church as starters. All have come out in support of the Theory of Evolution and in opposition of creationism.
Here is a quote from Bishop Sims of the Atlanta Diocese of the Episcopal Church.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Well, I feel that the Epi. church with their Gay Bishop and the Catholic church with their priest problems not to mention their part in the changes made to traditional christianity (i.e. changing the sabath to sunday, inventing Christmas and Easter (all Pagan in origin.)) I put NO stock in what they have to offer in the ideas of traditional "Christianity". I've been around the mainstream christian (1st Christian churches) and 1st Freewill Baptist churches and Messianic Jewish churches (for the back to the basics traditional view of the bible and christianity) and I have never once heard what you are saying. And I listen to christian radio which deals with many different people of different church affiliations and never once have they said what you are saying. Sooooooooooooooooooo. Who is correct? See what happens when you use your "freewill" to make your list of "I'll believe this but won't believe that" it causes this. People raised up in churches that believe "NEW" doctrines, instead of believing what Adonai has told us. We believe history books for the most part because that history has happened during our parents or our life times and be saw it happen or heard first hand eyewitness accounts. But +- 10,000 years and we stop believing it even though we have written documents and in some cases the original script (in the case of the dead sea scrolls). What a shame.This message has been edited by Zachariah, 10-29-2004 10:33 PMThis message has been edited by Zachariah, 10-29-2004 10:38 PM

In Chap 2 verses 5-9 it talks about the plants and the shrubs not yet appearing- :6 says "but streams came up from the earth and watered the whole surface of the ground- the Lord God formed the man from the dust of the ground.... When that (-) after the word "ground" is put into place it is saying in a sense (while I'm talking about the ground, I made man out of the dust of the ground, just thought I would mention it) it's jumping to a different event but not disregarding what happens in between. :8 says "Now the Lord God HAD planted a garden. The plants are already there (before Adam) just like in Chap 1. 2:19 says "Now the Lord God HAD FORMED out of the ground all the beasts of the field..." He had already formed them (before Adam) just like in Chap 1. So as I see it grammer is needing to be studied further by the Bishop. Past tense referres to things that have already taken place. And those (-) have meaning not to be avoided or disregarded. And the Eve creation still happened after the animals and plants it just went into more detail about how she came about. No discrepancies. She was created by God. 1:27 "So God created man (human kind) in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them." This doesn't refer to a time line it just says God created them. Chap 2 goes into when and how she came to be. Oh and a cool thing that refers to Christ being with God during creation like John says "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginnng." That refers to Gen Chap 1:26 "Then God said, "Let US make man in OUR image, in OUR likeness...." Cool huh?This message has been edited by Zachariah, 10-29-2004 11:22 PMThis message has been edited by Zachariah, 10-29-2004 11:24 PMThis message has been edited by Zachariah, 10-29-2004 11:26 PM

So you can interpret what's there, force it to fit your preconcieved notions, but that does not change what was written. Genesis 1 and 2 are mutually exclusive. Two stories, two cultures, two eras.You asked how Christian Evolutionist worked. I believe I've shown you. The biggest difference is that the Christian Evolutionist understands that the Bible is a religious book, not a science or history text. Instead they look at the record that GOD left instead of some book written, edited, revised and redacted by humans with all the limitations they brought to the task.GOD did leave us a record. It is the universe we live in. And when you read what GOD wrote there you find evolution.

---

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

There's very little reason to believe that Genisis 1 and 2 were written by differenet authors.....just two oddly worded verses, really. It takes more faith to believe that 1 and 2 were intended to be 2 different stories than that they were written by the the same author.Jar, do you claim to be a Christian?

Zach, I'm a Christian and I believe in evolution. Why? Because I have no reason to believe that the creation story was intended by Yah to be taken as literal....and with the scientific evidenced in favor of evolution, I'm compelled to believe in it. Now, what I don't believe in (and there's no reason to) is abiogenisis, or that evolution didn't have a guiding agent......perhaps a directly acting guiding agent, as evidenced by the discovery of irreducibly complex biochemical structures.

Jar you know better.Others, there is a specific topic here. Try not to get into the details of specific differences between Christian Evolutionists and the others. The point is to just enumerate the differences here.Otherwise this will duplicate too many other threads such as the ID threads and the Genesis discussion threads.Chaos will ensue.Thanks.

Admin, when a thread gets so old does it get deleted, or can old threads still be accessed? If so, how?

Welcome to EvC Rusty. We do not delete posts or threads here. Threads are generally closed when they reach 300 posts due to technical issues, and some threads are closed when the topic is irretrievable. You can search through each forum by clicking on the menu in the top right corner of the page where it gives you an option of how many threads to retrieve in each topic.AbE - ok, that made no sense...
When you list all forums and then select a particular forum you have the option of how many topics to show.You can propose your own topic by posting in Proposed New TopicsWe also have a forum search function found in the Resourses menu in the blue bar menus at the top of the page.This message has been edited by AdminAsgara, 10-30-2004 01:43 AM

---

AdminAsgara
Queen of the Universe

http://asgarasworld.bravepages.com
http://perditionsgate.bravepages.com