Atheistic preacher?

First of all, I didn't say that I could prove to you that there is no god. That's impossible. I'd have to go look under every rock and shake every tree.What I want to convince you is there is no reason why you should believe in a god (or any other divine entity) unless it's purely for your own security as a person.Here comes the part that I like the most. I have said this many times before. The burden of proof always falls on the side that claims the positive. If I want to prove to you that a bear exists, all iu have to do is show you some kind of direct evidence that such a creature exists. However, if I want to prove to you that a bear doesn't exist, it's a lot harder for me to do so especially if the bear really doesn't exist. I'd have to search every habitat on Earth, build a spaceship and go to other planets to show that a bear doesn't exist.What I want you to do is ask yourself why you believe in a divine entity such as god. Ask yourself that question.Here are some arguments that I have gathered.(1)The bible says so.Well, the bible says a lot of things. The question is how do you know the bible is telling you the truth? Well, the answer I've always gotten was "god says so." Circular reasoning alert!(2)Common sense.May I remind you that common sense tells us that the sun orbits the earth.(3) Nature reflects god's plan.What the hell is this suppose to mean? Really, does anyone really know what the hell this mean?(4) "I just know it... I spoke to me... personal evidence..."Well, god spoke to Jim Jones also and look what happenned to the people that followed him.(5) Everything must have come from something, the universe had to have come from something, and that something is god.Well, let me see... first of all how the hell do you know that that something is the judeo-christian god? Secondly, if everything must have come from something, what created "god"?You are welcome to keep tossing out other reasons, but the fact remains that all of them require a leap of "faith".A friend of mine once said something along the line of "I knew that I was god the moment that I realized I was talking to myself when I prayed." Well, I had the same relevation, and it scared me. Either I was god or I needed psychiatric help.Any question so far?Added by edit:By the way, I believe what I said was "you are wasting your time."This message has been edited by Lam, 10-31-2004 03:25 AMAdded by edit again.I'm convinced that everyone can be saved... from such delusional mindset. I have met quite a few christians that became christians because their spouses and lovers were christians. Well, if they could do that than I guess I could do it too, except in reverse.I'm going to do everything I can to convert as many people like you as I can, even if it means seducing every one of you.This message has been edited by Lam, 10-31-2004 03:33 AM

---

He's not dead. He's electroencephalographically challenged.The longest word in the English language is pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis.

Nice dodge. I believe I said

quote:

---

Well, let me see... first of all how the hell do you know that that something is the judeo-christian god? Secondly, if everything must have come from something, what created "god"?

---

My point wasn't only about what you quoted. There was more to it. This is strawman for one very good reason: you are basically implying that atheists go by what "nature" tells them to do.I just want to mention the fact that I consider my sense of moral standards far far far far higher than most christians I know, including buz and other christians who preach hate on this board. Jesus wasn't talking about passifism. He was talking about being firm to your belief... if you have good reason for it. When someone slaps you on the cheek and you are firm in your belief with good reasons, you should symbolically "turn the other cheek" to tell the other person that you are firm in your belief. Passifism will one day get you killed. Well, I've recently read some of the Koran and I've studied Taoist philosophy. I can assure you that there are some things in them that are just as "good" as the NT. At this point, you stopped using reason and started ranting on your unsupported beliefs. You speak as if I go by what nature tells me to do. When was the last time you saw me kill my dog and eat it? Strawman Alert!!! You are wasting your time because you are telling them that there is something better in the great beyond rather than telling them to help make this world and this life a better thing. If you really want to not waste your time, I suggest you start preaching about the importance of recycling (I'm an environmentalist). Christians are some of the worst people when it comes to environmental health. If you really want to not waste your time, I suggest you start preaching about the importance of education and promotion of science. People live a lot longer these days than ever before simply because of science.You can preach about the importance of tolerance of others that are different than you rather than say that god wants this and that. You can preach about a whole number of other things that are more important than hope for something in the great beyond. Like I said, christians are some of the worst environmentalists out there. Just look at Bush and his supporters I have.

---

He's not dead. He's electroencephalographically challenged.The longest word in the English language is pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis.

Why do I need a message of hope if I happen to find the cure for aging? Um... Strawman Alert!!! This time I'm not even going to tell you why. I and myself have said this many times but it never seem to sink in. Well, we get those kind of people on both sides of the spectrum. Ok, I'm going to go out to get some gasoline and I'm going to lit my dog on fire with it. My friends would disagree with you on that about me. Just how many atheists... logical ones do you think you really know? Strawman!!! Give me one good reason why I shouldn't be annoyed by people that tried to trick me into going to bible camp for the weekend by telling me that it was some kind of international student get together thing and it was free without mentioning that we'd be spending all our time listening to preachers and there was no way to get out of there since transportation was also free? You haven't said anything that have substance to them. All I see are strawman, more strawman, and nothing but strawman.It's like me saying, "all white people believe in pre-marital sex and have no sense of moral when it comes to respecting your elders." Coincidently, that's what my parents believe. Trust me buz, my parents would look down on you just because you are white.This message has been edited by Lam, 10-31-2004 03:14 PM

---

He's not dead. He's electroencephalographically challenged.The longest word in the English language is pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis.

How so? I was merely pointing out some obvious flaws in his argument.A: All fish can fly because they have wings.B: Fish don't have wings.Admin: Off topic, the topic isn't about wings but it is about fish's ability to fly.Aren't you being a little too picky?

---

He's not dead. He's electroencephalographically challenged.The longest word in the English language is pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis.

Well, ok. I tend to itch to reply for something as illogical and unfounded as Buz's post.It's like me saying "all admins are girls" and you not being able to reply. It itches!

---

He's not dead. He's electroencephalographically challenged.The longest word in the English language is pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis.

An asteroid is on a course for Earth. The asteroid weighs 875,000 pounds and is traveling at 28 km a second. How much energy do you need to muster onto the asteroid to stop it?

---

He's not dead. He's electroencephalographically challenged.The longest word in the English language is pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis.

Then why mention it at all?A: Just to let you know that some people that talk to me are morons.B: Why did you call me a moron?A: I never said you're a moron. All I said was that some people that talk to me are morons.B: Then why tell me at all when we are talking about which one of us is a dumbass?Again, why mention it if you don't intend to imply anything? Well, I don't hate. I'm just angry, and I have good reasons to be angry. I wasn't patronizing you. I just wanted to point out that there are other texts that have just as good, if not better, ideas than the bible. If you know that there are good points in other religious texts as well, more power to you. Again, I ask you why mention something that is completely out of context when you are not implying?A: Just so you know that some people I look at are idiots.B: Why did you call me an idiot? You're looking at me right now.A: I didn't call you an idiot. I just said that some people I look at are idiots.B: But we're talking about how to prove the quadratic formula. Good, then we both agree that both atheists and theists have certain dark instincts. So what? How is this relevant to our discussion? Well, I'm not going to go any further than this because we're wandering off my field. Well, you'll be preaching about it once we start eating soylent green. Ok, I must admit that I was talking using my own personal experiences. For that, I apologize. That's the point. I'm trying to change your mind about becoming a preacher. You're wasting your time. Ok, going on.There is a typical problem in philosophy that I want to bring up. here is an article that you can read about it. Basically, can you prove to me that there is no such thing as an immaterial pink unicorn in your room? The other question is if we can't prove that there isn't an immaterial pink unicorn in your room, why not believe that there is an immaterial pink unicorn in your room?

---

He's not dead. He's electroencephalographically challenged.The longest word in the English language is pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis.

You know, that is the most depressing thing I've heard all day... all week... heck all month. If you need a preacher to tell you what's moral and what's not, you are no different than a child. You have no principles and no logic. It might be true that people who believe that there's something divine out there. However, what I am saying is that you are wasting your time because there is no evidence for the divine. It's like believing in an immaterial pink unicorn. You can't disprove it but it's kinda silly to believe in something that has no evidence. Please don't tell me you intend to brainwash the mental vulnerable. I am glad you have a social life. The thing is I did all of that, and more, when I was in high school and I was already an atheist. Ok, this is where I'm going to try to put the nail on the bull's eye.Rather than preaching to people how to deal with certain situations, why not learn to teach people how to think?Consider this. During times of slavery, many people thought slavery was evil, but they still believed that the white man was superior. I'm more than sure that there were preachers going around preaching about the evil of slavery but it never occurred to them that other problems would eventually arise after slavery had been abolished.Some started preaching tolerance for different races and different cultures out there, but it never occurred to them that homophobia was going to become a problem. Look at buzsaw. I'm sure he thinks that all are god's children and still he preaches hate of homosexuality.Not to be pessimistic, but I'm willing to bet 100 bucks that one day when you are grey you will preach some kind of message of hate and you will be convinced that whatever it is is evil even though it's really not.My problem with preaching is that it makes people depend to much on the preachers. When a new situation comes up they will not be able to deal with it. History have shown us over and over that your message of love just doesn't work. Who knows, may be one day, like buz, you will preach of hatred against aliens or something.This is why human reason, I think, is superior to any form of preaching out there. When you go to college, make sure to take as many philosophy classes as they offer and you will see that most of tolerance that we see today came from the various humanist philosophers rather than religious zealots. In fact, religious organizations have always been on the forefront of intolerance of every kind.Actually, now that I think about it, I'm convinced that if we ever make contact with an alien race that religion is going to be on the forefront of anti-alien policies.Anyway, just think about it. Would you rather people think things through or would you rather they depend solely on the preacher's view? Yes, but the same thing can be said about an immaterial pink unicorn. However, it's kinda silly to believe in it, wouldn't you agree? Thanks for the offer, but no thanks. The decision has already been made. An engineered virus will be released soon. The virus is designed to only target those that preach hate toward homosexuals. It will erase every trace of their human sexuality and turn them into beastiality addicts. However, there are those of us among the high rankings of our secret organization that think those homophobes will just turn around and start preaching hate against sex between 2 human beings of any kind. Immaterial pink unicorns are far more powerful than what most have in mind. Imagine an immaterial pink unicorn as best you can. Now, zoom out from that picture in your mind and imagine an immaterial pink unicorn above the previous one, even more powerful than the first. Zoom out further and imagine an even greater immaterial pink unicorn. Now, do that endlessly. That, my friend, is but a glimmering sliver of immaterial pink unicorns.

---

He's not dead. He's electroencephalographically challenged.The longest word in the English language is pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis.

Of course they do. Immaterial pink unicorns created everything in the universe.I think I've said everything I wanted to say... unless I think of something else after my very good night REM sleep which I'm about to enter.Conclusion for now: I have no doubt that you will preach love and tolerance. However, I am a very pessimistic person and I don't think your approach will get through the very thick skulls of the people that hate. I am convinced that the best way to rid the world of hate and intolerance is to teach people how to think and make it mandatory to take as many philosophy and logic classes as they possibly can. Those classes tend to make you question your beliefs, which is a very good thing. Teaching the dogma of love to fight the dogma of hate, I think, is a waste of time.A challenge. The rat, whatever, and buz are some of the very well known bigots on this board. Their entire basis for hating homosexuals and homosexuality is the message in the bible. Although I don't expect you to be able to get through to them, tell me how you would approach to making them realize that there's nothing wrong with homosexuality as long as it involves consenting adults.I have a feeling that no matter how many bible verses you wip out, they will wip out just as many bible verses, if not more, to support their bigoted belief. This is where, I think, the messages of the bible fail and reason and logic must take over.

---

He's not dead. He's electroencephalographically challenged.The longest word in the English language is pneumonoultramicroscopicsilicovolcanoconiosis.