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Author Topic:   Flood sorting
John
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 53 (16091)
08-26-2002 11:59 PM


Ok TB,
Lets have it. How does the flood sort dead things into the observed geologic strata?
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http://www.hells-handmaiden.com

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by compmage, posted 08-27-2002 2:46 AM John has not replied
 Message 3 by mark24, posted 08-27-2002 4:36 AM John has not replied
 Message 4 by John, posted 08-27-2002 11:40 PM John has not replied

  
John
Inactive Member


Message 4 of 53 (16136)
08-27-2002 11:40 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by John
08-26-2002 11:59 PM


quote:
Originally posted by John:
Ok TB,
Lets have it. How does the flood sort dead things into the observed geologic strata?

Come on, TB. Here is your chance to shine.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by John, posted 08-26-2002 11:59 PM John has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by Tranquility Base, posted 08-28-2002 12:51 AM John has replied

  
John
Inactive Member


Message 11 of 53 (16186)
08-28-2002 5:08 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Tranquility Base
08-28-2002 12:51 AM


quote:
Originally posted by Tranquility Base:
We propose that
1. biogeography - the localisation of species
2. hydrodynamic sorting - the flow and sink properties of organisms
3. relative mobility - escape speed, direction, desire to escape etc
is responsible for the fossil ordering.
Anatomically similar animals tend to have similar 1/2/3 prpoerties and hence fossil order is approximately correlatable with anatomical similarity or supposed homology.

So we should have sorting by anatomical similarity? All deer-like creatures ought to be in the same strata. All bird-like creatures ought to be in the same strata. All reptile-like creatures ought to be in the same strata.
quote:
In detail this would require a huge set of simualtions that would require knowledge of:
A. the pre-flood biogeography
B. every animal's hydrodynamic sorting propoerties
C. every animal's mobility and escape behaviour
D. the pre-flood topography/continental configuraiton
E. a precise model of the how/timing of the flood stages
As everyone knows this is all extremely difficult. So the only hope of ever doing anything like this might be to pick a subset of organisms and try it out.

In other words you have an impossibly complex theory-- or should I say irreducibly complex? And it is therefore invalid by virtue of being untestable. What's that you say? A,D, and E are all unknowable. There is no data.
What you need is a theory to describe the sorting behavior which does not depend upon unknowns. Something like the sorting of oil and vinegar in a jar of water. Jar size doesn't matter. Jar shape doesn't matter. The initial conditions don't matter. The method of stirring the mixture doesn't matter.
quote:
The evoltuionary model does not suffer from this difficulty of possibility of reconstruction becasue each layer is simply assumed to be a surface layer habitated for thousands of years. Each animal lived and died in its layer. Our model has no such simple assumption possible.
To assume that the upper layers of dirt are older than the lower layers does not seem like much of a stretch to me.
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http://www.hells-handmaiden.com

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Tranquility Base, posted 08-28-2002 12:51 AM Tranquility Base has not replied

  
John
Inactive Member


Message 47 of 53 (17911)
09-20-2002 10:11 PM
Reply to: Message 46 by Peter
09-03-2002 3:38 AM


bump...
I not quite convinced yet, TB.
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http://www.hells-handmaiden.com

This message is a reply to:
 Message 46 by Peter, posted 09-03-2002 3:38 AM Peter has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 49 by Peter, posted 09-26-2002 7:07 AM John has not replied

  
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