Tsunami: Please Explain God's Wrathful Intent

buzsawHow about an upper time limit beyond which we can consider the prophesy fulfilled or false?

It is interesting Buz that all your predictions are those that have come from science.Just exactly where in the Bible did it say anything about yellowstone's super volcano. When did anyone publish a clear interpretation of the Bible pointing out any of your predictions before scientific sources warned about them.It seems your Biblical interpretation is impotent without the input from the sciences Buz.

Lets speculate for a moment, shall we?
Many skeptics of Biblical Christianity despise the implication that God, IF He exists, is so concerned with the wills of the humans on this dustspeck in His glorious and very large Universe. Some would ask that even IF the End is to come, the End is but the End of Earth and surely not of the entire Universe. The literalists have these scriptures: Of course the skeptics will say that the early writers were surely unaware of the great vastness of the Universe. The literalist would say that current intellectual skeptics are unaware of the great power of God. In any case, sin is connected with the End. Some would say that if God wants to wipe everything out, they want nothing to do with Him anyway...even if He does exist. Others, wiser perhaps, know that God would keep them from the fire...in eternal reality, anyway. Its all about belief and familiarity with God as a reality and not a character in a dusty old book.The lesson for today is this: Helping rebuild from the Tsunami is helping people materialistically. To give them hope, one need not preach to them or implicate that they are heading for Hell. It is doing as Jar would suggest---being Jesus in the midst of them. They will not be forced to convert, but many WILL convert based on the Spirit of Love within the volunteers.This message has been edited by Phatboy, 01-13-2005 04:46 AM

No, no and no.

Your not going to believe this one, but God gave me a vision back in the begining of November when I was at a mentor group with my Pastor. We were all praying ,and I saw the globe, and waves crashing on the east coast of America, but I also saw the other side of the world as well. It was a globe, but I could see the whole thing. Then a thought entered my head that there was going to be a terrible disaster that would affect everyone in the world, including us. That it would also happen before our next meeting which was last weekend.The vision was so quick, I really didn't get a full grasp of it. I told several people about it, and they all remember. At the time I had thought it might be another terror attack, but I wasn't sure, I had mentioned that.I feel as though now I need to get closer to God, and maybe he is going to show me more things. If I get any more visions, I will post them in here, and then you guys can rip me apart.

That post had absolutely nothing to do with the questions I asked.

It is the work of Satan. However, God has permitted Satan to do these things. God looks down in sorrow to the suffereing. Satan will have his share of the punishment once prophecy is finished fulfilling.But this does not mean that God does not allow the wicked to suffer as a result of Satan's evil work. God's judgments upon the earth are judgments inflicted by Satan.There may be infants, women, and children involved. But none of this is God's fault. It is Adam and Eve's fault from the start for adhering to Satan. Their dissobedience caused all of this, not God. Now God is doing what he can to get us out of this mess and save as many as He can who are willing to be saved. If these infants, women, and children will be saved in the life to come, then what loss was it to lose their short lives in this world? Of the ones who died from the Tsunami, for the wicked, they will die the eternal death anyway. For the saved, they have lossed little and gained everything.The only real reason for the opening of this thread was in Abshalom's attempt to justify himself in not worshipping God. That is the only real reason.Just remember, the more natural disasters, catastrophes, and evil occurrences we see, it is only more evidence that for the existence God, not less.This message has been edited by Lysimachus, 01-13-2005 14:27 AM

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~Lysimachus

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The only real reason for the opening of this thread was in Abshalom's attempt to justify himself in not worshipping God. That is the only real reason.

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Mind-reader now? Isn't that one of Satan's tricks?

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Just remember, the more natural disasters, catastrophes, and evil occurrences we see, it is only more evidence that for the existence God, not less.

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Wow! well that's stunning piece of evidence has proven the existance of God beyond all doubt.

Would you agree too that any time disaster is averted, seemingly by coincidence, that that is also evidence for God?

Lysimachus:You say "it is the work of Satan. However, God has permitted Satan to do these things." I assume by "it" you mean the tsunami, and I must further assume by "these things" you possibly are referring to the tsunami's disasterous after-effects although you don't really make it clear.You then say that "God's judgments upon the earth are judgments inflicted by Satan." So, by that do you mean that God and Satan work as sort of a dynamic duo with God making the judgment to punish mankind and then assigning the dirty work to Satan? If so, that's a rather neat arrangement ... kinda like the one Pontius Pilate enjoyed, huh?You then go on to say that (paraphrased here) innocent women and children should be happy to sacrifice their lives in this preordained process because they should be happy to be out of this worldly mess and on their way to their just rewards. SICK!You then go on to make the haughty presumption that "the only real reason for the opening of this thread was in Abshalom's attempt to justify himself in not worshipping God. That is the only real reason." Well, aren't you the smug smart-assed know-it-all? But at least with you, after you pass your almighty judgments, at least you have the balls to carry out the dirty work yourself.You close with "just remember, the more natural disasters, catastrophes, and evil occurrences we see, it is only more evidence that for the existence God, not less." Do you really mean that "evil occurrences" are proof of God's existence? You'll have to elaborate on that one a little more. You lost me there, Lysimachus.Oh, and Lysimachus, I see that you have opened a thread similar to this one entitled "Is Something Wrong With Mother Earth." Are you insinuating that a supernatural entity exists (besides God and Satan) whose name is Mother Earth? Interesting.Anyway, earlier today I was contemplating asking the Administrators to close this thread due to the fact that none of you wacky Endtimers will directly address the questions in the OP regarding God's Wrath and Vengeance as specifically cited by His prophets and recorded in His Book. Instead, you all dodge and weave and pull the discussion way off topic with your lame, unsubstantiated fantasies.Really, I think anyone interested in anything being discussed in this thread might as well flop on over to Lysimachus's "Mother Earth" topic where all this hogwash is more pertinent.Regards, Abshalom

Abshalom,
I've been lurking this website for a few months, and you've finally managed to get me to break in with a post.I see you've had a rough time getting anyone to focus on the spirit of your questions. Let me give it a crack (Briefly, at least. Just an "umbrella" answer to try and cover everything in one swipe).A while back, God cursed the creation for Adam's sin. Everything started winding down from that point. We can debate that for years and perhaps never agree. But nevermind that, please. Instead, consider the words of Jesus found in Luke 13:"...And Jesus answering said unto them, Suppose ye that these Galilaeans were sinners above all the Galilaeans, because they suffered such things? I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish. Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem? I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish."We managed to bring death and destruction into the world by our sin. Just like a murderer brought the death sentence upon himself by murdering; we can't blame the mean judge for sentencing the guy.But what about the little kids and all the "good" people who died and continue to die (from disease, hunger, etc (tsunami aftermath)) you might ask? Well, look at the murderer who was sentenced to death by that mean ol' judge. The murderer's wife and little kids (assume he has little kids) will probably go hungry for a while, maybe even be homeless. The kids may grow up and become gang members because they had no father to guide and coach them properly. Let's say the kids wind up as drug addicts and die in a gangland style shootout in the street. All because their father screwed up his own life. Is any of this fair?Then again, was it fair that God's son came to earth to suffer in our place? For the sins WE have committed?Ok, so I understand that the tsunami babies are in a different catergory, and I'll grant you that. But the creation is cursed for our sake; our disobedience, our rebellion against God. The rain falls on both the wicked as well as the righteous. And death will come upon each of us, and much sooner than we expect no matter HOW we die (whether tsunami or old age). The real point is the one that Jesus makes in Luke 13 above (repentance).

Welcome aboard Juhrahnimo. If you've been lurking awhile you probably have a pretty good idea of how things work.Enjoy the ride.

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Well, kind of. This place is sort of like the republicans vs. the democrats, but still interesting reading.

I hope we force both sides to actually support their claims better than the various politicians are forced to be honest and rational.

Juhrahnimo: Thank you for your thoughtful reply. Although I may not see things in the same light as you, I will consider your attempt to enlighten me as an act in good faith.You may also wish to browse through the "Is There Something Wrong With Mother Earth" thread to see if you want to add your responses to that topic as well.Welcome to the fray.Peace, Abshalom