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Author
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Topic: Genesis: is it to be taken literally?
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Re: Meaning of Genesis 1
I'm not sure who you are quoting in Message 259, but that certainly is partially true. God's creation week is where we get the work week with a sabbath day to rest in Jewish times. I still believe the details of the creation to be literally true.
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 259 by Mike_King, posted 01-31-2005 6:13 PM | | Mike_King has not replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Message 264 of 301 (182133)
01-31-2005 7:33 PM
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Reply to: Message 263 by jar
01-31-2005 7:21 PM
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Re: Reply to jar
How can you say that when there are so many conflicting accounts in the flood stories? I guess I don't see the conflicts you are talking about. Could you be more specific?
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 263 by jar, posted 01-31-2005 7:21 PM | | jar has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 265 by jar, posted 01-31-2005 7:43 PM | | Terry48420 has not replied | | | Message 266 by jar, posted 01-31-2005 8:21 PM | | Terry48420 has replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Message 267 of 301 (182156)
01-31-2005 9:11 PM
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Reply to: Message 266 by jar
01-31-2005 8:21 PM
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Re: Reply to jar
what do you consider more reliable, records directly from GOD or those written by man? Those from God of course... All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works. II Tim 3:16,17 The entire Bible is given by God. What man writes is only comentary on the Bible and should be taken with a grain of salt.
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 266 by jar, posted 01-31-2005 8:21 PM | | jar has replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Message 269 of 301 (182165)
01-31-2005 9:35 PM
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Reply to: Message 268 by jar
01-31-2005 9:17 PM
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Re: Reply to jar
Yes, God did create the universe and everything in it and you can come to a knowledge that there is a God by observing the world around us (general revelation). However, you need the Bible (specific revelation) to really know God and what he expects of you. I assume that by your previous message that you think the Bible to be written by men all on there own, but that is not the case. The Bible is inspired (God dictated). It is not simply men compiling verbal myths.
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 268 by jar, posted 01-31-2005 9:17 PM | | jar has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 274 by jar, posted 02-01-2005 11:24 AM | | Terry48420 has replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Reply to crashfrog
How can a book substantiate its own divinity? The Bible does in a couple of ways. The first way is by saying it is in verses like II Tim 3:16. The second way is by giving prophecy of events that come true hundreds of years latter. The Bible is not just one book. It is a compilation of 66 books written by some 40 authors over a period of about 1600 years in three different languages. Given this the hand of God had to be in it for the Bible to make any sense at all. If you don't believe the Bible to be devine, then there is no reason for this thread of discussion about taking Genesis literally. However, I believe it is devine and should be taken literally except where the context dictates otherwise.
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 270 by crashfrog, posted 01-31-2005 9:36 PM | | crashfrog has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 273 by crashfrog, posted 02-01-2005 10:48 AM | | Terry48420 has replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Message 275 of 301 (182336)
02-01-2005 12:45 PM
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Reply to: Message 273 by crashfrog
02-01-2005 10:48 AM
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Re: Reply to crashfrog
The Bible says "Thy word is truth". Not the truth or a cultural truth just truth. God's word can not lie. When it gives historical information, it is accurate. Of course the Bible is not a complete history of the universe. Only God's dealings with his chosen people and how they are to live. When ever his people go to a city or have a battle, you can bet your bottom dollar that that city or battle was there. The same goes for the great flood and the creation. God's word would not be true if he gave an account of an event that never happened or was factually incorrect.
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 273 by crashfrog, posted 02-01-2005 10:48 AM | | crashfrog has replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Message 276 of 301 (182338)
02-01-2005 12:50 PM
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Reply to: Message 274 by jar
02-01-2005 11:24 AM
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Re: Reply to jar
Did man build any of the universe? Man builds things all the time, but uses existing things. He can not create things. Does your question have a point that is on topic?
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 274 by jar, posted 02-01-2005 11:24 AM | | jar has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 277 by jar, posted 02-01-2005 12:57 PM | | Terry48420 has replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Message 279 of 301 (182362)
02-01-2005 2:59 PM
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Reply to: Message 277 by jar
02-01-2005 12:57 PM
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Re: Reply to jar
So far I think we agree that man did not create the Universe, that the Universe then provides a record that was not written by man. So far are we together? I think so. However, there are a lot of unknowns in the universe and much of what we think we know through science may change in the future if the past is any indication.
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 277 by jar, posted 02-01-2005 12:57 PM | | jar has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 280 by jar, posted 02-01-2005 3:01 PM | | Terry48420 has replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Message 281 of 301 (182365)
02-01-2005 3:10 PM
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Reply to: Message 280 by jar
02-01-2005 3:01 PM
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Re: Reply to jar
Are there any original copies of ANY of the documents included in the Canon available? No, but there are some very old copies and the scribes were very carful not to make mistakes.
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 280 by jar, posted 02-01-2005 3:01 PM | | jar has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 283 by jar, posted 02-01-2005 3:12 PM | | Terry48420 has replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Message 284 of 301 (182368)
02-01-2005 3:17 PM
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Reply to: Message 283 by jar
02-01-2005 3:12 PM
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Re: Reply to jar
Very minor differences.
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 283 by jar, posted 02-01-2005 3:12 PM | | jar has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 296 by jar, posted 02-01-2005 5:54 PM | | Terry48420 has replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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crashfrog
Shakespeare is a liar? Shakespheare wrote plays...he never claimed they were true. The Bible claims to be "Truth". The very embodyment on truth.
Only when you assume it is. When you actually try to verify that accuracy, you find that the Bible and the historical account from other sources don't agree. Archeology has proven many of the historical facts and has never proved it wrong. There are some things we have not found yet, but that is not proof that they were not there in antiquity.
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 282 by crashfrog, posted 02-01-2005 3:11 PM | | crashfrog has replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Message 288 of 301 (182372)
02-01-2005 3:48 PM
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Reply to: Message 287 by Brian
02-01-2005 3:36 PM
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Reply to brian
But, since this is about Genesis, can you provide ANY archaeological evidence for ANY Genesis character or event? I was mainly talking about latter books, but I did see a program on the Discovery Channel that found the remains of Joseph's house in Egypt. The people in Genesis were mostly nomadic and would not leave much of a trace after 4000 years.
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 287 by Brian, posted 02-01-2005 3:36 PM | | Brian has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 290 by Brian, posted 02-01-2005 4:09 PM | | Terry48420 has not replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Archeology proves that the Flood never happened. That's one thing, right there. Geology according to some proves that there was a catastrophic world wide flood. BTW the Bible does claim to be truth John 8:31,32 John 17:17
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 289 by crashfrog, posted 02-01-2005 4:05 PM | | crashfrog has replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Message 297 of 301 (182406)
02-01-2005 5:57 PM
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Reply to: Message 293 by Soplar
02-01-2005 4:35 PM
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Re: Response re My Old/Closed Thread
Hi Soplar, I am one of the few YECs in this thread. I do not have all the answers, but I will give it a shot and point you to a couple of books if you are really interested in learning about the YEC position.
1. Creationism asserts that the world, as we see it today, was formed approximately 10,000 years ago by a supernatural Creator. If so, then either: The creator established the world and then left things to proceed on their own Or The Creator is still creating, since the world keeps changing — e.g., movement of continents
I would lean toward option 1. Things like the movement on the contenents are not really creative works of God, but the natural order of things that God set up. God has intervened in history after the creation. Most notable is sending his son Jesus.
But then, either the Creator established a world in which bad things happen such as cancer, heart disease, etc., or the Creator is creating them at this time. God created things to be perfect. No sickness, death and etc. Sickness and death were introduced into the world at the fall of man when he ate of the forbidden fruit in Genesis 3.
2. A similar set of arguments applies to the Intelligent Designer concept. I will refer you to a book that may help: Apologetics Press has a book called "Signs of Intelligence" by William Dembski and James Kushiner. I don't personally have the book, but have heard that it is very good.
3. The question of why the explanation of the world in a book written over 2,000 is superior to the accumulated knowledge of some of the greatest minds who have ever lived. Because it is the word of God and He should know about these things. Our scientific theories change all the time as new data is found. God does not change.
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 293 by Soplar, posted 02-01-2005 4:35 PM | | Soplar has not replied |
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Terry48420
Inactive Member
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Message 299 of 301 (182410)
02-01-2005 6:10 PM
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Reply to: Message 296 by jar
02-01-2005 5:54 PM
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Re: Reply to jar
At some point it comes down to faith. Either faith in your understanding of how the universe works or faith in God's word.
Ps 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, there is no God.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 296 by jar, posted 02-01-2005 5:54 PM | | jar has not replied |
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