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Author Topic:   Consciousness outside of the brain
RIP
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 21 (186278)
02-17-2005 3:53 PM


What is the general consensus in here regarding this phenomenon and near-death experiences? I have read that they have been replicated with ketamine and LSD, but they also differ in many aspects, namely, the near-death experience generally having a life-long effect.
This article is very old, but what do you make of it? Scientists conducted a study where they feel they have proof that consciousness can exist outside of the brain. 63 people who had heart attacks were interviewed, 7 recalled memories [while clinically dead], and 4 counted as near-death experiences. Also, none of those who experienced this phenomenon had low oxygen levels, like often claimed.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/986177.stm
Also, has anybody delved into Gary Schwartz's "Afterlife Experiments" where he conducted a "scientific" study of mediums, including famous ones, such as John Edwards? According to his findings, these mediums were overwhelmingly accurate with people who they have no prior experience with.
This message has been edited by RIP, 02-17-2005 14:47 AM
This message has been edited by AdminSylas, 02-17-2005 15:50 AM

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 Message 4 by Zhimbo, posted 02-18-2005 10:31 AM RIP has replied
 Message 5 by Silent H, posted 02-18-2005 11:28 AM RIP has replied
 Message 6 by Coragyps, posted 02-18-2005 11:55 AM RIP has replied
 Message 9 by ohnhai, posted 02-19-2005 5:10 AM RIP has replied
 Message 19 by Ben!, posted 02-23-2005 3:51 AM RIP has not replied

  
RIP
Inactive Member


Message 10 of 21 (187121)
02-21-2005 1:17 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by Silent H
02-18-2005 11:28 AM


I suppose I should have had separate topics for this. I wasn't really trying to connect near-death experiences and John Edwards. I was trying to essentially bring up life after death in general.
My two points were:
1) This study showed consciousness outside of the brain while patients were deemed clinically dead.
2) A completely separate point. A study of mediums revealed their overwhelming accuracy in relaying information from "the other side" to people they have never met before, in a controlled atmosphere.

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RIP
Inactive Member


Message 11 of 21 (187122)
02-21-2005 1:19 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by Zhimbo
02-18-2005 10:31 AM


I thought it had said they were considered clinically dead. I'm not a doctor, what is considered clinically dead? In "The Idiots Guide to Near-Death Experiences," it noted that there has been several documented cases of people who have actually even been taking to the morgue and were toe-tagged in their drawers, and came back to life shortly after, then recounting a near-death experience. I would assume that is clinically dead.

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RIP
Inactive Member


Message 12 of 21 (187124)
02-21-2005 1:23 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by Coragyps
02-18-2005 11:55 AM


How many people actually have life-altering experiences though [besides quitting the drug] from ketamine and LSD? Typically, if they envision similar happenings as the NDE experiencer, after the drug has wore off, they realize what happened, and it does not haunt them for life [save for a chemical imbalance]. Some people find it so real that they completely reform their religious beliefs; from Atheist to whatever denomination. Some are so entranced by their experience, they want to commit suicide to "return to the light." I do not believe LSD or Ketamine have these effects, besides, again, as a result of a chemical imbalance.
This message has been edited by RIP, 02-21-2005 01:23 AM

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RIP
Inactive Member


Message 13 of 21 (187126)
02-21-2005 1:27 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by ohnhai
02-19-2005 5:10 AM


I would certainly disagree with this. Many people have vastly different experiences. And to label that you are "fairly sure" of consciousness only residing in our brain, and any other notion is silly is grossly unfair of you because it seems you have not weighed any evidence from the sides of NDE research. It seems you hold a "commonly held perception" as well, no?

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RIP
Inactive Member


Message 18 of 21 (187675)
02-23-2005 2:05 AM


So do the people who experience NDE's while clinically dead just have similar brain chemistry as those who use ketamine and have a ND-ish experience? How often does someone who uses ketamine have something similar to a NDE? Years ago, I knew numerous people who did Special K constantly, and excessively, and not one of them ever reported anything similar to a NDE.
This message has been edited by RIP, 02-23-2005 02:07 AM

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