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Author | Topic: IC challenge: Evolve a bicycle into a motorcycle! | |||||||||||||||||||||||
nator Member (Idle past 2190 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: What things are observed to tend to go into chaos?
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nator Member (Idle past 2190 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: Right, and we can see and talk to the designer who wrote the program. He can also show us the entire code of the program and explain exactly how he did it. This is positive evidence for this particular designer and exactly how he did what he did. Now, what is the positive evidence for your uberdesigner that is separate from what is designed? Is there any evidence that does not consist of "We don't have a naturalistic explanation so it must have been the IDer"?
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nator Member (Idle past 2190 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: Nope. A god or gods could have poofed the first replicators into existence and this would not falsify one iota of evolutionary theory. Life could have been seeded here from another planet, either randomly or on purpose by alien life, and this would not falsify one iota of evolutionary theory. Evolutionary theory is an explanation of what happens to life once it got here. How life got here is irrelevant to the Theory, just as the source of wind is irrelevant to the study of aerodynamics.
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nator Member (Idle past 2190 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: Don't you mean the Chance plus selection naturalist group? Because leaving out "selection" would be a gross misrepresentation that I am fairly positive you have been informed of approximately one and a half million times by now.
quote: So, do we observe the laws of physics changing to accomodate unchanging life, or is it the other way around?
quote: OK. There's a designer. Show me.
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Buzsaw Inactive Member |
every instance I know of where intelligence has intentionally interfered with the development of species to get a "designed" result, the purpose has been to make it a "better" food source ... Yah, I know what you mean, bud. Trouble is with some of the dog breeds, they've got the prices up so high, we're back to chicken and pork. The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past. buzsaw
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Buzsaw Inactive Member |
Hi Rrhain. My point in all this was to refute the argument that spontaneous generation was not included in the process of evolution. The arguments of my counterparts in this is as silly as trying to argue that creation was not part of the process of intelligent design.
The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past. buzsaw
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Yaro Member (Idle past 6516 days) Posts: 1797 Joined: |
This message has been edited by Yaro, 03-27-2005 09:01 AM This message has been edited by Yaro, 03-27-2005 09:01 AM
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Buzsaw Inactive Member |
So please can you explain how a bike making factory is anything like a protein making cell. Start with the fact that all of the different parts of the bike have to be made up of the same material, and then go on to explain how the blueprints for the bike (and everything else the factory makes) are stored and copied. The likelihood of the bike to motorbike is likely equal or better than the likelihood of building a single single functional protein randomly from primordial soup. The chance of assembling 50 essential amino acids randomly to correct sequence so as to build a single functional "folded" protein would be about 10 to the 65th power or about one in the number of atoms in a galexy according to the following very interesting sight. When you bring up the site, go down about halfway and click on the link regarding mathmatical liklihoods.http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Aegean/8830/abiogenesis.html The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past. buzsaw
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Buzsaw Inactive Member |
You know them as well as I.
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Buzsaw Inactive Member |
Right, and we can see and talk to the designer who wrote the program. Off topic, but some of us do.
He can also show us the entire code of the program and explain exactly how he did it. Get sensible if you want responses.
Now, what is the positive evidence for your uberdesigner that is separate from what is designed? Is there any evidence that does not consist of "We don't have a naturalistic explanation so it must have been the IDer"? See link in my recent post. This message has been edited by buzsaw, 03-27-2005 10:07 AM The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past. buzsaw
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1425 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
LOL, except in S.America ...
and the depressed cat population around (ethnic reference deleted) restaurants ... it's just a reference to an old science fiction story where it turns out humans are bred for .... we are limited in our ability to understand by our ability to understand RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist
{{{Buddha walks off laughing with joy}}}
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Buzsaw Inactive Member |
We better get back to serious topic or admin'll feed us to the lions!
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1425 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
I am going to assume that as any part of the bicycle plans ("DNA") are available to chose from and mix parts into new arrangements, I also have access to the "DNA" of other mechanisms as possible things to evolve on a bicycle.
Thus adding a battery powered light to the bicycle to use in the dark is an evolutionary advantage over the plain bicycle. Adding a generator to the system is a further improvement that is selected for as it extends the operation of the light. (I used to have a bike with a generator built into the front hub for a most efficient system). Increasing the size of the battery now enables me to use the generator as a motor to assist in peddling in the tough hills, but generate electricity to store in the battery when the goings are easier, an improvement that allows more or bigger hills to be covered. Increasing the size of the {generator\motor} and the capacity of the storage battery to give stronger and longer power assist on the hills is also selected as having an advantage over the smaller systems until a compromise in size and weight is reached, at which point stasis sets in for a while. Then I add a small motor to the generator to assist the generation of electricity, allowing the battery to be smaller and still get the same overall result, plus now I need to pedal less to generate the requisite electricity to use in the hilly areas. Finally I link the motor directly to the drive mechanism to get around energy lost in the various intermediate stages, and allow the {generator\battery} system to atrophy and fall off. The motor continues to grow and take on more and more of the actual task of propulsion. No biggy eh? Enjoy. we are limited in our ability to understand by our ability to understand RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist
{{{Buddha walks off laughing with joy}}}
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Trixie Member (Idle past 3726 days) Posts: 1011 From: Edinburgh Joined: |
I love it! Really concise and includes nice selection of useful and non-useful parts and how their usefulness can change depending on other changes. Neat
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Buzsaw Inactive Member |
You need be highly commended, Razd, for the wonderfully intelligent designing of your bicycle.
How about a lever regulated or even computerized long mainspring coil rigged up somehow inside of front and back wheels around the hubs to somehow wind up when you brake on the hills and elsewhere which you can later, when needed release to add to your needed power in your design? This message has been edited by buzsaw, 03-27-2005 08:11 PM The immeasurable present is forever consuming the eternal future and extending the infinite past. buzsaw
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