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Member Posts: 3941 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
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Author | Topic: Terry at the Talk Origins board | |||||||||||||||||||||||
Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3941 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
Oh, Richard Strauss, Op. 35.
Are you referring to me or Terry (or both of us)? Moose
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Percy Member Posts: 22391 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
Terry's the windmill.
--Percy
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Andya Primanda Inactive Member |
This Salty guy is interesting... Can anybody invite him here? Put him in a team with Peter Borger and arrange a 2-on-1 against SLPx in 'The Great Debate'!
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3941 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
I've now got an ally at the active Grand Canyon topic, at the Talk Origins board.
My newest message there, is number 63. I think my next message at that site may be my last. It may be: MORTON'S DEMON!MORTON'S DEMON! MORTON'S DEMON! Added by edit: The Glenn Morton "Morton's Demon" message can be found at : http://EvC Forum: Ignorance and Arrogance -->EvC Forum: Ignorance and Arrogance I first mentioned "Morton's Demon", in this topic, at http://EvC Forum: What happened at talk origins? -->EvC Forum: What happened at talk origins? Moose [This message has been edited by minnemooseus, 10-15-2002]
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frank Inactive Member |
Declare victory first !
Clear Skies ! Frank
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Randy Member (Idle past 6247 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote: I don't think Salty will debate. When I asked him some questions about what I see are some inconsistencies between his semi-meiosis papers and things he says on the board he told me to stop interrogating him. He is comfortable on Terry's board because no one knows enough about evolutionary theory and chromosome structure to really challenge him. You will note the he mostly posts anti-Darwinist sound bites.Randy
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Percy Member Posts: 22391 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
Doesn't Terry have a good point about Havasu Canyon? Not in the final tally, of course, but at this middle stage of the discussion where you've been arguing that a younger age for part of the Marble Canyon has no implications for the age of the rest of the canyon, Havasu Canyon is almost at the other end of the canyon. Terry is pointing out that younger dates aren't just at the top end of the canyon, but also at the bottom end, and by implication probably lots of other places too.
This is easily rebutted, but it seemed his strongest point, and you didn't seem to address it. --Percy
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3941 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
quote: The information presented for Havasu Canyon is also that the part of the canyon under consideration, is the deepest part, not the entire depth. But the information is presented in a rather fuzzy manner, so I didn't choose to pursue it. Instead, I have chosen to primarily focus in on this statement, from the "new information". I have quoted it to Terry repeatidly, in red text with bold highlighting.
quote: This explicitly states that it is the bottom third of the canyon, that was erroded in the last 700,000 years. The last 700,000 years doesn't cover the top two-thirds of the Grand Canyons depth. I would think that this in itself should be plenty to shoot down Terry's arguement that the entire Grand Canyon, rim to river, was erroded in the most recent 700,000 years. But, alas, Morton's demon seems to be powerful enough to filter the "a third of" right out of the sentence. Terry persists on reading it as "Some scientists now believe that the canyon’s depth may have been cut in the blink of a geologic eye perhaps during the past 600,000 to 700,000 years. Moose
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wj Inactive Member |
Here is part of a recent posting by Terry on his Closer and closer thread which illustrates 2 points (see message 27).
"It is those that DON'T post that we are speaking too, Salty! Those are the ones that have not had their minds set like concrete on one paradigm or another due to whatever educational system they have been steeped in. We challenge them to QUESTION AUTHORITY! That is the beginning of true knowledge." Firstly I don't know if it is more laughable or pathetic that Terry should challenge others to question authority when his whole worldview is based on unquestioned acceptance of biblical authority. Second, his reference to the silent lurkers supports my view from message 70 that Terry thinks the lurkers agree with his opinion or at least are undecided. I'm sure that Wehappyfew, Mark24, Mammuthus etc (some silent lurkers) would not like to see themselves counted as evolution doubters or skeptics as Terry naturally assumes. [This message has been edited by wj, 10-17-2002]
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3941 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
Functioning in the Admin mode, I did a save and print out of the complete topics list. The file ran 1,034 KB, took 31 pages to print out, and numbered 665 topics (including a number of damaged topics).
Anyhow, very deep in the list, I discovered an old Talk Origins / Terry topic. It's at http://EvC Forum: What happened at talk origins? -->EvC Forum: What happened at talk origins? . Moose
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Mammuthus Member (Idle past 6475 days) Posts: 3085 From: Munich, Germany Joined: |
[QUOTE]Originally posted by wj:
[B]Here is part of a recent posting by Terry on his Closer and closer thread which illustrates 2 points (see message 27). "It is those that DON'T post that we are speaking too, Salty! Those are the ones that have not had their minds set like concrete on one paradigm or another due to whatever educational system they have been steeped in. We challenge them to QUESTION AUTHORITY! That is the beginning of true knowledge." Firstly I don't know if it is more laughable or pathetic that Terry should challenge others to question authority when his whole worldview is based on unquestioned acceptance of biblical authority. Second, his reference to the silent lurkers supports my view from message 70 that Terry thinks the lurkers agree with his opinion or at least are undecided. I'm sure that Wehappyfew, Mark24, Mammuthus etc (some silent lurkers) would not like to see themselves counted as evolution doubters or skeptics as Terry naturally assumes. ************************ Hi wjI actually have not lurked over there for a while. I find it useless to confront anyone over there when there is such a high probablitiy that when I am in conflict with I will get banned, my posts deleted, or edited to mean something I did not say. Terry declared his unwillingness to debate in a forum where he does not have this power of censorship. And I have been busy arguing with Peter Borger and slugging it out with Wordswordsman on this board. Though I may have a little more time since Wordswordsman has declared his unwillingness to debate evolution any more and has instead shifted to proclaiming he has the characteristics of a deity and that christianity justifies slavery....why go out to the circus at Terry's when we have a 3 ring circus with Wordy here? Cheers,M
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3941 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
My most recent message at the canyon topic, at the Talk Origins board:
quote: Moose ps: I've been posting ban provoking comments at TE. I should be gone from there soon. Morton's Demon has Terry's head in a vice.
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Percy Member Posts: 22391 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
Terry's reply will be that his point all along has been that science is coming closer and closer to the Creationist point of view, and the fact that science isn't yet all the way there isn't significant at this stage of the process.
--Percy
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3941 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
I'll cite and quote this (timed stamped message) to Terry, after he makes the predicted statement.
Moose
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Percy Member Posts: 22391 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2 |
You might also mention that dates are revised all the time, both upward and downward. Geologists are simply responding to new data or improved interpretations or analyses of existing data, and it has nothing to do with the YEC perspective. They're not disagreeing with YEC when they revise upward, and they're not moving toward the YEC point of view when they revise downward. Their perspective has been and remains one of geologic time, something which the YEC maximum of 10,000 years doesn't allow.
--Percy
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