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Author Topic:   Firefly
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 59 of 90 (202728)
04-26-2005 4:26 PM
Reply to: Message 58 by crashfrog
04-26-2005 3:25 PM


Well, yeah, I felt that way too. But the show seems to reinforce their feelings, not ours. It felt preachy to me, like "See what happens, people, when you have sex outside of a loving relationship?"
See, I never got that either. It's a running theme on all Whedon shows that sex complicates and intensifies situations, because... well, for most people that's the case. It could be societal, or ingrained, or blah blah blah, doesn't really matter. There it is anyway. But I didn't see any moral or tsk-tsk-you-should-have-known sort of connotation.
Contrast that to Katee Sackhoff's Starbuck.
I haven't seen this show, so I couldn't say.
Not the juvenile whore/virgin dichotomy of Firefly.
Mm... not getting it. Again, go back to Out of Gas... Kaylee, everybody's little sister, having a grand old time with some guy based solely on the fact that he's got a nice chest and some cool tats. And afterwards, she's done up no differently than her standard sweetie character.
I know there's not a shitload of other scenes to refer to, but let's face it... there are thirteen episodes, and four female characters. One of those is characters is married, and another's a basket case.
I mean, the Millenium Falcon has it's guts hangin' out, panels blown off, etc. It looks like a flying jalopy hotrod. You almost expect it to honk "la cucaracha" when it tears out of Mos Eisly. But even so it looks like it could fly.
If someone threw it like a frisbee, maybe.
Not like Mal, the archetypical cowboy in a black-and-white moral universe. The entire show is set up so that he never has to do anything but the right thing, the thing we're all rooting for.
Weren't we just talking about what an asshole he is to Inara?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 58 by crashfrog, posted 04-26-2005 3:25 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 60 by crashfrog, posted 04-26-2005 4:49 PM Dan Carroll has replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 62 of 90 (202748)
04-26-2005 5:13 PM
Reply to: Message 60 by crashfrog
04-26-2005 4:49 PM


Well, somehow my wife saw it too, so I don't think I'm making that up, but your milage may vary. Oh, well. I think I've made my views clear, I hope.
You have, I'm just sayin'... I don't see it.
And I hope you won't watch it with the aim of proving me wrong; my hope is that you'll watch it because its good, well-written, engaging, character-driven sci-fi drama.
Hells, no. This isn't my first conversation with you on this forum, guy. If I come across the show, my reaction'll probably be something like, "Oh, Crash said this was good, I should check it out."
Aren't we, as the audience, rooting for him to say what he says? To urge her to leave the prostitute's lifestyle so that she can settle down with him?
I wasn't. I found myself thinking, "Mal, you fucking asshole. I totally get where you're coming from... shit, I'd probably do the same thing. Shit."
Isn't that rather the point of the unresolved sexual tension between them? To say "look, if she didn't insist on being a prostitute, she could settle down with this nice guy."
See, I got the same thing off Mal and Inara that I got off Buffy and Spike... namely, "God DAMN, I want these characters to get together. And... shit, there is absolutely no way this will end happily."
I always liked that about Whedon shows... that by and large, there isn't always a "Oh, if you only did this, you'd be happy together!" It's more of a "damn, sucks to be them."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 60 by crashfrog, posted 04-26-2005 4:49 PM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 64 by crashfrog, posted 04-26-2005 5:28 PM Dan Carroll has not replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 73 of 90 (202954)
04-27-2005 9:18 AM
Reply to: Message 63 by Entomologista
04-26-2005 5:26 PM


Re: Yo, Dan!
Now on topic...I really don't think Kaylee is as open and carefree as she is stupid. Ok, maybe she's more like an idiot-savant. She can fix the ship, but when it comes to anything else she's like a semi-retarded 13 year old.
Where's that coming from? I mean... she's not a genius at anything else, but it's not like there's anywhere in the series that she does something outrageously moronic.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 63 by Entomologista, posted 04-26-2005 5:26 PM Entomologista has not replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 74 of 90 (202955)
04-27-2005 9:20 AM
Reply to: Message 69 by crashfrog
04-26-2005 9:23 PM


Maybe those four eps will totally change my opinion of the series.
They might well. And I'll push Trash, the episode Schraf left off her list of awesome episodes. It's the one where Saffron shows up again.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 69 by crashfrog, posted 04-26-2005 9:23 PM crashfrog has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 76 by nator, posted 04-27-2005 1:00 PM Dan Carroll has replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 75 of 90 (202958)
04-27-2005 9:26 AM
Reply to: Message 72 by nator
04-27-2005 7:23 AM


Did I mention that Whedon typically reveales his Arcs very, very slowly?
To a point. Once he actually gets to them, he doesn't dick around. Take Buffy, for instance. For the first half of first season, there's all this mystery around Angel. Then, boom. One episode, the deal with Angel is explained to us. Then at the start of season 2, they start slowly introducing all this mysterious stuff about Angel's past. Then, Spike and Drusilla show up, and boom. The important gist of Angel's backstory is filled in.
Whedon's very good at not falling into what I like to call the Wolverine-trap with characters. Basically, "keeping this character a mystery is more fun, so we're never actually gonna tell you everything. In fact, what we do tell you might not actually be in continuity. In fact, fuck off, the character's been around 20 years and all you really know is that he has claws and used to live in Canada. Ha ha, eat it, fanboy."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 72 by nator, posted 04-27-2005 7:23 AM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 77 by nator, posted 04-27-2005 1:05 PM Dan Carroll has not replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 78 of 90 (203077)
04-27-2005 4:38 PM
Reply to: Message 76 by nator
04-27-2005 1:00 PM


No shit you think it's one of the best episodes.
No shit, indeed.
Well, yeah, that's why Crash needs to see Ariel.
True.
This message has been edited by [Dan's Clever Alias], 04-27-2005 04:39 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 76 by nator, posted 04-27-2005 1:00 PM nator has not replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 80 of 90 (203401)
04-28-2005 2:42 PM


A friend of mine just pointed me to the following online tidbit. Trying to not put too much stock in it before getting better confirmation.
"According to an interview with Alan Tudyk, this is the first movie in a three-picture Firefly contract with Universal."

Replies to this message:
 Message 81 by nator, posted 04-29-2005 8:12 AM Dan Carroll has replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 82 of 90 (203623)
04-29-2005 9:39 AM
Reply to: Message 81 by nator
04-29-2005 8:12 AM


It's possible that TV execs are watching this pretty carefully. From what I understand, (and my source is the internet at large, so take it with several grains of salt) DVD sales on more than a few shows are causing networks to scratch their heads and think, "I don't get it. Why did we cancel this, again?"
The big one is Family Guy, but from what I hear, Firefly's up there too.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 81 by nator, posted 04-29-2005 8:12 AM nator has not replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 83 of 90 (203635)
04-29-2005 10:48 AM
Reply to: Message 61 by DrJones*
04-26-2005 4:58 PM


Just as a heads-up, Dr. J... I'm stealing your avatar for livejournal. It's too wonderful to not do so.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 61 by DrJones*, posted 04-26-2005 4:58 PM DrJones* has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 84 by DrJones*, posted 04-29-2005 2:52 PM Dan Carroll has not replied

  
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