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Author Topic:   Noah's Ark
Dead Parrot
Member (Idle past 3345 days)
Posts: 151
From: Wellington, NZ
Joined: 04-13-2005


Message 121 of 302 (208883)
05-16-2005 11:00 PM
Reply to: Message 120 by lfen
05-16-2005 10:51 PM


Re: The Old Fart reminisces
Seconded, It's making my brain itch.

Mat 27:5 And he went and hanged himself
Luk 10:37 Go, and do thou likewise.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 122 of 302 (209030)
05-17-2005 12:27 PM
Reply to: Message 121 by Dead Parrot
05-16-2005 11:00 PM


Re: The Old Fart reminisces
The moral is very simple. The original caller as well as the folk we sent out on site found a bodacious big fire. Their response was "The whole world'son fire".
Now those of us still lounging at the fire house could reach over, place our hands on the wall (one of the key tests when a call came in at night. If the wall was not yet hot, the fire was not close enough to be threatening and so you could safely go back to sleep) and be assured that in fact, the Whole world was not on fire.
So it was with the Great Flood.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 123 by lfen, posted 05-17-2005 12:43 PM jar has replied
 Message 125 by Specter, posted 05-19-2005 9:40 AM jar has replied

lfen
Member (Idle past 4677 days)
Posts: 2189
From: Oregon
Joined: 06-24-2004


Message 123 of 302 (209031)
05-17-2005 12:43 PM
Reply to: Message 122 by jar
05-17-2005 12:27 PM


Re: The Old Fart reminisces
Jar,
Do you agree with those who see the flood story as being brought in from the Babylon flood story? That makes the most sense to me.
lfen

This message is a reply to:
 Message 122 by jar, posted 05-17-2005 12:27 PM jar has replied

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jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 124 of 302 (209040)
05-17-2005 1:34 PM
Reply to: Message 123 by lfen
05-17-2005 12:43 PM


The Babylonian Myth as source?
I'd say it was one of the sources.
But floods were something extreme, yet familar to all civilations that grew up on plains. In the case of the Biblical Flood Myths I imagine there were multiple sources, Babylonian, possibly part Egyptian as well as several local tales.
The biggest reason to lean towards Babylonian and local sources is the bit about rain. The Biblical myth definitely connects local events, long monsoon like rains, with the arrival of the waters and a slow drain off period. That is an entirely different flavor than the Egyptian floods which came regularly and where the cause of the flood was hidden from knowledge.
The Biblical flood myth seems to point to something unusual, a unique event (or events) as opposed to something that happened regularly and is seen as totally destructive in nature as opposed to the Egyptian view where the flood is considered life giving.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

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Specter
Inactive Member


Message 125 of 302 (209631)
05-19-2005 9:40 AM
Reply to: Message 122 by jar
05-17-2005 12:27 PM


The Whole World's On Fire
Therefore, are you saying that the sources could be telling us that the Babylonian area only flooded and not the whole world, yet the bodacious tempest made it seem like the whole world flooded?
Either way, it destroys our interpretation of God.
Which is why we need the Faith to trust in the Bible's interpretation.

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 Message 122 by jar, posted 05-17-2005 12:27 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 126 by jar, posted 05-19-2005 12:08 PM Specter has replied

jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 126 of 302 (209657)
05-19-2005 12:08 PM
Reply to: Message 125 by Specter
05-19-2005 9:40 AM


Re: The Whole World's On Fire
Sure. It may not even have been all of Babylon but only one small valley or town.
Either way, it destroys our interpretation of God.
Why? And even if that were true, what relevance does it have?
Are you concerned with your interpretation of God or GOD?

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 125 by Specter, posted 05-19-2005 9:40 AM Specter has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 127 by Specter, posted 05-19-2005 12:50 PM jar has replied

Specter
Inactive Member


Message 127 of 302 (209675)
05-19-2005 12:50 PM
Reply to: Message 126 by jar
05-19-2005 12:08 PM


Re: The Whole World's On Fire
Obviously!What, did you think I'm the person who disrespects my God, who takes his name in vain?
EDIT: We see God as the type of God who promises to protect us from worldwide flood. If there was no worldwide flood, then there must be no God or no truth in that experience at all!
This message has been edited by Specter, 05/19/2005 12:53 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 126 by jar, posted 05-19-2005 12:08 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 128 by Brian, posted 05-19-2005 12:57 PM Specter has replied
 Message 130 by jar, posted 05-19-2005 1:27 PM Specter has not replied

Brian
Member (Idle past 4959 days)
Posts: 4659
From: Scotland
Joined: 10-22-2002


Message 128 of 302 (209677)
05-19-2005 12:57 PM
Reply to: Message 127 by Specter
05-19-2005 12:50 PM


Re: The Whole World's On Fire
We see God as the type of God who promises to protect us from worldwide flood.
It is okay. God saw the error of his ways and repented, He said he won't do it again. Just hope He wasn't lying again.
Brian.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 127 by Specter, posted 05-19-2005 12:50 PM Specter has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 129 by Specter, posted 05-19-2005 1:12 PM Brian has replied

Specter
Inactive Member


Message 129 of 302 (209680)
05-19-2005 1:12 PM
Reply to: Message 128 by Brian
05-19-2005 12:57 PM


Re: The Whole World's On Fire
Lying again? Clarify...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 128 by Brian, posted 05-19-2005 12:57 PM Brian has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 132 by Brian, posted 05-19-2005 1:48 PM Specter has replied

jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 130 of 302 (209684)
05-19-2005 1:27 PM
Reply to: Message 127 by Specter
05-19-2005 12:50 PM


Meaning of the Flood myth.
Mike, the Secret Service Agent, said that he would lay down his life to save the President. Unfortunately, the opportunity never arose.
Was mike's commitment less real?

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

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Replies to this message:
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lfen
Member (Idle past 4677 days)
Posts: 2189
From: Oregon
Joined: 06-24-2004


Message 131 of 302 (209685)
05-19-2005 1:39 PM
Reply to: Message 130 by jar
05-19-2005 1:27 PM


Re: Meaning of the Flood myth.
Jar,
This seems the equivalent of asking if Schroedinger's cat is dead or alive.
lfen

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Brian
Member (Idle past 4959 days)
Posts: 4659
From: Scotland
Joined: 10-22-2002


Message 132 of 302 (209691)
05-19-2005 1:48 PM
Reply to: Message 129 by Specter
05-19-2005 1:12 PM


Re: The Whole World's On Fire
but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 129 by Specter, posted 05-19-2005 1:12 PM Specter has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 133 by Specter, posted 05-23-2005 9:57 AM Brian has not replied

Specter
Inactive Member


Message 133 of 302 (210536)
05-23-2005 9:57 AM
Reply to: Message 132 by Brian
05-19-2005 1:48 PM


Re: The Whole World's On Fire
Now, was that really a lie? The day they ate of it they did die.
"For a day to the Lord is as a thousand years." -Ezekiel. GOd finds this very important so he repeats it in Numbers, Revelation, and one other book...
Adam and Eve did not live as long as Methuselah, who lived 969 years.
1 Day:------------------------Noon--------------------------End of Day
0----100----200----300----400----500----600----700----800----900----*
*******************************************************************
* = Methuselah's Lifespan
NOTE:No man has ever lived up to the end of their day. If 969 < 1000, then God wasnt kidding when he said that we'd die the same day. After all, a day to our Lord is a thousand years.
"God is not a man, that he should lie, nore the son of a man, that he should repent." God knew what he was doing in the Flood, and I don;t see how he has ever lied. If you find a better example, tell me.
EDIT: What new edition of the Bible are you reading? The bible actually says, "...for in the day that you eat of it, thou shalt surely die." Why? Because it's true that it happened just as he predicted. Not "when" you eat of it, but "in the day" you eat of it. SO there.
This message has been edited by Specter, 05/23/2005 10:07 AM

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Replies to this message:
 Message 134 by ringo, posted 05-23-2005 11:11 AM Specter has not replied
 Message 135 by cmanteuf, posted 05-23-2005 1:27 PM Specter has not replied
 Message 136 by arachnophilia, posted 05-23-2005 1:30 PM Specter has not replied

ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 134 of 302 (210555)
05-23-2005 11:11 AM
Reply to: Message 133 by Specter
05-23-2005 9:57 AM


a day is AS a thousand years
The word "as" indicates a simile - i.e. a figure of speech. It is not meant to be taken as literally "a day = a thousand years". If the Bible translators had agreed with your interpretation, they would not have rendered it as a simile.
(Aside: I find it amusing that Bible "literalists" will claim that "a day = a thousand years" and also claim that a "day" of creation must be 24 hours.)
Specter writes:
"God is not a man, that he should lie, nore the son of a man, that he should repent."
But God does repent:
Genesis 6:6-7 writes:
And it repented the LORD that He had made man on the earth, and it grieved Him at His heart.
And the LORD said: 'I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and creeping thing, and fowl of the air; for it repenteth Me that I have made them.'
This message has been edited by Ringo316, 05-23-2005 09:11 AM

People who think they have all the answers usually don't understand the questions.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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cmanteuf
Member (Idle past 6766 days)
Posts: 92
From: Virginia, USA
Joined: 11-08-2004


Message 135 of 302 (210588)
05-23-2005 1:27 PM
Reply to: Message 133 by Specter
05-23-2005 9:57 AM


Re: The Whole World's On Fire
Specter writes:
EDIT: What new edition of the Bible are you reading? The bible actually says, "...for in the day that you eat of it, thou shalt surely die." Why? Because it's true that it happened just as he predicted. Not "when" you eat of it, but "in the day" you eat of it. SO there.
I'm not sure if you're being facetious or not, which is a reflection of my poor skills at this sort of thing. Nonetheless, to play the straight man, NIV uses that translation.
Genesis 2:17; NIV - but you must not eat from the tree of - Bible Gateway;
So one would expect that Zondervan's army of NIVlets would use the same translation.
Chris

This message is a reply to:
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