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Author Topic:   All Evolutionary scientists have been Evolutionary Indoctrinated
CK
Member (Idle past 2237 days)
Posts: 3221
Joined: 07-04-2004


Message 301 of 312 (229581)
08-04-2005 6:11 AM
Reply to: Message 300 by Wounded King
08-04-2005 5:42 AM


Re: Breathtaking assertions is all you offer
Very true...slightly more problematic when the quote....does not seem to exist

This message has been edited by Charles Knight, 04-Aug-2005 06:15 AM


This message is a reply to:
 Message 300 by Wounded King, posted 08-04-2005 5:42 AM Wounded King has not yet responded

crashfrog
Inactive Member


Message 302 of 312 (229595)
08-04-2005 7:37 AM
Reply to: Message 297 by Omnivorous
08-03-2005 9:33 PM


Re: Breathtaking assertions is all you offer
Great post. I'd nominate it for POTM, and will, but there's no August POTM thread yet.

Ahem.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 297 by Omnivorous, posted 08-03-2005 9:33 PM Omnivorous has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 309 by AdminAsgara, posted 08-04-2005 10:04 AM crashfrog has not yet responded

iano
Member (Idle past 50 days)
Posts: 6165
From: Co. Wicklow, Ireland.
Joined: 07-27-2005


Message 303 of 312 (229620)
08-04-2005 9:16 AM
Reply to: Message 295 by AdminNosy
08-03-2005 7:19 PM


Re: Quotes
adminnosy writes:

It is a form of dishonesty to deliberately make up quotes. Since you don't want to leave the impression that this is the case I suggest that you clear up the confusion regarding this.

A quick Google indicates that there is no acceptable accredition for this quote so I hereby retract it. My apologies for that and any other challenged quote which I haven't defended. I would make the point that in all cases the quotes were presented in good faith and as asides and were obviously not inteneded to form part of the body of an argument. No dishonesty intended (cos that'd be a sin!)

To offset the mild discomfort many may feel having to write the above, I'll finish off this post (which I was led to understand couldn't happen due supposed 300-post limit on threads - hence my delay in responding) by displaying my new-found understanding of the art of quote-mining. The following, rather humerous quote from Sir Arthur comes from the forward to his paper "Evolution and Ethics" (G. P. Putnam's Sons, New York Copyright, 1946, 1947, by Sir Arthur Keith)

"Evolution is a donkey that nearly everybody drives to market now-a days. No beast in recent years has been so over driven, so overridden, and so over burdened as this poor moke; none has become a more fit subject for the Society for Prevention of Cruelty; never was a beast in such demand."

He, like me, was a young man at the time. He, like me, later retracted this claim. Though I'll warrant he had to swallow somewhat harder :)


This message is a reply to:
 Message 295 by AdminNosy, posted 08-03-2005 7:19 PM AdminNosy has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 304 by CK, posted 08-04-2005 9:27 AM iano has not yet responded
 Message 305 by Wounded King, posted 08-04-2005 9:34 AM iano has not yet responded
 Message 306 by Modulous, posted 08-04-2005 9:35 AM iano has not yet responded

CK
Member (Idle past 2237 days)
Posts: 3221
Joined: 07-04-2004


Message 304 of 312 (229626)
08-04-2005 9:27 AM
Reply to: Message 303 by iano
08-04-2005 9:16 AM


Re: Quotes
em..even that is presented slightly out of context... as the way you present it, he is offering for the first time in 1947 and then later retracted it - what you quote is the actual retraction...

quote:
The following, rather humerous quote from Sir Arthur comes from the forward to his paper "Evolution and Ethics" (G. P. Putnam's Sons, New York Copyright, 1946, 1947, by Sir Arthur Keith)He, like me, was a young man at the time. He, like me, later retracted this claim

in it's full context.....

quote:
In the year 1896 there appeared a book with the title Pioneers of Evolution, by Mr. Edward Clodd (1840 1930). Mr. Clodd was a successful banker, a thinker, a man of letters, with a gift of happy expression, and was an authority on the myths which man has brought with him from prehistoric times. Early in January 1897, Pioneers of Evolution was reviewed in the illustrated London News; the opening sentences of the review run as follows:

Evolution is a donkey that nearly everybody drives to market now-a days. No beast in recent years has been so over driven, so overridden, and so over burdened as this poor moke; none has become a more fit subject for the Society for Prevention of Cruelty; never was a beast in such demand.

I blush when I read the words in which this barbarous attack on a worthy book was couched, for I was the writer of the review. A just retribution has overtaken me, for here am I leading the same old donkey to market, and showing off his paces, in the year 1944. By way of extenuation I would plead that the beast I am now exhibiting is sounder, more warrantworthy, than the one I belabored in 1897.


This message has been edited by Charles Knight, 04-Aug-2005 09:28 AM

This message has been edited by Charles Knight, 04-Aug-2005 09:29 AM


This message is a reply to:
 Message 303 by iano, posted 08-04-2005 9:16 AM iano has not yet responded

Wounded King
Member (Idle past 2204 days)
Posts: 4149
From: Edinburgh, Scotland
Joined: 04-09-2003


Message 305 of 312 (229627)
08-04-2005 9:34 AM
Reply to: Message 303 by iano
08-04-2005 9:16 AM


Limits to thread length
There is not an actual hard limit to the number of posts in a thread, but somewhere in the 300s the thread may become unstable and posts may be lost. That is what happened previously anyway, I don't know if subsequent changes to the site have altered this, the admins are still closing down threads after the 300 mark in any case. If you feel there is still something productive to be discussed we can always just open an extension of this thread.

TTFN,

WK


This message is a reply to:
 Message 303 by iano, posted 08-04-2005 9:16 AM iano has not yet responded

  
Modulous
Member (Idle past 214 days)
Posts: 7789
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 306 of 312 (229628)
08-04-2005 9:35 AM
Reply to: Message 303 by iano
08-04-2005 9:16 AM


Re: Quotes
The post is about to end, when a mod scans his beady eyes on it.

Thus: let me applause this intellectual honesty whilst I have the opportunity. It is a rare sight for someone to admit they were mistaken and retract a claim around here. I hope you stick around on the boards.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 303 by iano, posted 08-04-2005 9:16 AM iano has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 307 by CK, posted 08-04-2005 9:39 AM Modulous has not yet responded

CK
Member (Idle past 2237 days)
Posts: 3221
Joined: 07-04-2004


Message 307 of 312 (229632)
08-04-2005 9:39 AM
Reply to: Message 306 by Modulous
08-04-2005 9:35 AM


Re: Quotes
oh yeah - I'd say the same. Iano seems to at least trying to present something we haven't see before...just needs to be a bit more careful with sources.... :)
This message is a reply to:
 Message 306 by Modulous, posted 08-04-2005 9:35 AM Modulous has not yet responded

iano
Member (Idle past 50 days)
Posts: 6165
From: Co. Wicklow, Ireland.
Joined: 07-27-2005


Message 308 of 312 (229634)
08-04-2005 9:41 AM
Reply to: Message 297 by Omnivorous
08-03-2005 9:33 PM


Re: Breathtaking assertions is all you offer
omnivorus writes:

Just don't challenge me--I'm a newbie, too, not yet ready for prime time.

Best way to get into the water is to hop right in I find. Sure, your likely to get the skin flailed from your body but there's nothing like a war to result in rapid development of technology (if you'll forgive the methaphor mixing).

Thanks for the kind comments (which aren't all that accurate). Thanks for the less kind comments too(which aren't that accurate either). I see genuine difficulty with separating science from indoctrination by the mechanisms posed by folk here. The sheer unwillingness of many (but by no means all) folk here to accept(irrespective of the fact it wasn't 'proven') that it could be a factor be conciously reckoned with has only reinforced that view


This message is a reply to:
 Message 297 by Omnivorous, posted 08-03-2005 9:33 PM Omnivorous has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 311 by Omnivorous, posted 08-04-2005 10:34 AM iano has not yet responded

AdminAsgara
Administrator (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 2073
From: The Universe
Joined: 10-11-2003


Message 309 of 312 (229650)
08-04-2005 10:04 AM
Reply to: Message 302 by crashfrog
08-04-2005 7:37 AM


Re: Breathtaking assertions is all you offer
ahem...

Issue fixed hun, sorry 'bout that


This message is a reply to:
 Message 302 by crashfrog, posted 08-04-2005 7:37 AM crashfrog has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 310 by iano, posted 08-04-2005 10:11 AM AdminAsgara has not yet responded

  
iano
Member (Idle past 50 days)
Posts: 6165
From: Co. Wicklow, Ireland.
Joined: 07-27-2005


Message 310 of 312 (229654)
08-04-2005 10:11 AM
Reply to: Message 309 by AdminAsgara
08-04-2005 10:04 AM


Re: Breathtaking assertions is all you offer
Hey AA, You warned me at the outset that this place was Intellectual Cocaine. You might have mentioned that it was the cracked version that was being pushed - as opposed to the milder, powdery stuff..
This message is a reply to:
 Message 309 by AdminAsgara, posted 08-04-2005 10:04 AM AdminAsgara has not yet responded

Omnivorous
Member (Idle past 1077 days)
Posts: 3808
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005


Message 311 of 312 (229663)
08-04-2005 10:34 AM
Reply to: Message 308 by iano
08-04-2005 9:41 AM


Re: Breathtaking assertions is all you offer
Iano writes:

quote:
Thanks for the kind comments (which aren't all that accurate). Thanks for the less kind comments too(which aren't that accurate either). I see genuine difficulty with separating science from indoctrination by the mechanisms posed by folk here. The sheer unwillingness of many (but by no means all) folk here to accept(irrespective of the fact it wasn't 'proven') that it could be a factor be conciously reckoned with has only reinforced that view

You're welcome to the comments, none of which I thought of as kind or unkind, merely my read based on the data in hand and addressed to your utility: provocative, boundary-pushing folks are useful to a thoughtful community.

As to their accuracy: you might consider (as you wished others to consider your comments, without proof) that the true applicability of those comments lies somewhere between my take and yours.

At any rate, I wish you well, and hope you continue to participate.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 308 by iano, posted 08-04-2005 9:41 AM iano has not yet responded

  
AdminJar
Inactive Member


Message 312 of 312 (229703)
08-04-2005 11:14 AM


Witching hour folk.
If anyone believes there is yet more to be said, please propose a PNT. Thanks to all who participated.


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