War in Iraq, is there a point?

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...copious coastlines, and abundant natural resources and farmland.

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And don't forget, those copious coastlines, abundant natural resources and farmland used to belong to someone else.

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There is evidence that funding & training for the 9/11 hijackers was provided by Iraq. Meetings took place between Iraqi intelligence officials & Mohammed Atta, the training camp known as Salman Pak, southwest of Baghdad trained hijackers in the EXACT METHODS used on 9/11, & at least 5 of the hijackers trained in that camp. That is not a coincidence, that is a direct link to 9/11.

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I did a bit of research into Salman Pak. This is what I found. FrontlineWe know that Chalabi and the INC duped us with bogus information on several other matters, so why should I believe the INC about this, especially when we have not been able to verify anything he claimed?Do you have any verification of Khodada's story?Also, what is the source of your claim above?This message has been edited by schrafinator, 08-23-2005 10:13 AM

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The heart of the Islamist movement, its ideology, and the source of its funds and major training centres, was Afghanistan - bin laden's base - and is still other points in the islamic world.

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While I could agree that a lot of terroist training went on in Afghanistan, the heart of radical Islam is Saudi Arabia.That is where the mullahs are who call for young Islamic men to die resisting the West.

Islamic terrorists are not going to stop killing until we stop them folks, that's the bottom line. And Saddam Hussein was helping them & was going to continue helping them. He may have eventually given them WMD's, if he hadn't already done so. There are some fairly credible reports that al Qaeda may have already smuggled suitcase nukes into this country & it could be only a matter of time before they set the things off.Liberals want to argue about whether we should be in Iraq or not, it's a bogus argument. They're being disingenuous because their aim is not about justice or righteousness, it's about hatred of President George W. Bush & all of us who support & believe in him & the conservative point of view. They raise point after idiotic point which doesn't amount to a hill of beans. Meanwhile we are in serious danger at the hands of Islamic terrorists who have no compunction at killing innocent civilians.When will liberals stop being liberals & start being just plain Americans again? When al Qaeda sets off a nuke in Times Square? Will that wake them up? When they unleash biological toxin into the water supply of Los Angeles killing millions? These horrible scenarios are not that far-fetched. These are the goals of these animals, the genocide of Americans. This is what we're up against. It's time liberals recognized that.

Yes, please go to Iraq and point a weapon at a US soldier.Or are you all talk?

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Did I not answer your questions?

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Wrong. I was there. I've seen the reports.But I know you won't believe me. Washington PostDo you know what this means? It means that because of our action, insurgents are now killing Iraqis. Learn frickin english. It doesn't mean coalition (sorry for speling) forces sit there and kill all these civillians. We don't. Yes, we watched that film in Saddam's Palace in Baghdad. Won't get an apology from me, and by the way, they aren't POWs. Any evidence of this? And please, no Koran flushing stories. Don't forget I work with MPs that have worked down there. Read up on your theology.

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Senator Robert Byrd!

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I give up!!! I've given articulate, detailed explanations in response to your query. You seem to be obtuse or incapable of comprehending the circumstances we have been forced into dealing with. Thank God we have a decisive, courageous man in the White House who is calling the shots for us. Thank God for President George W. Bush.

You're quite right that the wahabbi Islamist movement is based in saudi Arabia, which has funded the movement worldwide. But it has spread, at this point, to many other Isklamic countries, where it is a powerful 5th column. Khan, Pakistan's former chief nuclear scientist, was one, and it was he who headed up a team sending nuclear technology to enemies of democracy. Pakistan had thousands of madrassahs teaching Islamism, as did and do other Islamic countries. Algeria's Islamists were about to win an election about 10 years back, until the military government cancelled it (which was probably fair, since the Islamists said: One leection, one time only).Then trhere's the Shia Islamists of iran, who not only rule that country, but fund Islamist terrorist organizations, like Hezbullah.My point is that Islamism is deeply rooted in Islamic history and throughout all the Islamic world. It has existed in past and exists now in many guises and itinerations. So, yes, Wahabbism began in Saudi Arabia and is based there. Yes, with oil money the saudi wahabbis have funded terrorists, Islamic organizations worldwide and mosques and congregations. And, yes, Wahabbism is the most prominent Islamist movement of our age. And yet, being only one of several Islamist organizations and movements through the centuries, the problem is much, much bigger than it alone.

You're right that the US has not always been moral, nor is now. As a Canadian, i can speak about despicable trade bullying we're subjected to by our largest trade partner, abusing its size and power.But this much is also true: The US, above all else, stands for freedom and democracy, a revolution for which was central to its birth. The principle foreign policy of the US has been the dissemination of freedom and democracy - despite the necessity of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" realpolitik through the cold war.I don't believe there has even before in history been a nation with the power tot ake over others at will, yet declines to do so. My Canda is extravagantly resource rich, with as much oil as saudi Arabia. Yet, it wouldn't cross my mind that the US will invade us. But had we been any other such powerful nation's neighbour through history, we would have been taken over long ago.The right sees the US as a noble nation, despite its flaws. The left, these days (JFK would be on the right by today's standards), sees the US as a flawed nation, even imperialistic, despite its good qualities. And thus the divide.

???What the hell is your problem?I haven't said anything to you, or about your posts. You came on here acting like your balls were too big for the room. You and Evopeach should go hang out.This message has been edited by Yaro, 08-23-2005 11:00 AM

There is also the inescapable, indisputable fact that the United States of America is the ultimate defender of democracies the world over. We don't just protect our own freedom, we protect everyone else's, too. And the world's democracies whose countries maintain little or no military are beholden to the American taxpayers for the blanket of freedom we provide them through the tax dollars we pay for the military we support with those dollars. And America is generous not only with its tax dollars, but our military men & women will come fight & die for you when you're in trouble. We are a noble people, indeed, not unlike our friends to the north, Canadian Steve, whose people have done much the same in many a conflict over the course of history.

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There is also the inescapable, indisputable fact that the United States of America is the ultimate defender of democracies the world over.

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Actually, it is neither inescapable nor indisputable. The US has been involved in the overthrow of several democratically elected regimes (Arbenz, Allende, the Sandanistas, probably Chavez), while supporting some of the worst dictatorships (Guatamala, Chile, El Salvador). I'm not sure where you get the idea that the US is the ultimate defender of democracy.

I beg your pardon? Sir, please be informed that I am not a gentleman, rather I am a lady, therefore I do not possess the anatomical characteristic to which you so vulgarly referred.I merely pointed out that you are complaining about how this thread has deteriorated into a Left vs Right tit-for-tat slugfest, while I earnestly did attempt to answer your query. I posted some articles, which were slammed by other posters & I did find myself getting rather frustrated as time wore on.I apologize for my intemperance of yesterday & didn't wish to offend you or anyone else for that matter. However, I feel this war is of vital importance to the future safety & security of this nation. I get a little passionate when I get going. I am sorry for my outburst if you found them to be off-putting.