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War in Iraq, is there a point?

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Author Topic:   War in Iraq, is there a point?
Tal
Member (Idle past 5697 days)
Posts: 1140
From: Fort Bragg, NC
Joined: 12-29-2004

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Message 209 of 308 (236129)
08-23-2005 3:03 PM 		Reply to: Message 207 by Yaro
08-23-2005 3:01 PM

Re: Popular Support
According to the Boston Globe (10 June 2005): "a recent internal poll conducted for the US-led coalition found that nearly 45 percent of the population supported the insurgent attacks, making accurate intelligence difficult to obtain.
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Whao, give me a link to that poll. I call BS on that.
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NM..I found it...lemme investigate.
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*EDIT*
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Ok, after a little investigation I couldn't find that poll from the Boston Globe, which leads me to believe it was either bogus, or a misquote. Can you find another poll that states the % of Iraqis that support the insurgency? It should be more like 2%.
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We know there are 20,000 fighters and (huge overestimate) 400,000 supporting them.
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420,000 of 25 million is 1.68%.
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I know 400,000 people don't support the insurgency. Remember alot (I think most) are not Iraqis and are killing Iraqis.
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If the boston globe poll is correct, 12 Million Iraqis support the insurgency.
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That simply isn't true.
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This message has been edited by Tal, 08-23-2005 03:15 PM
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This message is a reply to:
 Message 207 by Yaro, posted 08-23-2005 3:01 PM Yaro has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 210 by Yaro, posted 08-23-2005 3:06 PM Tal has replied
Tal
Member (Idle past 5697 days)
Posts: 1140
From: Fort Bragg, NC
Joined: 12-29-2004

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Message 213 of 308 (236136)
08-23-2005 3:21 PM 		Reply to: Message 210 by Yaro
08-23-2005 3:06 PM

Re: Popular Support
Ok, after a little investigation I couldn't find that poll from the Boston Globe, which leads me to believe it was either bogus, or a misquote. Can you find another poll that states the % of Iraqis that support the insurgency? It should be more like 2%.
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We know there are 20,000 fighters and (huge overestimate) 400,000 supporting them.
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420,000 of 25 million is 1.68%.
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I know 400,000 people don't support the insurgency. Remember alot (I think most) are not Iraqis and are killing Iraqis.
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If the boston globe poll is correct, 12 Million Iraqis support the insurgency.
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That simply isn't true.
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Specialists say they believe Iraq's estimated 5 million Sunnis fear that the country's government, dominated by Shi'ites and Kurds, will exact revenge on them for decades of Hussein's brutal rein. There are only 17 Sunni members in the 275-person Iraqi National Assembly.
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Meanwhile, a recent internal poll conducted for the US-led coalition found that nearly 45 percent of the population supported the insurgent attacks, making accurate intelligence difficult to obtain. Only 15 percent of those polled said they strongly supported the US-led coalition.
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Difficult to tell if they were talking about a poll on Sunnis, or who did the poll, or even showed any evidence of the poll.
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All I can say is this is not consistant from what I have seen, and I was there to read the polls.
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I can't find any other polls that verify this number, but I do find polls that contradict it.
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Bloomberg
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The poll suggests the insurgency is unpopular, despite pockets of support in places such as Saddam Hussein's hometown of Tikrit.
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The survey, conducted March 15-22 in 15 cities across all regions of Iraq, has been distributed to top officials at the Pentagon, the Central Intelligence Agency and State Department.
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This message has been edited by Tal, 08-23-2005 03:25 PM
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Tired of the opposite sex? Want to turn your favorite football player into a raging homsexual? Then purchase your Gay-Gene Cattle Prod! One Zap from the GGCP will turn the Gay Gene off or on at your whim. So if you want your wife to get some hot girl on girl action, the Gay-Gene Cattle Prod is for you! *not intended for use on children*
This message is a reply to:
 Message 210 by Yaro, posted 08-23-2005 3:06 PM Yaro has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 217 by Yaro, posted 08-23-2005 3:37 PM Tal has replied
Tal
Member (Idle past 5697 days)
Posts: 1140
From: Fort Bragg, NC
Joined: 12-29-2004

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Message 218 of 308 (236145)
08-23-2005 3:38 PM 		Reply to: Message 216 by jar
08-23-2005 3:35 PM

Re: Opposing Terrorism
Disagree.
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It is about many countries against Islamic extremists. The tactics cannot be applied to any situation between Nation States and non-Nation State groups. The parameters are very specific.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 216 by jar, posted 08-23-2005 3:35 PM jar has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 220 by jar, posted 08-23-2005 3:42 PM Tal has replied
Tal
Member (Idle past 5697 days)
Posts: 1140
From: Fort Bragg, NC
Joined: 12-29-2004

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Message 219 of 308 (236147)
08-23-2005 3:39 PM 		Reply to: Message 217 by Yaro
08-23-2005 3:37 PM

Re: Popular Support
Right. Now go to those links.
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Tired of the opposite sex? Want to turn your favorite football player into a raging homsexual? Then purchase your Gay-Gene Cattle Prod! One Zap from the GGCP will turn the Gay Gene off or on at your whim. So if you want your wife to get some hot girl on girl action, the Gay-Gene Cattle Prod is for you! *not intended for use on children*
This message is a reply to:
 Message 217 by Yaro, posted 08-23-2005 3:37 PM Yaro has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 224 by Yaro, posted 08-23-2005 3:53 PM Tal has replied
Tal
Member (Idle past 5697 days)
Posts: 1140
From: Fort Bragg, NC
Joined: 12-29-2004

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Message 226 of 308 (236158)
08-23-2005 3:58 PM 		Reply to: Message 224 by Yaro
08-23-2005 3:53 PM

Re: Popular Support
Ahhh..that's better.
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Note there is no poll in the Boston Globe. It just says there was a poll conducted by the military.
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The Zogby poll doesn't squat about Iraqis supporting the insurgency.
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Your Arab publication doesn't list any poll that I can see.
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We are talking about the number of Iraqis supporting the insurgency right? Not just the number that want us out?
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Tired of the opposite sex? Want to turn your favorite football player into a raging homsexual? Then purchase your Gay-Gene Cattle Prod! One Zap from the GGCP will turn the Gay Gene off or on at your whim. So if you want your wife to get some hot girl on girl action, the Gay-Gene Cattle Prod is for you! *not intended for use on children*
This message is a reply to:
 Message 224 by Yaro, posted 08-23-2005 3:53 PM Yaro has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 244 by Yaro, posted 08-23-2005 4:25 PM Tal has not replied
Tal
Member (Idle past 5697 days)
Posts: 1140
From: Fort Bragg, NC
Joined: 12-29-2004

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Message 227 of 308 (236159)
08-23-2005 4:00 PM 		Reply to: Message 220 by jar
08-23-2005 3:42 PM

Re: Opposing Terrorism
You are the one making the claim. You tell me and use supporting links.
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I'm not doing your homework for you.
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Tired of the opposite sex? Want to turn your favorite football player into a raging homsexual? Then purchase your Gay-Gene Cattle Prod! One Zap from the GGCP will turn the Gay Gene off or on at your whim. So if you want your wife to get some hot girl on girl action, the Gay-Gene Cattle Prod is for you! *not intended for use on children*
This message is a reply to:
 Message 220 by jar, posted 08-23-2005 3:42 PM jar has not replied
Tal
Member (Idle past 5697 days)
Posts: 1140
From: Fort Bragg, NC
Joined: 12-29-2004

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Message 232 of 308 (236165)
08-23-2005 4:05 PM 		Reply to: Message 228 by nator
08-23-2005 4:02 PM

Re: dangers of wmd (a,k.a americans living in a dream world)
Funny, I would think that if you think it is so evil, you would call for Senator Byrd's resignation immediately!
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I mean, that's what the left did to Trent Lott, and he just said a couple of nice things about Strom Thurmon.
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What media bias?
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Tired of the opposite sex? Want to turn your favorite football player into a raging homsexual? Then purchase your Gay-Gene Cattle Prod! One Zap from the GGCP will turn the Gay Gene off or on at your whim. So if you want your wife to get some hot girl on girl action, the Gay-Gene Cattle Prod is for you! *not intended for use on children*
This message is a reply to:
 Message 228 by nator, posted 08-23-2005 4:02 PM nator has not replied
Tal
Member (Idle past 5697 days)
Posts: 1140
From: Fort Bragg, NC
Joined: 12-29-2004

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Message 277 of 308 (236231)
08-23-2005 5:55 PM 		Reply to: Message 264 by CK
08-23-2005 5:33 PM

Re: Opposing Terrorism
Just the opposite from what I've seen, including British soldiers I worked with. Many volunteered.
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Tired of the opposite sex? Want to turn your favorite football player into a raging homsexual? Then purchase your Gay-Gene Cattle Prod! One Zap from the GGCP will turn the Gay Gene off or on at your whim. So if you want your wife to get some hot girl on girl action, the Gay-Gene Cattle Prod is for you! *not intended for use on children*
This message is a reply to:
 Message 264 by CK, posted 08-23-2005 5:33 PM CK has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 283 by CK, posted 08-23-2005 6:04 PM Tal has replied
Tal
Member (Idle past 5697 days)
Posts: 1140
From: Fort Bragg, NC
Joined: 12-29-2004

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Message 280 of 308 (236234)
08-23-2005 6:03 PM 		Reply to: Message 231 by deerbreh
08-23-2005 4:05 PM

Re: Left v. Right B*ll Sh*t
What part of "target" don't you understand? Some are getting killed but many more are coming home as amputees or maimed in some other way. Either way, they are no longer available for duty.
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And? What point are you trying to articulate?
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As to your analysis - excuse me but I have heard it all before - during Vietnam. I have no more confidence in the U.S. military's or the civilian leadership's analysis of what is really going on in Iraq than I did in Vietnam.
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Then you argue in ignorance. Good luck.
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Tired of the opposite sex? Want to turn your favorite football player into a raging homsexual? Then purchase your Gay-Gene Cattle Prod! One Zap from the GGCP will turn the Gay Gene off or on at your whim. So if you want your wife to get some hot girl on girl action, the Gay-Gene Cattle Prod is for you! *not intended for use on children*
This message is a reply to:
 Message 231 by deerbreh, posted 08-23-2005 4:05 PM deerbreh has not replied
Tal
Member (Idle past 5697 days)
Posts: 1140
From: Fort Bragg, NC
Joined: 12-29-2004

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Message 290 of 308 (236246)
08-23-2005 6:12 PM 		Reply to: Message 235 by Trump won
08-23-2005 4:13 PM

I'm growing weary of your ignorant posting, but I'll patiently correct you again.
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Why aren't they POW's?
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Because they don't wear a uniform, or a "distinguishable sign"?
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That's dishonest and immoral to believe that.
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Allow me to educate you.
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Geneva Convention relative to the Treatment of Prisoners of War:
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Article 4 A 2
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2. Members of other militias and members of other volunteer corps, including those of organized resistance movements, belonging to a Party to the conflict and operating in or outside their own territory, even if this territory is occupied, provided that such militias or volunteer corps, including such organized resistance movements, fulfil the following conditions:
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(a) That of being commanded by a person responsible for his subordinates;
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(b) That of having a fixed distinctive sign recognizable at a distance;
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(c) That of carrying arms openly;
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(d) That of conducting their operations in accordance with the laws and customs of war.
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Now, to be classified as POW you MUST meet all 4 conditions.
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Let's see if the typical insurgent meets any of the criteria.
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being commanded by a person responsible for his subordinates
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Yes, the arguement can be made that they take orders for higher ups.
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That of having a fixed distinctive sign recognizable at a distance
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Ooo sorry (jeapordy incorrect beep) they don't fit this category.
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That of carrying arms openly
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Ooo sorry again, they don't fit this criteria either.
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That of conducting their operations in accordance with the laws and customs of war
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And since they target civilians (among many other TRUE atrocities) they don't quite make the cut here either.
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So they fail 3 out of 4 critereon that would make the elligible for POW status.
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You shoot an enemy, you disobey God.
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Where is that?
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I'll post a few stories tonight about a taxi driver named Dilawar that was tortured and murdered at Guantanamo bay and a few others.
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Remember, it doesn't count if it has the Koran flushing story next to it!
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Tired of the opposite sex? Want to turn your favorite football player into a raging homsexual? Then purchase your Gay-Gene Cattle Prod! One Zap from the GGCP will turn the Gay Gene off or on at your whim. So if you want your wife to get some hot girl on girl action, the Gay-Gene Cattle Prod is for you! *not intended for use on children*
This message is a reply to:
 Message 235 by Trump won, posted 08-23-2005 4:13 PM Trump won has not replied
Tal
Member (Idle past 5697 days)
Posts: 1140
From: Fort Bragg, NC
Joined: 12-29-2004

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Message 292 of 308 (236248)
08-23-2005 6:13 PM 		Reply to: Message 283 by CK
08-23-2005 6:04 PM

Re: Opposing Terrorism
Hey, can I go to Iraq?
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That sense.
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Tired of the opposite sex? Want to turn your favorite football player into a raging homsexual? Then purchase your Gay-Gene Cattle Prod! One Zap from the GGCP will turn the Gay Gene off or on at your whim. So if you want your wife to get some hot girl on girl action, the Gay-Gene Cattle Prod is for you! *not intended for use on children*
This message is a reply to:
 Message 283 by CK, posted 08-23-2005 6:04 PM CK has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 295 by CK, posted 08-23-2005 6:18 PM Tal has not replied
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