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Author | Topic: SIMPLE common anscestors had fewer but MORE COMPLEX systems: genomics | |||||||||||||||||||||||
Randy Member (Idle past 6273 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote: The paper continues:
quote: PNAS is available online for free I think. I assume that is how I got it but I don't have time to find it right now. I just thought others would like to see what Ohno's interpretation of the Cambrian explosion is. I think there may be other explanations of the Cambrian "explosion" as well. Randy
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Randy Member (Idle past 6273 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
Fred,
Do you accept Ohno's claim that it takes about 10,000 million years to get a 1% change in a genome? If so how much change can one expect in 5,000 Years? Randy
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Randy Member (Idle past 6273 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote: Bottlenecks, now there’s an interesting point. Don’t bottlenecks show up in the genome of species that went through a bottleneck? Why don’t all species show evidence of a bottleneck about 5,000 years ago? You are claiming that the bottleneck was down to 2 of each kind (whatever that is). Why is there no genetic evidence of all these bottlenecks? Why don’t humans have more genetic diversity than most animals? Weren’t there supposed to be 8 humans and only two of each unclean kind on the ark? Humans should have more diversity in our species than the entire genus (or maybe family or at least Kind) of unclean Kinds. Does genetic analysis show this? I don’t think so. Why not?Randy
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Randy Member (Idle past 6273 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote: Actually there are far more than 32 bat species. There are 18 families of bats and I think around 900 known species. There are 355 known species in the 42 genera of Vespertilionid Bats which represent just one family. Page not found | Hopkins Press One problem with your numbers that you seem to be ignoring is that you need representatives of all the extinct "kinds" of land animals that ever lived on earth to be represented on the ark. I think this changes your numbers quite a bit and every time new extinct kinds are discovered it makes your problem worse. BTW those million or so species of insects/spiders are a falsification of the global flood as well.EvC Forum: Insect diversity falsifies the worldwide flood. Woodmorappe puts about 16,000 animals of 8,000 different kinds on the ark. Of course the idea that a 600 year old man and 7 family members cared for 16,000 of 8,000 different kinds of animals for a year on a big wooden boat during a global flood is totally absurd but that's another subject. Randy
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Randy Member (Idle past 6273 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote: I have the Woodmorappe book as well. It is a pretty remarkable collection of complete nonsense even for a YEC. The miracle is that anyone could take it seriously. I suspect that I have a lot more experience taking care of animals the he does since some of the things he says are real howlers and he makes some pretty elementary blunders. I hope to have time to write a post on it someday but there is so much wrong with it that it will take more time than I have right now. Maybe next year.Randy
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Randy Member (Idle past 6273 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote: So the Bible does not require insects on the ark? It doesn’t seem that way to me. Here are the verses in Genesis. 7:21 And all flesh died that moved upon the earth, both of fowl, and of cattle, and of beast, and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth, and every man: 7:22 All in whose nostrils was the breath of life, of all that was in the dry land, died. 7:23 And every living substance was destroyed which was upon the face of the ground, both man, and cattle, and the creeping things, and the fowl of the heaven; and they were destroyed from the earth: and Noah only remained alive, and they that were with him in the ark. 8:1 And God remembered Noah, and every living thing, and all the cattle that was with him in the ark: and God made a wind to pass over the earth, and the waters asswaged; 8:17 Bring forth with thee every living thing that is with thee, of all flesh, both of fowl, and of cattle, and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth; that they may breed abundantly in the earth, and be fruitful, and multiply upon the earth. Now it does say in 7:22 all in whose nostrils was the breath of life so the modern YEC apologists use this to claim that insects and other invertebrates that don’t breath through nostril did not have to be on the ark. However it does not say that ONLY those who breathe through nostril died and it more than once says every living thing and every creeping thing died . If insects were not thought to be living or need air this would seem a pretty big blunder in the supposedly inerrant Bible even if they don’t have nostrils. If insects are not among creeping things then why are grasshoppers identified in Leviticus as flying creeping things ye may eat? I suppose those questions belong on the Bible inerrancy page but I have made the point before that many families and even some whole orders of insects could not have survived on or off the ark and it has not been discussed much here. http://EvC Forum: Insect diversity falsifies the worldwide flood. -->EvC Forum: Insect diversity falsifies the worldwide flood. I do recall KC (on OCW) saying that the flood could have collected a forest along with its dirt to preserve ground dwelling insects. That was pretty far out even for KC. Many species of fresh water fish and many plants are also big problems as well. Why don’t YECs do the experiment of soaking a wide variety of plant seed in salty water for a year and then throwing them out on ground that had been under salt water to see if they grow? I think I know why. Do you? Randy
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Randy Member (Idle past 6273 days) Posts: 420 From: Cincinnati OH USA Joined: |
quote: Were there free flowing streams on the ark for the 1500 species of the order Ephemeroptera (Mayflies), which only live in fresh water? Were there living milkweed plants for Monarch butterflies to lay their eggs on? Were there living trees on board so that Cicada larva could live at their roots? Were there flowers for the bees and all the thousands upon thousands of insects that need nectar in their adult stages to feed on? Did the all insects come on two at a time or were colonies of social insects allowed to board? The problem is not the physical space but the requirements for housing and caring for so many organisms with such complex and varied life cycles. I also find it very amusing that you can claim that "most Biblical Scholars" don’t think the people who wrote the Bible thought insects were living things (since Genesis clearly says that all living things outside the ark died) and still claim that the Bible is inerrant. Randy
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