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Author Topic:   Eye of the needle
Karl
Inactive Member


Message 7 of 47 (24166)
11-25-2002 5:36 AM


Unfortunately, it is the religious equivalent of an urban myth. There was no such name for the gate in Jesus' day. Jesus' point was simple hyperbole.
81. Leaving All to Follow (Luke 18:24-34) mentions this myth with references.
I've heard the rope/camel point before - since the gospels were written in Greek, Greek is the relevant language. I have never heard that it was a pre-existing Greek saying - any support for this assertion, Metatron?

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 Message 13 by John, posted 11-25-2002 9:39 AM Karl has not replied

  
Karl
Inactive Member


Message 9 of 47 (24176)
11-25-2002 6:18 AM


Going to have to correct you again, Blitz (sorry!)
The Greek does say Kamelon (accusative of Kamelos) (look it up at Greek Bible). If there was a copying error, it was before the texts we now possess. The site you found is a bit kooky - rather obsessed with his false etymology of names for God and Jesus in English translations. He falsly claims that Jehovah = Iovis (genitive case of Iuppiter), Jesus = Ge-Zeus, Adonai = Adonis, and other such linguistic nonsense.
But I digress.
Be critical where you get info from. There is a lot of fruitcake on the web, and masses of religious fruitcake.

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 Message 10 by blitz77, posted 11-25-2002 6:32 AM Karl has not replied

  
Karl
Inactive Member


Message 27 of 47 (25681)
12-06-2002 3:29 AM


Not like me to agree with the FunkMaster, but I'm going to, in a qualified way.
I don't think the purpose of the "prophecies" is to enable Messiah identification. The OT Messianic tradition is an expression of the national religious and social aspirations and dreams of ancient Israel. Other traditions have similar lists of hopes and aspirations "when the gods return", or "on arrival at paradise". It is perfectly coherent to argue that Jesus will fulfil those aspirations when He brings in the "Kingdom of God", which He was quite clear is only currently present "within" His followers. He told Pilate that His kingdom was "not of this world". It is internally coherent, if you've already accepted a priori that Jesus is the Messiah.
But the "proof" of Jesus' Messiahship is not to be found here - it is to be found in the experience that He is alive today. His claims are vindicated by His resurrection. This, of course, moves the whole business onto the realms of faith, and John is quite correct that we can't "prove it".
Don't imagine the early church wasn't aware of this:
1 Corinthians
22Jews demand miraculous signs and Greeks look for wisdom, 23but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles,
I'll let this serve as my final post on the "Genealogies" thread as well. I know I've not convinced anyone, but that was not my intention. Merely to explain what I think is going on. I don't think I really have much more to say on the topic.

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 Message 29 by funkmasterfreaky, posted 12-06-2002 9:32 PM Karl has not replied

  
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