Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total)
5 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 915,815 Year: 3,072/9,624 Month: 917/1,588 Week: 100/223 Day: 11/17 Hour: 0/7


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Department Of Homeland Security Inaction At the Top
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 136 of 297 (241862)
09-09-2005 3:22 PM
Reply to: Message 135 by Trixie
09-09-2005 3:19 PM


Re: Brown recalled to Washington
He's only been removed from Hurricane Katrina effort oversight. Folk still have full confidence in Director Brown.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by Trixie, posted 09-09-2005 3:19 PM Trixie has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 137 by Trixie, posted 09-09-2005 3:43 PM jar has not replied

Trixie
Member (Idle past 3705 days)
Posts: 1011
From: Edinburgh
Joined: 01-03-2004


Message 137 of 297 (241875)
09-09-2005 3:43 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by jar
09-09-2005 3:22 PM


Re: Brown recalled to Washington
Stupid question, but I have to ask it. Why? Why do they still have confidence in him? Am I being exceptionally dense? Everything I've heard and seen so far crucifies him.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by jar, posted 09-09-2005 3:22 PM jar has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 138 by nator, posted 09-09-2005 4:18 PM Trixie has replied

nator
Member (Idle past 2169 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 138 of 297 (241893)
09-09-2005 4:18 PM
Reply to: Message 137 by Trixie
09-09-2005 3:43 PM


Re: Brown recalled to Washington
I think that by "folk", jar means "those unencumbered by living in the reality based community".
IOW, Bush and all Bushites.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 137 by Trixie, posted 09-09-2005 3:43 PM Trixie has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 139 by Trixie, posted 09-09-2005 4:26 PM nator has not replied

Trixie
Member (Idle past 3705 days)
Posts: 1011
From: Edinburgh
Joined: 01-03-2004


Message 139 of 297 (241901)
09-09-2005 4:26 PM
Reply to: Message 138 by nator
09-09-2005 4:18 PM


Re: Brown recalled to Washington
Yep, think you're right about those unencumbered by living in the reality-based community".
I wonder if those of you on the other side of the Atlantic are aware of how this is being seen in the UK? I haven't personally heard a single person, be it Joe Public or politician, defend the handling of the crisis. The media all see it the same way - total cock-up. Last night we were treated to footage of troops in non-flooded, affluent areas happily spending time posing for the cameras while the reporter tried to get his head round the fact that they claimed not to have time to retrieve bodies. He failed, by the way, you could hear the disbelief and frustration in his voice.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 138 by nator, posted 09-09-2005 4:18 PM nator has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 140 by jar, posted 09-09-2005 5:14 PM Trixie has not replied

jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 140 of 297 (241930)
09-09-2005 5:14 PM
Reply to: Message 139 by Trixie
09-09-2005 4:26 PM


Re: Brown recalled to Washington
I think the issue is a major one, and one that will haunt us in the future.
We still are saddled with a large body of decision makers at the local, state and federal level, the President and most of the Cabinet, much of the Legislature and the majority of the Supreme Court that are part of the belief based community.
I really wonder if the US will be able to survive.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 139 by Trixie, posted 09-09-2005 4:26 PM Trixie has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 141 by deerbreh, posted 09-12-2005 2:05 PM jar has not replied

deerbreh
Member (Idle past 2892 days)
Posts: 882
Joined: 06-22-2005


Message 141 of 297 (242599)
09-12-2005 2:05 PM
Reply to: Message 140 by jar
09-09-2005 5:14 PM


Re: Brown recalled to Washington
Well the U.S. will survive but we are headed into either a major recession or a major inflationary spiral or both, imo. I am struck with the similarities to the "guns and butter" approach of LBJ in the 60s that gave us stagflation by the end of the 70s. Unless Bush is willing to roll back the tax cuts and maybe actually raise them (a "windfall profits" tax on the oil companies, for example) I see no way of avoiding major economic pain about the time of the 08 presidential election or shortly thereafter.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by jar, posted 09-09-2005 5:14 PM jar has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 142 by Tal, posted 09-12-2005 3:09 PM deerbreh has replied

Tal
Member (Idle past 5677 days)
Posts: 1140
From: Fort Bragg, NC
Joined: 12-29-2004


Message 142 of 297 (242625)
09-12-2005 3:09 PM
Reply to: Message 141 by deerbreh
09-12-2005 2:05 PM


Re: Brown recalled to Washington
Based on what?

"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." - Albert Einstein

This message is a reply to:
 Message 141 by deerbreh, posted 09-12-2005 2:05 PM deerbreh has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 144 by deerbreh, posted 09-12-2005 9:07 PM Tal has not replied

Peal
Member (Idle past 4698 days)
Posts: 64
Joined: 03-11-2004


Message 143 of 297 (242626)
09-12-2005 3:10 PM


Brown is gone
Browm head of FEMA has just resigned.
http://news.yahoo.com/.../20050912/ap_on_go_ot/katrina_brown
This message has been edited by Peal, 09-12-2005 03:13 PMadded link
This message has been edited by Peal, 09-12-2005 03:13 PM

Replies to this message:
 Message 145 by RAZD, posted 09-13-2005 10:33 PM Peal has not replied

deerbreh
Member (Idle past 2892 days)
Posts: 882
Joined: 06-22-2005


Message 144 of 297 (242743)
09-12-2005 9:07 PM
Reply to: Message 142 by Tal
09-12-2005 3:09 PM


Re: Brown recalled to Washington
Based on what?
Based on what happened in the 70s (inflation followed by recession and stagflation) which economists agree was likely a direct result of the inability of LBJ and then Nixon to control deficit spending. Well they don't hold a candle to what Bush has done so far and shows every sign of continuing to do. And by the way, it was the oil shocks in 1973 aand again in 1979 that contributed to making the inflation and stagflation even worse.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 142 by Tal, posted 09-12-2005 3:09 PM Tal has not replied

RAZD
Member (Idle past 1404 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 145 of 297 (243158)
09-13-2005 10:33 PM
Reply to: Message 143 by Peal
09-12-2005 3:10 PM


Re: Brown is gone
yep.
and president botch is probably hoping that this will take the pressure off the rest of the misunderadministration

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 143 by Peal, posted 09-12-2005 3:10 PM Peal has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 147 by nator, posted 09-14-2005 12:23 AM RAZD has not replied

gene90
Member (Idle past 3822 days)
Posts: 1610
Joined: 12-25-2000


Message 146 of 297 (243189)
09-14-2005 12:23 AM


quote:
* Get a Kit - Get a kit of emergency supplies that will allow you and your family to survive for at least three days in the event an emergency happens. Go to Plan Ahead for Disasters | Ready.gov and http://www.redcross.org/Preparedness for a complete list of recommended supplies.
Wonder why it says "at least three days" if FEMA is supposed to show up right after the storm?
Now, how about some fun with remote sensing?

Replies to this message:
 Message 162 by arachnophilia, posted 09-14-2005 7:49 PM gene90 has replied

nator
Member (Idle past 2169 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 147 of 297 (243191)
09-14-2005 12:23 AM
Reply to: Message 145 by RAZD
09-13-2005 10:33 PM


Re: Brown is gone
You know that the only reason Bush said he is "taking responsibility" is because Rove told him to.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by RAZD, posted 09-13-2005 10:33 PM RAZD has not replied

gene90
Member (Idle past 3822 days)
Posts: 1610
Joined: 12-25-2000


Message 148 of 297 (243197)
09-14-2005 12:44 AM
Reply to: Message 131 by deerbreh
09-08-2005 10:51 PM


Re: Reality vs Belief based
quote:
There is a lot more that could have been done ahead of time. First of all, we could have had a viable evacuation plan that included getting out the people who can't drive out.
Right. So considering that authority to evacuate New Orleans rests exclusively with their city government:
quote:
Conduct of an actual evacuation will be the responsibility of the Mayor of New Orleans in coordination with the Director of the Office of Emergency Preparedness, and the OEP Shelter Coordinator.
The resource cannot be found.
Why didn't they?
quote:
China evacuated over 600,000 people a couple of weeks ago ahead of a typhoon.
A couple of weeks?
A "couple of weeks" before landfall Katrina did not exist. Unless you're going to put psychics in the Office of Emergency Management, ain't gonna happen.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 131 by deerbreh, posted 09-08-2005 10:51 PM deerbreh has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 150 by Modulous, posted 09-14-2005 1:00 AM gene90 has replied

gene90
Member (Idle past 3822 days)
Posts: 1610
Joined: 12-25-2000


Message 149 of 297 (243200)
09-14-2005 12:57 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by Peal
09-03-2005 4:56 PM


Re: Hounds are on the hunt.
quote:
In accordance with FEMA’s primary authorizing legislation, the Robert T. Stafford Disaster Relief and Emergency Assistance Act, FEMA is first and foremost a coordinating agency. The Agency therefore relies on strong partnerships to successfully carry out its mission. FEMA works with a variety of partners, including Federal agencies, States, Territories, Tribal Nations, local governments, first responders, voluntary organizations, business, industry, and individuals. While the Agency’s mission is squarely focused on protecting and preparing the Nation as a whole, primary responsibility for disaster response rests with State and local authorities. This means FEMA does not respond to all disasters that occur in the United States. Instead, when State and local capacity to respond is threatened or overwhelmed, a Governor may ask the President for Federal assistance.
FEMA is not responsible for everything that goes on in a disaster area. Their purpose is not to take over, but to assist local authorities. They cannot be legally deployed until formally requested by a governor.
Again:
quote:
Disasters cause suffering and disrupt people’s lives and the normal functioning of their communities. States, Territories, Tribal Nations, and local governments bear the primary responsibility for responding to and recovering from disasters. FEMA”at the direction of the President”takes action when State, Territorial, Tribal and local resources are overwhelmed and the Governor requests assistance.
http://www.fema.gov/...xt_reader_fema_strat_plan_fy03-08.doc

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Peal, posted 09-03-2005 4:56 PM Peal has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 155 by Peal, posted 09-14-2005 9:19 AM gene90 has replied

Modulous
Member
Posts: 7801
From: Manchester, UK
Joined: 05-01-2005


Message 150 of 297 (243203)
09-14-2005 1:00 AM
Reply to: Message 148 by gene90
09-14-2005 12:44 AM


misread
A couple of weeks?
A "couple of weeks" before landfall Katrina did not exist. Unless you're going to put psychics in the Office of Emergency Management, ain't gonna happen.
The quote said that event happened 'a couple of weeks ago', not that China evacuated in a couple of weeks. Typhoon
More info
And More

This message is a reply to:
 Message 148 by gene90, posted 09-14-2005 12:44 AM gene90 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 152 by gene90, posted 09-14-2005 1:01 AM Modulous has not replied

Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024