What to believe, crisis of faith

We seem similiar. I went to 12 years of Catholic school before goin to a public college and diving deep into science. I immediately lost my faith, even considered atheism, but then I realized there was something about my life that science couldn't explain. This is when I turned back to the teachings of Jesus, which most of faith is based on. It seemed to me that Jesus had a very good explanation for the things that I was qustioning and I turned back towards Catholicism. Basically, I believe Jesus. Personally, all those jewish stories of the old testament don't make a lot of sense to me. The teachings of Jesus do. The assumption I'm making is that what the bible says Jesus said is what he did say, even though its been overly translated, the message itself is righteous. Well, scientifically speaking, it doesn't matter if our observations are absolutely true, it matters that the same observation can be repeaed. This is all we can absolutely know, is what we can replicate, otherwise it doesn't matter. You can have the absolutely truthful observation that the lock ness monster exists, but unless science can repeat the observation, it will assume that it does not exist. I don't belive this, I think you can. Have you actually crossed the Pacific Ocean to see that there's other continents over there? Or do you trust what others have observed? (might be a poor analology) my point is that you can trust many of the observations that others have seen. Understand?

CF, you sound like a creationist explaining evolution, but visa versa. Thats good enough for me. Cmon now...."not having any doubt whatsoever"? Thats bullshit.Is this still the new Crashfrog, or the old one?

To speak for CF, he's a secular humanist (click)

Hi TheLiteralist,I realize you are not respondng to me but I saw some things I wanted to reply to. The actual truth. The truth that we can empirically explain to others as being the truth. I'm guessing eternal salvation. For me, there's no doubting that god isn't capable of keeping his word free from corruption, its just that he is so removed from our everyday lives that he allows corruption. Also, he never once indicates that the old testament is literally true. It is ambiguous enough to see it either way.Jesus spoke of Jonas but never said he literally lived inside the whale. Plus, if you compare 3 gospels you'll get 3 different quotes from Jesus that have differing amounts of lierallism that Jesus puts on the story, none of which he claims that Jonas actually lived inside a whale. To provide an example. the 10 commandments lets just say I turn the other cheek When I was taught science in college, almost every conclusion i was taught was taught along with the way to come about that conclusion on my own. The simplest explanation being, my theory is that if you drop this ball it will fall. Don't believe me? here's a ball....drop it. We did the labs and discovered so many of the conclusion they told us we would that I stopped having to do the labs to believe them. Kinda like how I believe Jesus' word. Please don't use that word "fact", it is traditional creationist gobbledegook that has nothing to do with science. And IMO the scientists' interpretation of evidence can be concidered eveidence if they are a credible source.

Fish or whale is irrelevant to my argument. When you say that Jesus “freely quotes from the Old Testament and never once indicates that there are problems with it”, it sounds like you’re support biblical literalism with the teachings of Jesus.My argument is that Jesus doesn’t support biblical literalism.One of the passages that comes up on this is that Jesus “freely quotes” the story of Jonas so the story must be literally true. My first reply to you on this topic was to show that Jesus referring to the OT doesn’t mean the story is literal. I think the 2nd and 10th commandments were ”corrupted’. The 2nd one was removed entirely and the 10th was split into two separate commandments, 9 and 10, so that there would still be 10 after the removal of the 2nd one. this was removed This was changed into 2 commandments So now we still have 10. I’ll leave my opinions of your church out of this. Have you ever spoke in tongues? If you have you should start a thread on the experience as I am interested in what it is like to someone who has. Do you guys refuse treatment for people and leave it up to God? What about less extreme views of evolution? Do you believe that evolution doesn’t occur? It becomes gobbledygook in this context: A scientific interpretation is not considered ”fact’ by the scientists. It is a misunderstanding by creationists that they do. In science we don’t consider interpretations to be truth. In a sense, the truth is unknowable, unless you’re a mathematician.

I've seen you claim this before. This is your interpretation and I think it is wrong. The bible said we became like the gods but it didn't say we're the same as them.

King James version: When I saw CF make this claim before his quote, iirc, had the word 'like' in it. And he claimed it said that we had the same knowledge of G&E that god has. I pointed out that our knowledge could be like his while his could be different than ours.It doesn't really matter though. The versions are too different to know what its really suppose to mean.

didn't see this before mine went through. I just don't think its that clear, that we are the same as the divine. Yeah, it just isn't clear enough to me. I don't really feel like arguing about this anymore.