Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 66 (9164 total)
2 online now:
Newest Member: ChatGPT
Post Volume: Total: 916,482 Year: 3,739/9,624 Month: 610/974 Week: 223/276 Day: 63/34 Hour: 2/4


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Message from the future
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1489 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 23 of 90 (247430)
09-29-2005 8:06 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Parasomnium
09-29-2005 9:26 AM


Re: Message from the future (updated)
How would you send a message to our internet from the future? How exactly could you get two computers to handshake? Why send only a short text message and not, say, 100 gigs of data on the infection?
I'm not dismissing this out of hand, because I don't believe that "time travel is impossible" is a scientific conclusion, but more prosaic technical problems with data transmission to infrastructure in the past, especially to a digital, packet-switched network, lead me to believe that this is most likely a funny hoax and not actually contact from the future.
Posting stuff to the internet requires a two-way link. And if the link is two-way, why wouldn't the future aliens stick around to chat with us?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Parasomnium, posted 09-29-2005 9:26 AM Parasomnium has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 29 by coffee_addict, posted 09-30-2005 1:51 AM crashfrog has replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1489 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 38 of 90 (247587)
09-30-2005 7:47 AM
Reply to: Message 29 by coffee_addict
09-30-2005 1:51 AM


Re: Message from the future (updated)
Call me crazy, but what if they had a prime directive that only allowed them minimum interference?
Then they've already violated it. Significantly violated it.
You need to watch more stargate sg-1 and star trek.
I'm not sure it would be possible for me to increase my viewership of those shows.
There are a brazillion reasons why they wouldn't chat with us, and most of them we couldn't think of.
The argument from ineffability doesn't go too far with me.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by coffee_addict, posted 09-30-2005 1:51 AM coffee_addict has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 42 by coffee_addict, posted 09-30-2005 11:06 AM crashfrog has replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1489 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 43 of 90 (247673)
09-30-2005 1:34 PM
Reply to: Message 42 by coffee_addict
09-30-2005 11:06 AM


Re: Message from the future (updated)
Here is another possibility. What if they decided that their prime directive was too strict and that interference was out of the question, but a small group of aliens decided to go ahead anyway with sending the message and only had enough time to send a short one way message before being caught?
Because it wouldn't take any more transmission time to send 100 gigs of data than to send the message that they did send. That's the part that doesn't work for me - it wouldn't have been harder to send 100 gigs than to send less than 1k of text.
Your possibility is the one that I already had anticipated in my reply.
Why didn't they just tell them exactly how to get back home? Wanna know the answer?
I know the answer. It's because the writers didn't know, yet.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by coffee_addict, posted 09-30-2005 11:06 AM coffee_addict has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 44 by coffee_addict, posted 09-30-2005 1:40 PM crashfrog has replied
 Message 46 by Parasomnium, posted 09-30-2005 2:58 PM crashfrog has replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1489 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 56 of 90 (247764)
09-30-2005 5:18 PM
Reply to: Message 44 by coffee_addict
09-30-2005 1:40 PM


Re: Message from the future (updated)
You forgot to reply to my other possibility.
I don't think a precis on the data avaliable during the time of the coming plague violates the Prime Directive any more than this note does. If they were trying to skirt a Prime Directive-type law, the note they sent would have been far, far more vague.
If you're gonna take a moral stance against a law, you take a big stance. You don't half-ass it.
Yes, they did, though.
Did it happen that way, when the series ended? I love SG-1 but Trek never did it for me. Worst science-fiction on television, if you ask me.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by coffee_addict, posted 09-30-2005 1:40 PM coffee_addict has not replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1489 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 58 of 90 (247769)
09-30-2005 5:31 PM
Reply to: Message 46 by Parasomnium
09-30-2005 2:58 PM


Re: How hard is "manipulating information through time"?
If we don't know what "manipulating information through time" means, then how can we possibly know how long it takes the aliens to do it, for any amount of information?
I can think of several types of time-travel where the size of the data is irrelevant to transmission time:
1) Time-transmission works not by syncronizing two separate time flows but by retroactive "editing" or direct changes to the universe at a discreet instant in the past - like making changes to one frame of a movie, the change appears instant to us here in the past.
2) Time-transmission works by dropping off the data stored to some kind of digital storage device, like a small flash drive. Since you have to send the whole drive for it to work, it doesn't matter if the drive has 1k of text data or 512 mb of PowerPoint slides on the infection.
There's other indications that bandwidth was not an issue - for instance, when transmission time is a premium, the first thing you don't do is use an intercaps character set; if you restrict to all upper or lower case letters and limited punctuation, you can cut an entire bit off of every character.
Instead, they sent an extra bit of data per character in order to have appropriate punctuation and capitalization. As short as it is, the message is too long and too "frilly" to have been sent under a situation where data transmission was a premium. It's much more likely that the limiting factor was our end, and there's a number of places on the internet that could accept a 1 gig file transfer, or 100 gigs, or whatever, about as fast as they could accept a < 1k file.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 46 by Parasomnium, posted 09-30-2005 2:58 PM Parasomnium has not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024