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Author Topic:   Man raised back to life in Jesus' name
Theodoric
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Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 16 of 300 (272852)
12-26-2005 2:58 PM
Reply to: Message 15 by randman
12-26-2005 2:57 PM


Re: prove it
Please red Asgara's post
This message has been edited by Theodoric, 12-26-2005 01:58 PM
This message has been edited by Theodoric, 12-26-2005 01:58 PM

Barb's Site
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This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by randman, posted 12-26-2005 2:57 PM randman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by randman, posted 12-26-2005 3:02 PM Theodoric has replied

randman 
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Message 17 of 300 (272853)
12-26-2005 3:01 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by Asgara
12-26-2005 2:53 PM


Re: prove it
Sorry, but stating it was not a miracle is an unsubstantiated claim, and should be retracted and rephrased that he believes it is not a miralce.
I offer up the news story as my evidence, and placed this in Coffee House because there is nothing here to argue really. You either beleive her story and account or do not. Discussions of why one believes can be fruitful. I believe because I have seen similar things, and all the evidence thus far indicates the story happened.
I don't know of anything beyond the story itself to prove or disprove, but certainly bare statements "it's not a miracle" are completely contradictory with an open mind and moreover unsubstantiated.
One point I had in posting this was just to point out that when people say miracles do not happen today as in the Bible, imo, they are disingenious or ignorant of the claims out there. The Bible miracles are no less or more proven than the ones today. They happened then and happened now. Some beleive and investigate and some do not.
This message has been edited by randman, 12-26-2005 03:04 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by Asgara, posted 12-26-2005 2:53 PM Asgara has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by Theodoric, posted 12-26-2005 3:05 PM randman has replied
 Message 21 by Asgara, posted 12-26-2005 3:09 PM randman has replied

randman 
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Posts: 6367
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Message 18 of 300 (272854)
12-26-2005 3:02 PM
Reply to: Message 16 by Theodoric
12-26-2005 2:58 PM


Re: prove it
Have you taken any effort at all in making your statement "it is not a miracle" to determine if it was a miracle or not?
I seriously doubt you have, but you insist it was not a miracle prior to ever studying the issue out.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 16 by Theodoric, posted 12-26-2005 2:58 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by Theodoric, posted 12-26-2005 3:06 PM randman has replied

Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 19 of 300 (272855)
12-26-2005 3:05 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by randman
12-26-2005 3:01 PM


Re: prove it
One point I had in posting this was just to point out that when people say miracles do not happen today as in the Bible, imo, they are disingenious or ignorant of the claims out there.
As you state these are claims, not proof. Therefore, those that say they are not happening are not disengenious or ignorant. They just have not seen proof that these so called miracles are miracles.
You are being fast and loose with facts and reality.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by randman, posted 12-26-2005 3:01 PM randman has replied

Replies to this message:
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Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 20 of 300 (272856)
12-26-2005 3:06 PM
Reply to: Message 18 by randman
12-26-2005 3:02 PM


Re: prove it
You yourself had stated that it is a claim of a miracle, not a miracle.
This message has been edited by Theodoric, 12-26-2005 02:11 PM

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 18 by randman, posted 12-26-2005 3:02 PM randman has replied

Replies to this message:
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Asgara
Member (Idle past 2302 days)
Posts: 1783
From: Wisconsin, USA
Joined: 05-10-2003


Message 21 of 300 (272860)
12-26-2005 3:09 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by randman
12-26-2005 3:01 PM


Re: prove it
This quote is from your msg 15 in this thread.
I readily admitted when I placed this in Coffee House that I wasn't trying to "prove" it was a miracle. I believe the story since I have seen miracles, and you do not.
You readily admitted no such thing. You made an existential claim - "Man raised back to life in Jesus' name" is the title of your thread, the only commentary you made on the article was - "MIracles still happen today."
These are existential claims. All you offered was a human interest article about an unconfirmed happening 3 years ago. No one has anything to substantially discuss until you provide evidence.

Asgara
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This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by randman, posted 12-26-2005 3:01 PM randman has replied

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randman 
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Message 22 of 300 (272861)
12-26-2005 3:11 PM
Reply to: Message 19 by Theodoric
12-26-2005 3:05 PM


Re: prove it
I looked into this and saw miracles really do happen. So when people say they haven't seen proof, I question whether they have looked into it for themselves. I used to provide documentation of some miracles, but found that when people do not want to believe, they will just dismiss it anyway, no matter how much evidence you present.
In my experience, people that are open-minded will find the evidence. They will hear stories like this, and consider them, and they will run across people that have experienced such miracles, and believe and look into them.
People that don't want to believe and are close-minded, in my experience, will not believe no matter what evidence you provide for them.
So I don't argue to prove this stuff anymore. If you are open-minded, you will hear of more of this, and if not, you probably won't accept anything, even if you witness the miracle yourself.

This message is a reply to:
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randman 
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Posts: 6367
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Message 23 of 300 (272863)
12-26-2005 3:13 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by Asgara
12-26-2005 3:09 PM


Re: prove it
the story is all the evidence offerred for this thread asqara....if you or someone chooses to reject this, that's your business, but you cannot say you know it was not a miracle without backing that up.
You may not like my evidence here, but it is some evidence. more than theodric has offerred..

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randman 
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Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 24 of 300 (272864)
12-26-2005 3:14 PM
Reply to: Message 20 by Theodoric
12-26-2005 3:06 PM


Re: prove it
the claim and story are the evidence of the miracle...if you feel it is insufficient, then argue that....stating you know for a fact it is not a miracle is an unsubstantiated claim..

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 27 by Coragyps, posted 12-26-2005 3:50 PM randman has replied
 Message 66 by crashfrog, posted 12-30-2005 1:56 PM randman has not replied

randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 4899 days)
Posts: 6367
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Message 25 of 300 (272866)
12-26-2005 3:15 PM


the negative reaction is interesting
It's interesting the emotional level in terms of the negative response to just reporting a woman's account.
Seems some folks have an emotional interest in disbelieving in miracles.

nwr
Member
Posts: 6408
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 26 of 300 (272879)
12-26-2005 3:48 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by Brian
12-26-2005 4:55 AM


Re: What is 2 plus 2?
Interesting that there are no eyewitness statements to support her claim.
As best I can tell, "miracles" only happen when there are no skeptical eyewitnesses present.

Impeach Bush

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by Brian, posted 12-26-2005 4:55 AM Brian has not replied

Coragyps
Member (Idle past 734 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 27 of 300 (272880)
12-26-2005 3:50 PM
Reply to: Message 24 by randman
12-26-2005 3:14 PM


Re: prove it
Here's a better-substantiated miracle, Randman:
Hindu Milk Miracle - Crystalinks
Comments?

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 28 by Theodoric, posted 12-26-2005 4:03 PM Coragyps has not replied
 Message 29 by randman, posted 12-26-2005 4:12 PM Coragyps has not replied
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Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 28 of 300 (272887)
12-26-2005 4:03 PM
Reply to: Message 27 by Coragyps
12-26-2005 3:50 PM


Milk miracle debunked
Here is the science behind this supposed miracle
http://theory.tifr.res.in/.../trivia/ganapati-milk.html#expt
Another debunk of a miracle
The crying game | | The Guardian
I can find more

Barb's Site
Exposing the radical right with facts

This message is a reply to:
 Message 27 by Coragyps, posted 12-26-2005 3:50 PM Coragyps has not replied

Replies to this message:
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randman 
Suspended Member (Idle past 4899 days)
Posts: 6367
Joined: 05-26-2005


Message 29 of 300 (272893)
12-26-2005 4:12 PM
Reply to: Message 27 by Coragyps
12-26-2005 3:50 PM


Re: prove it
That's pretty interesting, especially the number of people that witnessed this. Not surprising really once you recognize such things can happen.
any more info on it?

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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nator
Member (Idle past 2169 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 30 of 300 (272894)
12-26-2005 4:13 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by randman
12-26-2005 3:43 AM


quote:
Miracles still happen today.
Yeah.
Here's another miracle from the past.
God is truly loving and merciful, isn't He, rand?

This message is a reply to:
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