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Author Topic:   Ancient Attribution: Humble Anonymity or Pseudepigrapha‎
Discreet Label
Member (Idle past 5091 days)
Posts: 272
Joined: 11-17-2005


Message 16 of 21 (275482)
01-03-2006 7:05 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by idontlikeforms
01-02-2006 4:27 PM


Re: Old Testament as Pseudopigrapha
I'm not certain if all of the Penteteuch was written by Moses as Deut. 32:51 does record Moses dying. Truth is that it is really difficult trying to write a book when suffering from rigorum mortis.
And I think there was a thread or two that discussed Mosaic authorship in more detail.
http://EvC Forum: could moses have written the first five books of the bible -->EvC Forum: could moses have written the first five books of the bible

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 Message 11 by idontlikeforms, posted 01-02-2006 4:27 PM idontlikeforms has replied

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idontlikeforms
Inactive Member


Message 17 of 21 (275509)
01-03-2006 9:12 PM
Reply to: Message 16 by Discreet Label
01-03-2006 7:05 PM


Re: Old Testament as Pseudopigrapha
quote:
I'm not certain if all of the Penteteuch was written by Moses as Deut. 32:51 does record Moses dying. Truth is that it is really difficult trying to write a book when suffering from rigorum mortis.
And I think there was a thread or two that discussed Mosaic authorship in more detail.
http://EvC Forum: could moses have written the first five books of the bible -->EvC Forum: could moses have written the first five books of the bible
Right. Moses couldn't have written the last 8 verses of Deuteronomy. Actually I comment on that in a post I just made in the thread you give too.

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 Message 16 by Discreet Label, posted 01-03-2006 7:05 PM Discreet Label has not replied

  
purpledawn
Member (Idle past 3485 days)
Posts: 4453
From: Indiana
Joined: 04-25-2004


Message 18 of 21 (275614)
01-04-2006 3:18 AM
Reply to: Message 10 by idontlikeforms
01-02-2006 4:21 PM


Humble Anonymity or Pseudepigrapha
This is not a discussion about whether certain books are pseudepigrapha or not, but on the intent of authors of those books considered to be anonymous or pseudepigrapha. Please refer to Message 1.
We are discussing the intent behind writing an anonymous work or the intent behind attributing a written work to another person, usually someone of importance.
Did they remain anonymous for the glory of God?
Did a student write the book in the style of his teacher?
Not all the Pauline epistles are considered authentic.
Why did those authors attribute their work to Paul?
We are discussing the practices and styles of attribution.
The author of James appears to have been a student of James, the brother of Jesus, and wrote in the style appropriate to his teachings. It was not an uncommon practice supposedly.
Please keep the discussion in this vein if you wish to participate.

There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. -Edith Wharton

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 Message 10 by idontlikeforms, posted 01-02-2006 4:21 PM idontlikeforms has not replied

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ramoss
Member (Idle past 640 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 08-11-2004


Message 19 of 21 (275653)
01-04-2006 8:22 AM
Reply to: Message 18 by purpledawn
01-04-2006 3:18 AM


Re: Humble Anonymity or Pseudepigrapha
It seems to be such a widely accepted practice during that time period (for both Jewish and CHristian texts), I don't really see any reason to think it is 'Humble anonyminty'. I feel it was just accepted practice.

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jar
Member (Idle past 422 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 20 of 21 (275730)
01-04-2006 11:26 AM
Reply to: Message 18 by purpledawn
01-04-2006 3:18 AM


Re: Humble Anonymity or Pseudepigrapha
There were several different reasons for the practice. The two biggest were likely for recognition and acceptance (who would read something by Jonathan the Acolyte to Simon who was the scribe for James?).
The second was for continuity. Particularly in the Talmudic tradition, argument from the style of an earlier scholar was not just common, but honored. For "argument in the style of" to work, several things were necessary.
First, all the participants needed to be intimately familar with the full body of writings of the person the new work would be attributed to. Second, it was recognized among the group that it was not the person the new work was attributed to that was speaking, but "An Argument in the style of".
The third point is very important. The new writing was judges under two seperate criteria. It must stand up in both areas or it waould fail.
It must actually be "in the style of". If the audience did not se a continuity of thought, manner, presentation, logic and content, then the argument, no matter how valid, would be rejected. Second, the new writing must be original yet consistent. It must be capable of being supported, even if all others disagreed with it.
Since both of these conditions were simply unspoken, works that passed this rigorous filtering entered the overall body of work under the attribution of the person it was attributed to as opposed to the author. At the time, it's likely that many even outside the vetting body were aware of the actual state of affairs, but since it was common practice, it would not be comment or noted.
As time passed and the actual people with first hand knowledge of the event died, the details that led to the attribution, never formally documented in the first place, would be forgotten.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 18 by purpledawn, posted 01-04-2006 3:18 AM purpledawn has not replied

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ReverendDG
Member (Idle past 4138 days)
Posts: 1119
From: Topeka,kansas
Joined: 06-06-2005


Message 21 of 21 (275966)
01-05-2006 4:52 AM
Reply to: Message 20 by jar
01-04-2006 11:26 AM


Re: Humble Anonymity or Pseudepigrapha
what do you think of this as a reason?, safty?
supose you were a writer back during the time when attacking christians was a good thing, would you want to be found to be the writer of christian texts?
while i could see the 2 you listed jar but i thought i'd just throw this one out for peoples thoughts

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