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Author | Topic: What would heaven be like? | |||||||||||||||||||||||
Gzus Inactive Member |
I i went to heaven, would i be able to 'sin'? or would that priveledge be taken away?
If I went to hell, would I be able to do 'good'? if all is 'good', there is no such thing as 'good' since what do you measure 'goodness' by? won't you always do the most 'good' thing making your life predictable, unfree and robot-like? or do you have the choice to 'sin', preserving your free will?
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
I don't profess to know what heaven will be like. I think it will be like going home after being exiled and imprisoned in a horrible land.
if all is 'good', there is no such thing as 'good' since what do you measure 'goodness' by? won't you always do the most 'good' thing making your life predictable, unfree and robot-like? or do you have the choice to 'sin', preserving your free will? I don't think we will ever lose the memories of our life here on earth, we will remember the horror of sin and it's terrible consequence and burden. There will still be something to measure it by and maybe that is why it was necessary for us to live this life here in these bodies. ------------------Saved by an incredible Grace.
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doctrbill Member (Idle past 2786 days) Posts: 1174 From: Eugene, Oregon, USA Joined: |
quote: How can it be "heaven" if we are haunted by horrible and terrible memories? db
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Mr. Davies Inactive Member |
I heard heaven is much hotter than hell. In hell, there's boiling rivers of sulfur. However the brilliance that is described in heaven would make iron vaporize.
------------------When all else fails, check the manual
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Brad McFall Member (Idle past 5055 days) Posts: 3428 From: Ithaca,NY, USA Joined: |
What would the "priveldge" of 'sin' be. There have been quite a few programs on Christianity this seasons I have wondered if perhaps you are confusing in this as a question between the righteous and the unrighteous. I do not however intend to cosmologically cause you to think that in so saying I have "narrowed" your mind.
As to goodness I am taking a strictly US interpretation from the undelegated powers to STATES or citizens by the 10th ammendment but by the 11th it can not be defined by what a state did that was 'bad'instead I would have to have had it built in case law from violation socially of something true in the biological community of Aristotle's position but the distribution of such a power I have not principalled on this station on Earth. First it would be known biologically as to the equality of all men. This however could be alineated by some virtual reality however. As to how this totally is cut out that may depend on distinguishing this legal appearence from the appearence of truth itself.
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Gzus Inactive Member |
How did the 11th amendment get into this? And what the hell does it have to do with Aristotle!!!
Speak sense mate
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Gzus Inactive Member |
The privilege of sin is basically our free will to right and wrong
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Brad McFall Member (Idle past 5055 days) Posts: 3428 From: Ithaca,NY, USA Joined: |
When you are ready to talk sense we will. One of the difficulties is that because your posts are generic and do not display to which you replied is not easy enough to weave the same density of thread otherwise. I gave you my (BRAD's) perspective. I do not speak "for the guys" as you noted.
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Brad McFall Member (Idle past 5055 days) Posts: 3428 From: Ithaca,NY, USA Joined: |
Then why is it a "priveledge"?
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Gzus Inactive Member |
Yes, ok, I admit
Privilege presupposes want, which presupposes purpose, which presupposes meaning etc. all of which by the way, I hold (through the reasoning of past philosophers) to be delusions of the human ‘mind’ which has no freedom. —let’s not get into that shall we. But I accept your point. A privilege it is not, for those who do not hold the maxim ‘freedom is good’. But the existence of sin is a necessity for freedom since if all is good, perfect, then there can be no other choice than perfection (assuming that sin has meaning and that it is not merely a delusion). I am attempting merely to find fault in the biblical interpretation of heaven by revealing a seeming violation of free will.
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shilohproject Inactive Member |
quote: Brad,Could you restate this? I'm not getting it, at all. Sorry. -Shiloh
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Coragyps Member (Idle past 757 days) Posts: 5553 From: Snyder, Texas, USA Joined: |
quote: Errm.... What terrible consequence and burden might that be? I'm not any more or less moral than ol' Joe Blow over there, but neither have I noticed all that baggage. Sure, a pang of guilt if I forget to call my mother on her birthday, but.... Oh, and back to the OT: Whose heaven? The Mohammedan one is a little better described, and sound a heck of a lot more entertaining, than the Christian one. [This message has been edited by Coragyps, 12-25-2002]
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forgiven Inactive Member |
Originally posted by Gzus: Privilege presupposes want, which presupposes purpose, which presupposes meaning etc. all of which by the way, I hold (through the reasoning of past philosophers) to be delusions of the human ‘mind’ which has no freedom. —let’s not get into that shall we. let's do get into it... what exactly are you saying?
But I accept your point. A privilege it is not, for those who do not hold the maxim ‘freedom is good’. But the existence of sin is a necessity for freedom since if all is good, perfect, then there can be no other choice than perfection (assuming that sin has meaning and that it is not merely a delusion). please explain how "..the existence of sin is a necessity for freedom.." ... imagine sin as a disease and not, as you seem to suggest, something we'd *choose* for ourselves if we had a choice... now imagine a place where this disease is unknown.. how does its absence limit our freedom?
I am attempting merely to find fault in the biblical interpretation of heaven by revealing a seeming violation of free will. i don't think you've found it with this argument
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shilohproject Inactive Member |
Question: If no one is capable of a sin-free life (other than Christ, which I believe) then how is sin a function of free will?
If I am unable, by definition, to fly, how can my failure to fly be held as a product of my "free will?" Isn't it more reasonable to simply accept the idea that God alone is holy, that we are not, and that this is simply a result of our imperfection? If one uses this paradigm, then so-called "free will" is not an issue in heaven. I enjoy my health and do not need to be sick occasionally to help me value wellness. An illness might in fact have that result, but it certainly is not required. In keeping with this analogy, being free from "sin" in heaven, or anywhere for that matter, might simply put us into a state of holiness that could best be described as "well." I don't need to go slam a rig of heroin to know that it isn't for me. Does this make any sense? (Side bar: my wife just walked in and pointed out that, if you are a literalist, angels in heaven revolted against God, which would have to be "sin." So, the question that follows is: Do angels have free will? Clearly THEY had the ability to sin in heaven. Of course one could argue that angels were never bought by the blood of Christ. So I'm not sure how that plays into all this.) -Shiloh
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funkmasterfreaky Inactive Member |
quote: I didn't say anything about being haunted by sin, rather exactly the opposite. Could you ever appreciate summer if there was no winter? ------------------Saved by an incredible Grace.
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