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Member (Idle past 734 days) Posts: 5553 From: Snyder, Texas, USA Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Interesting quiz | |||||||||||||||||||||||
ReverendDG Member (Idle past 4110 days) Posts: 1119 From: Topeka,kansas Joined: |
it seems the rationialists were lumped togather with the anabaptists really it seems that any group that feels the burn of leaders who control religion wants to seperate it from goverment. more than likely the fathers felt it through the CoE's control over the crown and seeing a religious shift every new king or queen
While i would agree that you should atribute it to the right people, i don't really think you can, many groups believed it as for the puritans they controled england for about a century or two then got kicked out after doing crazy things
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Silent H Member (Idle past 5819 days) Posts: 7405 From: satellite of love Joined: |
I am with you that more than just anabaptists supported that idea, however it is clear that as a large movement (perhaps I should say large and successful) it began with the anabaptists in a somewhat unbroken line to the founding of our nation.
Specifically the test asks about the "wall of separation between church and state" and attributes it to Jefferson. Well that is only partly true. While he was not an anabaptist he used that phrase while writing to the anabaptists (that is specifically where we got the phrase) and used their common terminology for the concept. The concept was also proven as worthy within anabaptist communities within the colonies. They were certainly the first. holmes "What you need is sustained outrage...there's far too much unthinking respect given to authority." (M.Ivins)
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nator Member (Idle past 2169 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
got 19 out of 20.
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nator Member (Idle past 2169 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: So, got a bad score, eh?
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Chiroptera Inactive Member |
19 out of 21.
I had to guess on two; one I got correct, the other wrong. The other wrong answer was due to not remembering history correctly. "Intellectually, scientifically, even artistically, fundamentalism -- biblical literalism -- is a road to nowhere, because it insists on fidelity to revealed truths that are not true." -- Katha Pollitt |
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arachnophilia Member (Idle past 1343 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: |
No it means we have a church that stays out of government. Not a governement that stays out of church, or does not believe in God, or does not adhere to "biblical morals", whether they got them from the bible or not. The church has to answer to governemt try the reverse. we have freedom of religion, meaning, and i'm doing a little more than paraphrasing here, congress cannot make a law regarding religion. the government stays out of religion. that's pretty much what it says.
Then why do churches need a 501 c 3 ? because churches should be making prophets, not profits. a 501(c)3 certifies an organization as not-for-profit.
It doesn't matter where you get your morals from. One way is not more right than another. exactly. legally, the "christian" way is not more right than any other religion. we legislate based on secular values.
I also understand the similarities, and I have covered that before too. I am asking that one not be more correct than the other, and that we have the freedom to choose whatever moral base we want. I think that is fair. A scientific study is not a law science is secular. it's not legislated, really, either. but it is not a religion, and you know that. science is taught in school because the only objections to it are religious ones. if i have a religion that says psychiatry was founded by an evil space alien to keep us all brainwashed, does a high school psychology class violate the establishment clause?
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riVeRraT Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 5788 From: NY USA Joined: |
because churches should be making prophets, not profits. a 501(c)3 certifies an organization as not-for-profit. So that just proves that churches must answer to governement.Our laws dictate what a church is, or isn't.
science is secular. it's not legislated, Yes it is legislated.More than church. So your saying we need to separate science and state, you agree with me? But not all science, only the one true science, according to the science bible. Oh wait, nothing is written in stone so mever mind.
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riVeRraT Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 5788 From: NY USA Joined: |
I got to the 3rd question and decided not to take it.
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arachnophilia Member (Idle past 1343 days) Posts: 9069 From: god's waiting room Joined: |
So that just proves that churches must answer to governement. Our laws dictate what a church is, or isn't. yes, and we have a second amendment right to bear arms, too. but you still need a permit to carry a concealed weapon. a 501(c)3 makes it so that church doesn't have to PAY TAXES. that sounds like a benefit, to me. doesn't it.
Yes it is legislated. More than church. science is not legislated. keep in mind that it's the churches that don't like science, not the other way around. learning science does not establish or detract from religion.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
yes. you have the right to believe whatever you want. you can even believe that your toilet is god and it imparts wisdom through your anus to you.
however, you do not have the right to legislate based on your beliefs. if there is no non-religious reason for a law, it should not stand. (note: this is not the case.)
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
to get the meaning of 'the whole body of the church' you have to lowercase the c. but you're being argumentative. you know full well Catholic refers to the roman catholic church or at the very most the roman and eastern rite churches. it doesn not mean 'the whole church' to anyone even those who have read the westminster confession.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
yeah. the puritans talked about religious freedom. they certainly didn't practice it. but then christians have talked about compassion and 'blessed are the peacemakers' for how many years and crap if that's the case.
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macaroniandcheese  Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days) Posts: 4258 Joined: |
because churches should be making prophets, not profits. a 501(c)3 certifies an organization as not-for-profit. So that just proves that churches must answer to governement.Our laws dictate what a church is, or isn't. um. no. jesus what the one who discouraged church involvement in money. or doesn't it apply since it's not related to selling sacrificial animals?
Yes it is legislated. More than church. the hell you say. let me explain the scientific process to you. not the method, the process. i get some fantastic idea about how something works.i think about it and read what is published on the subject. i write up a sumarry of what's been published. this is called a lit review. then i form a clear statement of how i think my idea works. this is called a thesis proposal. this includes a statement of methodology. i.e. will you be taking a survey or fiddling with chemicals or training dogs to eat each other or whatever. then i call some people and send them these two things. they send me money to pursue it. these things can be very time consuming and prevent things like jobs from happening. also, you can present them to your department if you are a professor and they will give you funding for graduate assistants to help you with the project and teaching assistants to teach your classes while you're busy. then you conduct your research. this may take a very long time (sometimes 50 years for psychologists or those crazy anthro kids). and if you live through it, you state your results in a long and drawn out fashion and then present it at a conference. then someone else takes your paper and re-conducts your experiment (in the case of hard sciences) or reanalyzes your statistics or whatever (in the case of soft 'sciences'). so if these people can redo your experiment and get the same results, you get published in a journal. then someone loves you and you publish an even longer version in a book and you go on sabatical to rest your tired brain. did you see any legislation in there?i mean. maybe you could say that the retest is a kind of legislation since if they can't repeat the experiment it is proclaimed invalid. but that's a good thing. being able to say someone is wrong is a very powerful thing. you can't do it with religion. there's no way we can prevent the next pope from deciding that jesus isn't important and we all have to sacrifice virgins to maintain the purity of the blessed mother. (btw. that's just an example. and a crazy one.) but yes. we can legislate base on scientific discoveries because they are inherently a reflection of reality and not controlled by politics. (ideally. this has no hold over the bomb or oil or cigarrettes.) religion is very political, however. and can change at the drop of a hat. science takes at least 7 years to change. cause that's how long it takes to get published. This message has been edited by brennakimi, 02-02-2006 11:01 AM
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nator Member (Idle past 2169 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: Didn't know the anwers, eh? Or maybe you just got angry that the notions of US history and the basis of our government are not based in Christianity like you thought they were. You do know that those questions were all factual in basis, right? If you got so upset while taking it that you couldn't continue, then I'd say that you are probably having issues with facts that you wish weren't true. Well, anyway, you have no basis for saying that the quiz is "crap" as you didn't even read all of the questions, nor did you learn any of the events and facts that the correct answers consist of. This message has been edited by schrafinator, 02-03-2006 06:52 PM
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riVeRraT Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 5788 From: NY USA Joined: |
did you see any legislation in there? Yes, half that stuff is governed.
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