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Author Topic:   evolutionary chain
Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 5 of 204 (255189)
10-27-2005 6:14 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Christian
10-27-2005 5:50 PM


Hello, Christian.
Probably one of the most complete chains (due to its being relatively recent) is the chain that links an ancient bipedal (yet chimpanzee-like) ape with modern humans:
You can find more about these ancient hominids on TalkOrigins and at this site.
Kathleen Hunt has written an essay describing the transitions seen in the fossil record for several major lineages. Furthermore, the descriptive articles at Palaeos also have some good information about the transitions (look at the cladograms; each entry on each cladogram is a known fossil species). Palaeos, though, can be a bit difficult to navigate if you aren't used to it.
Hope this helps.
Added by edit:
Oops. I just realized you asked for a chain of transitions between major groups. The human lineage I provided is within a relatively minor group. I hope the other links are helpful, though.
This message has been edited by Chiroptera, 27-Oct-2005 10:17 PM

"Intellectually, scientifically, even artistically, fundamentalism -- biblical literalism -- is a road to nowhere, because it insists on fidelity to revealed truths that are not true." -- Katha Pollitt

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Christian, posted 10-27-2005 5:50 PM Christian has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by Christian, posted 10-27-2005 6:59 PM Chiroptera has replied

  
Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 8 of 204 (255206)
10-27-2005 7:23 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by Christian
10-27-2005 6:59 PM


To add to what Ned says:
Given two species in the fossil record, it is generally impossible to tell whether one of the species evolved from the other. All we can generally do is notice that the two species are very closely related, and then conclude that the one with the more primitive characteristics is closely related to a common ancestor.
In the lineages that people have (fish to tetrapod, synapsid to mammal, Australopithecine to human) all we can do is notice that the species that are found make a nice series of transitions; the hominid species in my earlier post, for example, show a nice smooth gradual transition from ancient apes to modern humans -- the gaps are relatively small and it is easy to imagine how those gaps should be filled.
If one is looking for a series of definite ancestor species and descendent species, then one is going to be disappointed. It simply is not possible to distinguish ancestor/descendent species with species that are merely near relatives.

"Intellectually, scientifically, even artistically, fundamentalism -- biblical literalism -- is a road to nowhere, because it insists on fidelity to revealed truths that are not true." -- Katha Pollitt

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 Message 6 by Christian, posted 10-27-2005 6:59 PM Christian has not replied

  
Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 182 of 204 (283707)
02-03-2006 6:55 PM
Reply to: Message 180 by Christian
02-03-2006 6:43 PM


Re: horse evolution
quote:
The Tulsa Zoo took out their horse evolution display because of it's inaccuracies.
This may very well be false. I found the following:
In September, City and PArk officials met with Dan Hicks and his associate to discuss their concerns. Although we did not feel it was appropriate to honor all of his requests, we did agree to the following: (a) to place a sign at the Zoo's entry which states, 'There are many views on the origin of biological species and their behaviors. The information that accompanies our displays is based on compelling evidence of the natural sciences. Because scientific knowledge is subject to change, these displays may be revised as new informatin becomes available.' (b) to reword one line of signage from our chimp exhibit from 'Scientific blood tests show that chimpanzees are man's closest biological relative, branching off from a common ancestor about 6 million years ago' to 'Scientific blood tests, including DNA analysis, show a biological similarity between chimps and people'. (c) to modify the exhibit on Equus ancestry to more completely reflect current sicentiifc thought, using the writings of Dr. Bruce McFadden.
Judging from one book that he has written, it would appear that Dr. McFadden is an evolutionist expert on the evolution of horses.

"Intellectually, scientifically, even artistically, fundamentalism -- biblical literalism -- is a road to nowhere, because it insists on fidelity to revealed truths that are not true." -- Katha Pollitt

This message is a reply to:
 Message 180 by Christian, posted 02-03-2006 6:43 PM Christian has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 193 by Christian, posted 02-08-2006 5:25 PM Chiroptera has not replied

  
Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 185 of 204 (283713)
02-03-2006 7:17 PM
Reply to: Message 180 by Christian
02-03-2006 6:43 PM


Re: horse evolution
quote:
Also, I'm still looking for more detailed information on horse evolution,if anyone knows of any sources.
Also, besides the book to which I linked in a previous post (which might be more technical than you want, although sometimes the technical literature can be great reading, in my opinion), here is a very brief summary on horse evolution, although I don't know how up-to-date it is.

"Intellectually, scientifically, even artistically, fundamentalism -- biblical literalism -- is a road to nowhere, because it insists on fidelity to revealed truths that are not true." -- Katha Pollitt

This message is a reply to:
 Message 180 by Christian, posted 02-03-2006 6:43 PM Christian has not replied

  
Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 188 of 204 (283724)
02-03-2006 7:39 PM
Reply to: Message 187 by Adminnemooseus
02-03-2006 7:33 PM


Re: Amazingly enough, we don't seem to have a specific "horse evolution" topic
It would appear to me that the recent posts on horse evolution are very much on topic. Since the OP was a challenge to provide evidence for evolution in the form of transitional species, examples would certainly be called for; since this recent subthread was started by the claim that horse evolution is not such an example, the discussion of horse evolution is warranted.

"Intellectually, scientifically, even artistically, fundamentalism -- biblical literalism -- is a road to nowhere, because it insists on fidelity to revealed truths that are not true." -- Katha Pollitt

This message is a reply to:
 Message 187 by Adminnemooseus, posted 02-03-2006 7:33 PM Adminnemooseus has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 190 by Adminnemooseus, posted 02-03-2006 8:38 PM Chiroptera has not replied

  
Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 196 of 204 (285051)
02-08-2006 6:03 PM
Reply to: Message 195 by DrJones*
02-08-2006 6:01 PM


Re: horse evolution
quote:
And check out arach's post #186 where he quotes a creationist source that says that modern horse breeds have differing rib counts.
And creationists themselves admit that different horse breeds have a common ancestor, so they must admit that evolution can produce different numbers of ribs.

"Intellectually, scientifically, even artistically, fundamentalism -- biblical literalism -- is a road to nowhere, because it insists on fidelity to revealed truths that are not true." -- Katha Pollitt

This message is a reply to:
 Message 195 by DrJones*, posted 02-08-2006 6:01 PM DrJones* has not replied

  
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