Gay marraige and the end of the world

no i am not gay. i simply happen to have fallen in love with a woman.

You were not sexually attracted to her?

not particularly. but being sexually attracted to one person does not make you gay.

So what makes you gay?

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gay Audio pronunciation of "gay" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (g)
adj. gay·er, gay·est

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1. Of, relating to, or having a sexual orientation to persons of the same sex.
2. Showing or characterized by cheerfulness and lighthearted excitement; merry.
3. Bright or lively, especially in color: a gay, sunny room.
4. Given to social pleasures.
5. Dissolute; licentious.

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certainly not falling in love with one person.i have dated seven guys. slept with two. been interesting in. oh hundreds. i've fallen in love with one girl and had sex with none.i'd say i'm pretty straight. i have an 'orientation' to members of the opposite sex. more specifically. i don't even have many female friends. i don't even like women. they're bitchy and cruel and selfish and awful and gross. and frankly i have come to see that the one i fell in love with is no different. you live, you learn.This message has been edited by brennakimi, 02-02-2006 12:54 PM

But tell us how you really feel.Woman are the crown of creation.

oh whatever. fuck that.btw. women are
or woman is.This message has been edited by brennakimi, 02-03-2006 09:27 AMabe
i'm the most chauvanistic person you'll ever meet. don't question me when i say something. that's accusing me of lying and i don't appreciate it. if i say something like that, it's because i mean it. now get a new hobby.This message has been edited by brennakimi, 02-03-2006 10:40 AM

Did posting that make any useful contribution to the discussion?(rhetorical question; do not respond to it in this thread)

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what bothers me is when people attempt to disallow, legally, differences of opinion. most gay people happen to hold the opinion that they should be allowed to marry someone of the same gender.you can hold your opinion that it's not a marriage -- but can you legislate that opinion?

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But isn't that what this whole discussion is about?I don't feel it's just my opinion. I feel I have proved it.
To me it's a question of what is, and what ain't. Not bigotry or any other horrible name.In fact, having hashed all this out, I think my secular reasoning is way stronger than my religous reasoning. If I were to go from religious reasoning soley, then I think I would say do whatever you want.I bet no-one believes me, but I am truely very close to the middle of this topic. I see and feel both sides.

It feels all weird in here under your skin.

quite. i'm not paying too close attention to this thread, and it's a bit long. where did you prove it? can you give a me a brief rundown of the argument?

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Message 168 sums it up.
It is as honest as I can be, and no one has really addressed anything I said there.

RR's main secular points, for ease of discussion:

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#1, from a non-religous point of view. The only logical reason I can come up with for being against gay marriage, and to think that being gay is in some sort of way wrong, is that, we all are born of a mother and a father. To be gay is in some way to go against that, and is some how disrespectful to the very process that brought us into existance, and kept us here on this earth for so many years. I wish I could put that into better words.

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#2 Being born gay is not a proven thing yet. This would greatly affect how I feel about this. Mind you, I sit on the fence about whether people are born gay or not. Sometimes, you can just look at a person and say, "your gay". But that is judging, so I refrain from that. You can also take on a gay appearance, and anyone could act metaphorically gay or straight, and we would never really know the difference from outward appearances. Another good reason not to judge people. Some people are just "flames", and I do not think I will ever understand that.

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#3 People have asked me, did I choose to be straight. I say yes. Because I was raised to think that being gay is ok. My first sexual encounter was almost a gay one, and I choose not to have it.
My choice may have been based on a desire, but I also choose not to smoke pot even though I desire to. I also choose to be monogomous and not be with multiple partners, even though there may be an inward desire to do so.

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#4 The animal kingdom, I have been told that there are animnals who are gay. They would even mate for life. I have yet to see any links for this, but it makes no difference, because if we start basing our society on what goes on in the animal kingdom, we are in for trouble, so scratch that idea.

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#5 I do believe that some people are gay, not by choice, but by things that may have happened to them beyond their control. I know this as fact. I have witnessed it first hand, and it has been admitted to me by homosexual people. We are the sum of our experiences.

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I heard one definition in here of love being nothing more than an extention of our survival instincts in action. A natural chemical reaction in the brain so that we may continue to exist.

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If that is true, then how can a man love a man?

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Given the option, I have never heard someone say that they would wish to have two male parents, or two female parents over one male, and one female. We all have a natural desire to have our biological parents raise us, in a peaceful and loving manor.

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Just because this is not the norm, doen't make gay marriage right.
A=C B=C but B can't =C or whatever.

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Now the other thing that I am dealing with is that I just don't feel that it is right in my heart. I will never look at 2 guys kissing, and say "awwww how cute!". Even 2 woman kissing wouldn't sexually attract me unless I thought I could be in the middle somehow. But I also made it clear that what my flesh desires sexually is not what I think should be what marriage is based on.

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RR's religious reasons:

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Now from a religous stand point, there is no way you could ever say that Jesus thinks its ok. Even though people have tried in here, I will never be convinced that Jesus thinks its ok. It's one man, one woman.

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Matthew 19: 4"Haven't you read," he replied, "that at the beginning the Creator 'made them male and female,' 5and said, 'For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh'? 6 So they are no longer two, but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate."

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That amoung other verses makes it pretty clear to me, how God made us to be.

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Hope this is usefulAdmnIRH

I don't think that's a good argument. Being gay appears to be quite natural (part of nature). It occurs in all human societies, AFAIK. It is said to occur in other species too. My opinion is that people are born neither gay nor straight. They are born with complex psychological drives, and must discover for themselves ways to channel these drives.Maybe some people are genetically predisposed toward being more likely to satisfy their drives in a homosexual manner, while others are more likely to satisfy them in a heterosexual manner. Or maybe it is all dependent on our experiences and our early encounters with other people. Did you choose to speak English? I suspect that you were raised to think that having other native languages was okay, yet your native language is English. Does that mean it was a choice?IMO native language is not a choice. We are compelled by circumstances. Yet our native language is not genetic. So it seems possible to me, that gay/straight is not a choice but is compelled by circumstances, even though it is probably not genetic. Jesus wasn't even talking about homosexuality there. He was talking about divorce.Can you explain why some Christians take divorce in their stride, and many even seek divorce themselves. Yet they are completely hostile to homosexuals. To me, this seems like a serious inconsistency.