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Author | Topic: What’s YEC explanation for the emergence of races? | |||||||||||||||||||||||
derwood Member (Idle past 1898 days) Posts: 1457 Joined: |
quote:No - should anyone have?
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Peter Member (Idle past 1501 days) Posts: 2161 From: Cambridgeshire, UK. Joined: |
quote: It's even less time ... and I've asked this too ... since all theraces we see had to come from Noah's descendents which acording to YEC was about 4500 years ago. Plus, since we know that different races existed at the timeof Jesus, that cuts us down to an emergence time of less than 2500 years. We also know that different races existed prior to this,and that according to KJV Egyptians existed only a few hundred years after the flood ... indicating a racial separation time of a mere few hundred years.
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RedVento Inactive Member |
This is just something I got while watching my favorite station (Discovery Channel).
Apparantly based on the lack of any significant differences in human DNA they surmised that at one point in history the human was near extinction. Apparantly there should be more variation in DNA. Using the knowledge of mitochondrial DNA and that it has a nearly set mutation rate they have been able to back track and give this near extinction time at sometime 70-80k years ago. It is surmised that the human race was cut down to roughly 10k members and that is what accounts for the lack of variation. They attribute this to a "super volcano."
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peter borger Member (Idle past 7687 days) Posts: 965 From: australia Joined: |
Dear Vento,
V: This is just something I got while watching my favorite station (Discovery Channel).Apparantly based on the lack of any significant differences in human DNA they surmised that at one point in history the human was near extinction. Apparantly there should be more variation in DNA. Using the knowledge of mitochondrial DNA and that it has a nearly set mutation rate they have been able to back track and give this near extinction time at sometime 70-80k years ago. It is surmised that the human race was cut down to roughly 10k members and that is what accounts for the lack of variation. They attribute this to a "super volcano." PB: More ad hoc evo-blahblah-explanations on 'mind control'. Contemporary biology has demonstrated a very recent origin of homo sapiens-->Creation. See also my comments on the ZFY region (the region for which they have to postulate this nonsense).Evolutionism = science fiction. Best wishesPeter
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Peter Member (Idle past 1501 days) Posts: 2161 From: Cambridgeshire, UK. Joined: |
The question was about how YEC scientists explain the
emergence of different human 'races' given the time-frame available in the Bible. In this context your response is meaningless. The point, I feel, that was being made was that for thebest evidence+interpretation in contempory science suggests that we have 70-80,000 years to develop such differences. The relatively small variation amongst humans compared to otherspecies is more likely caused by the greater prevalance of inter-breeding in human populations ... what other organisms do you know that can count ancestors across the whole of europe, and in some cases asia and africa too?
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peter borger Member (Idle past 7687 days) Posts: 965 From: australia Joined: |
Dear Peter,
P: The relatively small variation amongst humans compared to otherspecies is more likely caused by the greater prevalance of inter-breeding in human populations ... what other organisms do you know that can count ancestors across the whole of europe, and in some cases asia and africa too? PB: I already discussed the ZFY region with Page. I've demonstrated several times what the problems are with this region, why this region is NOT explained by NDT. I was under the impression that you had read it, since you responded to my claim of NRM in this region in another thread. You are free to believe this kind of evo-nonsense (stories for the gullible), but remember it is NOT backed up by science. On the contrary. What do you think 'evo-scientists' had to invent this time now they found out about the invariant ZFY region. A mega vulcano? Get real. Think for yourself! And about your other organisms.... there are plenty. Best wishes,Peter [This message has been edited by peter borger, 01-13-2003]
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RedVento Inactive Member |
quote: I just thought the program was interesting. It tied in the notion of a "super-volcano" and what its eruption might do to life on Earth. Apparantly there is a "super-volcano" forming under Yellowstone National Park. Here are some Yellowstone supervolcano links: http://www.solcomhouse.com/yellowstone.htm http://armageddononline.tripod.com/volcano.htm NASA Lowers Sights to Predict Volcano's Eruption | Space [This message has been edited by RedVento, 01-14-2003]
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peter borger Member (Idle past 7687 days) Posts: 965 From: australia Joined: |
Dear Red Vento:
RV: I just thought the program was interesting. It tied in the notion of a "super-volcano" and what its eruption might do to life on Earth. Apparantly there is a "super-volcano" forming under Yellowstone National Park. PB: And therefore humans went through a bottleneck 70 ky BP? What happened to logic? Best wishes,Peter
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Peter Member (Idle past 1501 days) Posts: 2161 From: Cambridgeshire, UK. Joined: |
quote: Which ones? And is that ancestral from an evolutionary viewpointor from family trees? I also take it from your response that you have not consideredthe impact of human behaviours (where they differ from other animals) on the genome ... your post was dismissive, as often you are, in a way that suggests that you cannot think beyond your own narrow viewpoint. [This message has been edited by Peter, 01-15-2003]
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RedVento Inactive Member |
quote: The logic is this: The last super-volcano eruption was 70-80k years ago. Based on the a realtively fixed rate of mutation in mitochondria they can trace back the relativly few number of deviations in human mitochondria to that same time frame. The theory I believe is that the effects of a super-volcano eruption 70-80k years ago killed off a large number of early humans which is why there are such a low number of genetic differences in us today. The supervolcano eruption is the cause of the bottleneck.
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peter borger Member (Idle past 7687 days) Posts: 965 From: australia Joined: |
dear vento,
The logic is this: RV: The last super-volcano eruption was 70-80k years ago. PB: reference please RV: Based on the a realtively fixed rate of mutation in mitochondria PB: You mean the NONRANDOM mutations in mtDNA? Listen, RV, I have demonstrated recently that the mutations in mtDNA are non-random mutations. The molecular clock is very, very doubtful at the least (according to the mtDNA data human and chimp have a common ancestor 150 ky BP. Funny, isn't). I think Dr Page is making overhours at the moment to solve this little evolutonary inconvenience. RV: they can trace back the relativly few number of deviations in human mitochondria to that same time frame. PB: No they CANNOT since they CANNOT exclude non-random mutations. The whole story is based upon randomness of mutations. And since non-random mutaions have been scientifically demonstrated the whole story is invalid. PB: The theory I believe is that the effects of a super-volcano eruption 70-80k years ago killed off a large number of early humans which is why there are such a low number of genetic differences in us today. The supervolcano eruption is the cause of the bottleneck. PB: The ZFY region mutates also NON-RANDOMLY so all the conclusions from this region are completely invalid. You, indeed, have faith in science fiction. Best wishes,Peter
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RedVento Inactive Member |
quote: Every one of the links I posted referenced the last eruption, and all I said was that it was interesting. And I do have faith in people who are presented as doctors in relevant fields, rather than in a book of dubious origins and those trying to prove its validity. But that's just my opinion. Best Wishes.
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peter borger Member (Idle past 7687 days) Posts: 965 From: australia Joined: |
dear Vento,
V: Every one of the links I posted referenced the last eruption, and all I said was that it was interesting. PB: It is interesting, but it can be demonstrated based on the most recent scientific insights that the conclusions are wrong. The conclusions were based on faulty assumptions. V: And I do have faith in people who are presented as doctors in relevant fields, PB: Than you should have faith in me. V: rather than in a book of dubious origins and those trying to prove its validity. But that's just my opinion. PB: Thanks for your opinion. best wishes,Peter
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derwood Member (Idle past 1898 days) Posts: 1457 Joined: |
quote: Indeed.Notice how Borger prattles on with his dismissives regarding explanations - not only for things he claims have none in a NDT framework, but for his many erors. And, of course, the repeated accolades he implicitly heaps upon himself. One of several reasons I stopped taking Borger seriously quite a while ago.
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peter borger Member (Idle past 7687 days) Posts: 965 From: australia Joined: |
dear Dr Page,
That human and chimp are the same genus according to your brilliant analysis, was it based upon chromosome 4 or chromosome 17? Best wishes,Peter "Page knows what I mean" [This message has been edited by peter borger, 01-21-2003]
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