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Author Topic:   anti-abortion folks still get abortions
riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 151 of 301 (299179)
03-29-2006 12:40 AM
Reply to: Message 141 by macaroniandcheese
03-28-2006 6:31 PM


Re: Content, not looks or probable politics!
it's people who deal dishonestly with each other.
Sometimes through sex.
Ask you a question. Ever wonder why you even talk with me?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 141 by macaroniandcheese, posted 03-28-2006 6:31 PM macaroniandcheese has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 154 by macaroniandcheese, posted 03-29-2006 8:07 AM riVeRraT has replied

PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 152 of 301 (299196)
03-29-2006 1:52 AM
Reply to: Message 135 by riVeRraT
03-28-2006 6:05 PM


Re: Content, not looks or probable politics!
SO again you seem to be avoiding the isse.
Why is going along wiht propaganda you don't truly beleive worse than knowingly commiting a horrible crime ?
I can't see it. and you still aren't answering. All I can see is that you seem determined to claim that the more charitable judgemen should be rejecteded on the grounds that it is more charitable to accuse them of worse. Which makes no sense at all..

This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by riVeRraT, posted 03-28-2006 6:05 PM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 159 by riVeRraT, posted 03-29-2006 1:39 PM PaulK has not replied

Silent H
Member (Idle past 5819 days)
Posts: 7405
From: satellite of love
Joined: 12-11-2002


Message 153 of 301 (299210)
03-29-2006 4:01 AM
Reply to: Message 150 by riVeRraT
03-29-2006 12:39 AM


montage of rat
Here's my responses to a few of RR's musings...
If we treated the process that causes humans to exist, yourself included with half the respect of my child wearing a helmet, then people would stop having sex, unless they were married, otherwise cut your nuts, or tie your tubes.
Its amazing that you analogize forcing a person to where a helmet while riding, to stopping having sex entirely. The correct and obvious analogy would be to stop the person riding at all, if one wants people to stop having sex entirely. Or if one wants to go with the helmet, then have people take sexual precautions.
A helmet is a precaution to reduce risk. Indeed one can reduce the risk of sex to lower percentages than getting injured while riding with a helmet.
That pretty much sums up how I felt about the abortion me and my fiancee agreed upon. So I can relate. Except now I feel bad about it. It nothing more than the fact that I did an act, a selfish act of pleasure, started alife form, and then never gave it a chance.
Okay, here's the thing that I don't get. You come in here gangbusters about how it should be illegal for everyone else. Yet you then explain you and a gf have actually used it and now feel guilty.
If this is true, instead of starting with everyone else, why aren't you and your gf petitioning and demanding that you guys get locked up for murder? I mean if this is your serious belief, why not put YOUR nuts where your mouth is?
Or why not punish yourself, or allow yourself to be punished by a body of evangelicals for your crime, if the state is not willing? That is possible of course.
And you can't hand me an argument that your case should be an exception because you did it before realizing it was wrong, or that it was legal and therefore you shouldn't be punished. If you believe what you did was wrong then you still need to be punished or somehow held accountable and your should be demanding your own case be tried before those of others.
So there ya go, as far as I can tell until you make yourself the pinup boy for people that should be in prison right now for a capital crime, I really can't believe anything you say about what should happen to someone else.
Heck you don't even have to wait until Roe v Wade is overturned. It is murder according to you, right? March right down and turn yourself in to demand justice for your unborn victim.
{AbE: Or maybe I should simply ask: What do you feel should be done to you and your gf, for having had an abortion? If the answer is nothing, why shouldn't that be good for everyone else? If the answer is some form of punishment, why are you not seeking/imposing it on yourself?}
This message has been edited by holmes, 03-29-2006 10:08 AM

holmes
"Some day the piecing together of dissociated knowledge will open up such terrifying vistas of reality, and of our frightful position therein, that we shall either go mad from the revelation or flee from the light into the peace and safety of a new dark age." (Lovecraft)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 150 by riVeRraT, posted 03-29-2006 12:39 AM riVeRraT has not replied

macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 154 of 301 (299262)
03-29-2006 8:07 AM
Reply to: Message 151 by riVeRraT
03-29-2006 12:40 AM


Re: Content, not looks or probable politics!
because i used to be a fundie.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 151 by riVeRraT, posted 03-29-2006 12:40 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 160 by riVeRraT, posted 03-29-2006 1:40 PM macaroniandcheese has not replied

macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 155 of 301 (299264)
03-29-2006 8:16 AM
Reply to: Message 147 by riVeRraT
03-29-2006 12:27 AM


So I make them where a helmet, so that won't happen. Cause if they hurt there head, they could not just go and get an abortion and make it all better.
If we treated the process that causes humans to exist, yourself included with half the respect of my child wearing a helmet, then people would stop having sex, unless they were married, otherwise cut your nuts, or tie your tubes.
BTW, abortion is a risky medical procedure also, but that one is ok, because it's not as bad.
Give me a break.
when i have sex, i wear a helmet. i am on the pill and we always use condoms. i only have sex with one person and i have been tested and he... didn't need to be lol. if something crazy happens and i feel off the next day, i'll go get plan b. if that doesn't work, thank constitution, i have other options. it's none of anyone's business if i'm having sex and it's no one's business except my doctor if i have an abortion.
you can still hurt your head while wearing a helmet. and that's what doctors are for. but most anti-choice people are against helmets. they don't want sex-ed in schools, they don't want condoms available, they're trying to outlaw birth control and are trying to get insurance companies to stop covering it. they've gotten some pharmacists to stop selling it. it's criminal. what about married women who don't want to have babies but don't want to throw themselves into menopause?
it's not about sex, it's not about marriage, it's about women being free from men ruling their lives. and you crazy people don't want us to have an ounce.
*edit* cray to crazy in the last line
This message has been edited by brennakimi, 03-29-2006 01:09 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 147 by riVeRraT, posted 03-29-2006 12:27 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 157 by Wounded King, posted 03-29-2006 9:51 AM macaroniandcheese has replied
 Message 161 by riVeRraT, posted 03-29-2006 1:47 PM macaroniandcheese has replied

macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 156 of 301 (299265)
03-29-2006 8:17 AM
Reply to: Message 146 by riVeRraT
03-29-2006 12:23 AM


Re: what's the difference between a pile of dead babies and a ferarri?
yes well. i like fucking so i'm not going to. instead, i'm going to do what's right and try to keep you and the other crazies out of my medical records.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 146 by riVeRraT, posted 03-29-2006 12:23 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 162 by riVeRraT, posted 03-29-2006 1:48 PM macaroniandcheese has replied

Wounded King
Member
Posts: 4149
From: Cincinnati, Ohio, USA
Joined: 04-09-2003


Message 157 of 301 (299277)
03-29-2006 9:51 AM
Reply to: Message 155 by macaroniandcheese
03-29-2006 8:16 AM


it's about women being free from men ruling their lives. and you cray people don't want us to have an ounce.
Yes, damn them and their little carapaced legs!! I reckon your Cray people are in league with David Icke's Lizard people and possibly Alexei Sayle's Fish people.
TTFN,
WK

This message is a reply to:
 Message 155 by macaroniandcheese, posted 03-29-2006 8:16 AM macaroniandcheese has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 158 by macaroniandcheese, posted 03-29-2006 1:10 PM Wounded King has not replied

macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 158 of 301 (299355)
03-29-2006 1:10 PM
Reply to: Message 157 by Wounded King
03-29-2006 9:51 AM



This message is a reply to:
 Message 157 by Wounded King, posted 03-29-2006 9:51 AM Wounded King has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 159 of 301 (299360)
03-29-2006 1:39 PM
Reply to: Message 152 by PaulK
03-29-2006 1:52 AM


Re: Content, not looks or probable politics!
Dude, I totally do not understand you.
someone translate for me, so I can answer him, I do want to give you a valid answer, but the way you word things, I guess I am just not getting it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 152 by PaulK, posted 03-29-2006 1:52 AM PaulK has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 160 of 301 (299361)
03-29-2006 1:40 PM
Reply to: Message 154 by macaroniandcheese
03-29-2006 8:07 AM


Re: Content, not looks or probable politics!
I never was one, or am I one now.
It's too bad you think I am.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 154 by macaroniandcheese, posted 03-29-2006 8:07 AM macaroniandcheese has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 161 of 301 (299365)
03-29-2006 1:47 PM
Reply to: Message 155 by macaroniandcheese
03-29-2006 8:16 AM


it's none of anyone's business if i'm having sex and it's no one's business except my doctor if i have an abortion.
It sure is someones business, the life you create.
But it is not mine, if you want to take risks, thats your business.
It seems that quite a few people in here are with the idea, that as long as all party's involved consent, then it's ok. i.e. being gay, etc.
If your fetus could talk, would it say, ok, kill me, I don't want to live? And I don't want to hear about the development of a baby in the womb.
but most anti-choice people are against helmets. they don't want sex-ed in schools, they don't want condoms available, they're trying to outlaw birth control and are trying to get insurance companies to stop covering it. they've gotten some pharmacists to stop selling it. it's criminal. what about married women who don't want to have babies but don't want to throw themselves into menopause?
I am for all that, it doesn't bother me. But none of that excludes you from the possibility that a life form may begin to exist. So it's a chance, just like wearing a helmet.
I am not anti-choice, I am pro-choice. Choose whether to have sex or not.
it's not about sex, it's not about marriage, it's about women being free from men ruling their lives. and you crazy people don't want us to have an ounce.
what the hell does men ruling your life have to do with it?
You want to rule over the life that might start developing in your womb, does that make you a hypocrite?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 155 by macaroniandcheese, posted 03-29-2006 8:16 AM macaroniandcheese has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 163 by macaroniandcheese, posted 03-29-2006 2:08 PM riVeRraT has replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 162 of 301 (299366)
03-29-2006 1:48 PM
Reply to: Message 156 by macaroniandcheese
03-29-2006 8:17 AM


Re: what's the difference between a pile of dead babies and a ferarri?
The risk is yours, not mine or the life you create.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 156 by macaroniandcheese, posted 03-29-2006 8:17 AM macaroniandcheese has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 164 by macaroniandcheese, posted 03-29-2006 2:11 PM riVeRraT has not replied

macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 163 of 301 (299372)
03-29-2006 2:08 PM
Reply to: Message 161 by riVeRraT
03-29-2006 1:47 PM


there is no life until it can survive on it's own.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 161 by riVeRraT, posted 03-29-2006 1:47 PM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 167 by riVeRraT, posted 03-30-2006 8:26 AM macaroniandcheese has replied

macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3927 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 164 of 301 (299373)
03-29-2006 2:11 PM
Reply to: Message 162 by riVeRraT
03-29-2006 1:48 PM


Re: what's the difference between a pile of dead babies and a ferarri?
yes. the risk is mine. and i take it. but congress needs to butt out.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 162 by riVeRraT, posted 03-29-2006 1:48 PM riVeRraT has not replied

Firebird
Inactive Member


Message 165 of 301 (299501)
03-29-2006 10:38 PM
Reply to: Message 150 by riVeRraT
03-29-2006 12:39 AM


Re: How could they?
The title speaks for itself
So long as it’s clear that it relates to the women returning to the picket lines!
Except now I feel bad about it. It nothing more than the fact that I did an act, a selfish act of pleasure, started alife form, and then never gave it a chance.
It’s hard, For me too, the decisions I’ve regretted most were the ones made for selfish reasons.
You say you do not feel bad about it? You never even think about what that child might have been like? Could have been your best friend in the whole world, who loved you until your death bed.
Could also have been a serial axe killer! I do believe that introducing emotional appeals confuses these difficult subjects further.
If there is “life before life”, I would feel bad for disappointing a soul that wanted to be born. Sort of like an employer who offered work and raised a lot of hopes, then withdrew the position. But not like murder, because whether or not there is awareness before life, it would not be extinguished by a termination.
I feel guilty (sort of cringing) when I remember the circumstances under which I became pregnant. Looking back, the decision to terminate was the first time I really took responsibility. Before that time, I would have made a very poor parent! As for having been anti-abortion, I was simply nave, and didn’t try to impose my views, so no guilt there.
From post 161 to brennakimi
If your fetus could talk, would it say, ok, kill me, I don't want to live?
If a diseased limb could talk, would it ask to be amputated? Are you a vegetarian?
I find it very hard to understand their thinking too, that is why I will not judge them. There is more than one issue going on there, and it may not even have anything to do with just abortion
Here I completely agree with you
Finally, you indicated (in other posts) support for abortions based on medical grounds. And to me that’s as inconsistent with the quotes above as the women in the OP article. If an abortion is the same as murdering a baby, shouldn’ t the mother be prepared to risk her health to let it live?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 150 by riVeRraT, posted 03-29-2006 12:39 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 169 by riVeRraT, posted 03-30-2006 8:35 AM Firebird has replied

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