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Author Topic:   anti-abortion folks still get abortions
riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 271 of 301 (300713)
04-03-2006 7:13 PM
Reply to: Message 267 by Dan Carroll
04-03-2006 5:51 PM


Re: By request, I want out.
Good thing we're not making the same point, then. The point I'm making is that you don't know enough about biology or medicine to speak with authority on the subject.
Since nothing is proven in science, so I guess no-one is.
Where in that nine-month span would you place it?
TO me, it's when that sperm makes it into the egg.
Birth control and abortion cut it off before it happens. So what's your point?
Birth control cuts it off before it happens, abortion just cuts it off after it happens. Isn't this what it all comes down to?
Look, lets drop all the BS. I said this before, and I will say it again, here is my rant, viewpoint, principal, moral, logic, whatever you want to call it.
Whether we got here from God, or from alien beings, or chance, we owe our very existance to the process which is ferterlization, sex, intercourse, whatever you want to call it. To interfere with it, to me is just wrong.
You can bring up any points you want about it, and yes, I agree it can be looked at from many views, but that doesn't make it right or wrong.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 267 by Dan Carroll, posted 04-03-2006 5:51 PM Dan Carroll has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 276 by Dan Carroll, posted 04-03-2006 8:39 PM riVeRraT has replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 272 of 301 (300714)
04-03-2006 7:17 PM
Reply to: Message 270 by nator
04-03-2006 6:42 PM


Re: please tell me what you think, rat.
No, I didn't. I did take your word for it though. At least I do not think you are a liar, and your intentions are always good when talking to me.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 270 by nator, posted 04-03-2006 6:42 PM nator has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 273 of 301 (300715)
04-03-2006 7:18 PM
Reply to: Message 269 by nator
04-03-2006 6:33 PM


Re: By request, I want out.
Using your logic, everybody everywhere should be having as many children as possible because of all the good that might be done by all of them.
No, I didn't say that, I said it doesn't matter what they turn into. It's life that is precious.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 269 by nator, posted 04-03-2006 6:33 PM nator has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 274 of 301 (300720)
04-03-2006 7:37 PM
Reply to: Message 268 by nator
04-03-2006 6:28 PM


Re: By request, I want out.
So...
you think that life starts after implantation?
Or, does it start at conception?
Why do we even burden ourselves with that decision? Isn't the act of intercourse that starts the whole thing? Isn't it clear where the liability falls?
If the sperm doesn't make it there, then it doesn't happen.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 268 by nator, posted 04-03-2006 6:28 PM nator has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 275 by Chiroptera, posted 04-03-2006 8:08 PM riVeRraT has replied

Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 275 of 301 (300726)
04-03-2006 8:08 PM
Reply to: Message 274 by riVeRraT
04-03-2006 7:37 PM


Re: By request, I want out.
quote:
Why do we even burden ourselves with that decision? Isn't the act of intercourse that starts the whole thing? Isn't it clear where the liability falls?
There is nothing wrong with intercourse, there is nothing wrong with being pregnant, and there is nothing wrong with terminating an unwanted pregnancy. The "burden" of deciding when "life" starts is, indeed, and unnecessary burden, and it is not clear that there is any liability for anything.

"Religion is the best business to be in. It's the only one where the customers blame themselves for product failure."
-- Ellis Weiner (quoted on the NAiG message board)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 274 by riVeRraT, posted 04-03-2006 7:37 PM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 278 by riVeRraT, posted 04-04-2006 7:52 AM Chiroptera has not replied

Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 276 of 301 (300731)
04-03-2006 8:39 PM
Reply to: Message 271 by riVeRraT
04-03-2006 7:13 PM


Re: By request, I want out.
Since nothing is proven in science, so I guess no-one is.
What an enormous cop-out. You're now saying that because nothing is proven in science, you have as much medical expertise as a doctor?
TO me, it's when that sperm makes it into the egg.
And that is based on...?
Birth control cuts it off before it happens, abortion just cuts it off after it happens. Isn't this what it all comes down to?
That's what you say; there's a difference. And again, you're speaking from the stance of a man without enough medical knowledge to tell a rat from a human.
Whether we got here from God, or from alien beings, or chance, we owe our very existance to the process which is ferterlization, sex, intercourse, whatever you want to call it. To interfere with it, to me is just wrong.
So again, should we be forcibly inseminating women? Every time that uterine lining collapses, we're interfering with possible fertilization!

"We had survived to turn on the History Channel
And ask our esteemed panel, Why are we alive? And here's how they replied:
You're what happens when two substances collide
And by all accounts you really should have died."
-Andrew Bird

This message is a reply to:
 Message 271 by riVeRraT, posted 04-03-2006 7:13 PM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 277 by kjsimons, posted 04-03-2006 8:45 PM Dan Carroll has not replied
 Message 279 by riVeRraT, posted 04-04-2006 7:59 AM Dan Carroll has replied

kjsimons
Member
Posts: 821
From: Orlando,FL
Joined: 06-17-2003
Member Rating: 6.7


Message 277 of 301 (300735)
04-03-2006 8:45 PM
Reply to: Message 276 by Dan Carroll
04-03-2006 8:39 PM


Re: By request, I want out.
Everyone now!
"Every sperm is sacred, every sperm is great, ...."
Every Sperm Is Sacred Lyrics by Monty Python

This message is a reply to:
 Message 276 by Dan Carroll, posted 04-03-2006 8:39 PM Dan Carroll has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 278 of 301 (300795)
04-04-2006 7:52 AM
Reply to: Message 275 by Chiroptera
04-03-2006 8:08 PM


Re: By request, I want out.
There is nothing wrong with intercourse,
There can be..
there is nothing wrong with being pregnant,
There can be..
and there is nothing wrong with terminating an unwanted pregnancy.
There can be..
The "burden" of deciding when "life" starts is, indeed, and unnecessary burden, and it is not clear that there is any liability for anything.
No liability?
That's a lie.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 275 by Chiroptera, posted 04-03-2006 8:08 PM Chiroptera has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 279 of 301 (300796)
04-04-2006 7:59 AM
Reply to: Message 276 by Dan Carroll
04-03-2006 8:39 PM


Re: By request, I want out.
What an enormous cop-out. You're now saying that because nothing is proven in science, you have as much medical expertise as a doctor?
Way to twist some words, typical. There is no way you should have thought that I meant that, especially when I said back in message Message 256 that I am not a doctor.
So why would you twist my words around to say something that I clearly did not mean? There can be only two reasons for doing it, and it has nothing to do with abortion.
I am sick and tired of people taking things out of context in this forum, it is such a bad display of irrational thought, illogical thinking, and just poor taste. Go ahead a rationalize the world away, maybe if you try hard enough you will be able to fly.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 276 by Dan Carroll, posted 04-03-2006 8:39 PM Dan Carroll has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 280 by crashfrog, posted 04-04-2006 9:21 AM riVeRraT has replied
 Message 281 by Dan Carroll, posted 04-04-2006 9:47 AM riVeRraT has replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1467 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 280 of 301 (300814)
04-04-2006 9:21 AM
Reply to: Message 279 by riVeRraT
04-04-2006 7:59 AM


Re: By request, I want out.
Way to twist some words, typical. There is no way you should have thought that I meant that, especially when I said back in message Re: By request, I want out. (Message 256) that I am not a doctor.
But that's exactly what you said. Nice try.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 279 by riVeRraT, posted 04-04-2006 7:59 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 282 by riVeRraT, posted 04-04-2006 10:00 AM crashfrog has not replied

Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 281 of 301 (300826)
04-04-2006 9:47 AM
Reply to: Message 279 by riVeRraT
04-04-2006 7:59 AM


Re: By request, I want out.
I am sick and tired of people taking things out of context in this forum
Fair deal. Here's the context:
Dan writes:
The point I'm making is that you don't know enough about biology or medicine to speak with authority on the subject.
riVeRraT writes:
Since nothing is proven in science, so I guess no-one is.
Dan writes:
You're now saying that because nothing is proven in science, you have as much medical expertise as a doctor?
riVeRraT writes:
Way to twist some words, typical.
You say that because nothing is proven in science, no one knows enough to speak with authority on the subject, thus putting yourself on equal footing with a doctor when it comes to biology and medicine.
If that's not what you meant, then you're gonna have to walk me through your real meaning, here. Because seriously, I'm having trouble seeing how it can be read any other way.
This message has been edited by [Dan's Clever Alias], 04-04-2006 09:49 AM

"We had survived to turn on the History Channel
And ask our esteemed panel, Why are we alive? And here's how they replied:
You're what happens when two substances collide
And by all accounts you really should have died."
-Andrew Bird

This message is a reply to:
 Message 279 by riVeRraT, posted 04-04-2006 7:59 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 283 by riVeRraT, posted 04-04-2006 10:01 AM Dan Carroll has replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 282 of 301 (300829)
04-04-2006 10:00 AM
Reply to: Message 280 by crashfrog
04-04-2006 9:21 AM


Re: By request, I want out.
But that's exactly what you said. Nice try.
???????? What did I say?
I am a doctor, or I am not a doctor?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 280 by crashfrog, posted 04-04-2006 9:21 AM crashfrog has not replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 283 of 301 (300830)
04-04-2006 10:01 AM
Reply to: Message 281 by Dan Carroll
04-04-2006 9:47 AM


Re: By request, I want out.
thus putting yourself on equal footing with a doctor when it comes to biology and medicine.
Those are your words, not mine.
Medicine is always correct, right?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 281 by Dan Carroll, posted 04-04-2006 9:47 AM Dan Carroll has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 284 by Dan Carroll, posted 04-04-2006 10:09 AM riVeRraT has replied

Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 284 of 301 (300832)
04-04-2006 10:09 AM
Reply to: Message 283 by riVeRraT
04-04-2006 10:01 AM


Re: By request, I want out.
Those are your words, not mine.
Then walk me through what you really meant. Because as it stands, there's no other way to read it.
Medicine is always correct, right?
Nope. But someone who knows a thing or two about a subject is capable of making a much more informed decision than someone who doesn't.

"We had survived to turn on the History Channel
And ask our esteemed panel, Why are we alive? And here's how they replied:
You're what happens when two substances collide
And by all accounts you really should have died."
-Andrew Bird

This message is a reply to:
 Message 283 by riVeRraT, posted 04-04-2006 10:01 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 285 by riVeRraT, posted 04-04-2006 10:36 AM Dan Carroll has replied

riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 285 of 301 (300839)
04-04-2006 10:36 AM
Reply to: Message 284 by Dan Carroll
04-04-2006 10:09 AM


Re: By request, I want out.
Nope. But someone who knows a thing or two about a subject is capable of making a much more informed decision than someone who doesn't.
Just what exactly are the odds?
Is life an objective decision, or a subjective one?
Even doctors would agree that a fetus is objectively alive.
Unless you are trying to determine when a soul is activated? I am pretty sure you do not believe in the concept of the soul.
Just what exactly are the criteria for something to be human?
You will always be dan, whether your 1 year old, or 90.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 284 by Dan Carroll, posted 04-04-2006 10:09 AM Dan Carroll has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 286 by Dan Carroll, posted 04-04-2006 10:50 AM riVeRraT has replied
 Message 287 by Silent H, posted 04-04-2006 10:56 AM riVeRraT has replied

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