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Author Topic:   The Results are in...There is a God! - What now?
mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4755
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 13 of 159 (303627)
04-12-2006 5:43 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by U can call me Cookie
04-12-2006 9:24 AM


Simply due to...well, look at the state of the world, not much happiness, cheer and goodwill to go around; at least not what you would expect if a benevolent God was in charge
Well, people are not benevolent. The NT says that only God is good.
I don't expect that the world is good when I watch people who are not, and they're well, in the world.
It's like a garden. I expect if there's a gardener, it will be kept perfect, but if weeds grow, should I expect it to be always perfect if the gardener kills them yet they insist on growing? If the weeds insist on growing despite the gardener's attempts with weed-killer, then I suppose he will give up and make a new garden. He might even move a few good plants into his new garden.
I expect nothing from God, because his miracles suffice. I am alive and the sun shines, which is enough for me to expect that he exists, because all is good when the sun is on your face and there is no evil around. I wonder why?
If God is in control, is that the sort of God you would want to worship? Should God actually be worshipped at all?
But worshipping God would lead to a peaceful world. As far as I can see, it's the none worshippers that aren't interested in God and his ways, which are peace, patience, longsuffering, forgiveness.
If people aren't interested in good/God, then infact it's the Godless that are what make the planet Godless. For a violent person surely doesn't observe these good attributes God has, nor does he seek them.
It's always the same. God gets the blame.
A man goes to court for his crimes and blames the judge for not stopping him from commiting them. Yet is God not in control, if everybody EVENTUALLY gets justice?
If God is patient and longsuffering, then his ways aren't forceful. So I expect that God is clever enough to know what he is getting into if he makes a garden.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by U can call me Cookie, posted 04-12-2006 9:24 AM U can call me Cookie has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 14 by RAZD, posted 04-12-2006 10:13 PM mike the wiz has replied
 Message 15 by U can call me Cookie, posted 04-13-2006 4:19 AM mike the wiz has replied
 Message 61 by Brad McFall, posted 04-16-2006 2:35 PM mike the wiz has replied

  
mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4755
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 59 of 159 (304624)
04-16-2006 2:22 PM
Reply to: Message 15 by U can call me Cookie
04-13-2006 4:19 AM


People aren't the only things responsible for causing pain and suffering. Last time i checked, drought, famine, and disease did a pretty good job of it as well. Not to mention a tsunami or two.
Okay then, you win. People and nature.
So its "Worship me, or I won't let you into my all-new, all-improved
garden"?
No. You mentioned worship in the O.P. Not me.
Infact, I think if you have no sin and forgiveness of sins, then yu are allowed in, as far as I can read in the bible.
As RAZD pointed out, religion has resulted in war and divisiveness for millenia.
I didn't mentione religion.
Under the following premisses,(if we assume these are fact) God is not religion;
God created the universe
We are part of the universe who came to know God.
Non-religious people do bad things and good things. Religious people do bad things and good things. One cannot credit religion with only good things
I agree that none religious and religious people do good and bad.
My statement infact said that those who do Godless things must be Godless.(I should have clarified that, my apologies).
Since the things of God are goodness, then the Godless are the ones who do bad (but this doesn't mean the Godless will be bad elementally~).
According to my wisdom, those who act Godlessly are unbelievers, because they can't have God with them(Holy spirit), if they are focusing on evil things. That goes for anyone, claimant believer or none believer.
This doesn't mean that none believers are Godless violent nutbars, as that would affirm the consequent and thus be fallacious. Infact many atheist, if not most, might not be entirely Godless, and might be peaceful.
But ofcourse, it is obvious that if you act Godlessly then you don't have any regard for the ways of God. I don't see how that doesn't follow.
If a thug is beating me about my bonce, he cannot surely hold the ways of God as his upmost priority, otherwise he wouldn't be doing it.
What I'm talking about, is TRUTH. NOT logic. Don't mistake what I talk about for logic. No, I am under the premise that there will be people who are of the truth and people who aren't, otherwise I wouldn't be a believer would I?
If I believed violent people were of the truth, then other believers would think me mad. So ofcourse I believe that God is a God of peace and that those who are contrary to peace, are not of God. I believe this remember, but under my own premisses, I am correct.
Basically I'm saying, "If my wisdom is true....then, this that and the other".
TTFN.
This message has been edited by mike the wiz, 04-16-2006 02:40 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by U can call me Cookie, posted 04-13-2006 4:19 AM U can call me Cookie has not replied

  
mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4755
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 60 of 159 (304626)
04-16-2006 2:29 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by RAZD
04-12-2006 10:13 PM


I'm not talking about the religious. Sure, the religious have religious war tally high.
But those who are of the truth Christ spoke about, are not these people.
I am ASSUMING that my own wisdom is true. If it is true then there is a genuine person of the truth, and one who isn't. Under this wisdom, all those religious people are not of the truth, because their actions contradict peace. (Please read my previous post and really take it in. I'm sure you'll see that my framework WOULD be valid. Since I can't prove God, hence the "would").

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by RAZD, posted 04-12-2006 10:13 PM RAZD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 70 by RAZD, posted 04-20-2006 8:48 PM mike the wiz has not replied

  
mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4755
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 62 of 159 (304629)
04-16-2006 2:49 PM
Reply to: Message 61 by Brad McFall
04-16-2006 2:35 PM


Re: who's IN the world?
Is this a yo-yo faith we see in Brad.
If it is you're not the only one. I admitt that the very world can seem Godless but Christ says it is doesn't he.
I think people just forget how good Christ is at giving correct answers so they find themselves on a path of disbelief, or neither hot nor cold. I only yo-yo once and that has been totally exaggerated as some major conversion to naturalism.
The Christ wisdom is correct hypothetically, the theology is logically sound. But people want evidence, so answers aren't enough even if we have good answers.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 61 by Brad McFall, posted 04-16-2006 2:35 PM Brad McFall has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 65 by Brad McFall, posted 04-17-2006 7:46 AM mike the wiz has not replied

  
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